1911 Reliability: MIM/Cast vs. Machined

[Balanced]

Hi, guys. I am trying to understand what makes a 1911 more or less reliable.

If a production 1911 with metal injected (MIM) and/or cast parts is maintained properly and tuned by a competent gunsmith, will it be just as reliable as a semi-custom 1911 with only machined parts?

For example, will a [Kimber/Colt/Springfield Armory] 1911 that is maintained properly and tuned by a competent gunsmith be just as reliable as a [Nighthawk Custom/Wilson Combat] 1911?

Why or why not?

Thank you, guys! I really appreciate your insight.

[Robert1234]

Custom and semi-custom generally have less issues because they are built in small numbers by competent craftsmen.

Anything mass produced is likely to have a percentage of product with issues.

That said, mass produced does not automatically mean flawed. I have a Kimber Custom II bought in 2001 with 15-20k rounds th rough it and never had an issue with it. I've modified the crap out of it but the hammer, sear, disconnector and the rest of the lower parts are stock. It just keeps running. Also got a Les Baer that has never given me a lick of trouble.

Springfield has a great customer service rep. Think about that. It means a LOT of people needed their CS. To their credit they kept customers happy. And that makes these same customers loyal (and rightly so).

A lot of what people complain about with new guns wouldn't be issues to those with experience working on and shooting 1911 guns. Recoil springs, sight adjustments, etc. are issues I'd fix myself rather than send a gun back to the mfr for. You don't need to be a gunsmith, just mechanically apt and have access to YouTube.

I don't mean to denigrate those who prefer to have someone repair their guns, or those who expect something that cost upwards of $1,000.00 or more to work (I'm in that camp as well), just noting that it's often easier to fix small issues if you can than to deal with the mfr.

[Over It]

Great write up with photos....

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1128057

[Fishslayer]

Nothing wrong with MIM stuff. Ruger uses loads of MIM parts & the fanbois are always on (and on... and on... and on... ) about how rugged & unbreakable they are.

[Snoopy47]

I've had aMIM extractor break on me. One can't "tune" out metal failure

[Ronin2]

I don't know that MIM is any less reliable than non MIM if the parts are correctly engineered for the stress they will encounter.

Its more a matter telltale sign of a "commitment to quality" or lack thereof by a manufacturer that gets everyone attention.

[Fishslayer]

I've had aMIM extractor break on me. One can't "tune" out metal failure

Yup... Mossberg MVP. I would think that would be one part not really suited to the material.

Its more a matter telltale sign of a "commitment to quality" or lack thereof by a manufacturer that gets everyone attention.

Yup. After my experience with Mossberg's customer non service I won't touch one of their products again...

[Ant45]

MIM is only as good as the quality control just like any non MIM parts. Cars, planes, trains, trucks, and on and on use MIM parts. The internet has overblown this issue.

[Snoopy47]

MIM is only as good as the quality control just like any non MIM parts. Cars, planes, trains, trucks, and on and on use MIM parts. The internet has overblown this issue.

I wouldn't hesitate to have MIM parts in the internal small parts.

I've only seen them break in my 1911, my friend's 1911, and other's when used as the extractor. That's the one place things kind of take a pounding.

[Ronin2]

I wouldn't hesitate to have MIM parts in the internal small parts.

I've only seen them break in my 1911, my friend's 1911, and other's when used as the extractor. That's the one place things kind of take a pounding.

Extractors should always be made of tool/spring steel .....

[bountyhunter]

Nothing wrong with MIM stuff.

Nothing INHERENTLY wrong with well made MIM parts... but many are not well made. Also, MIM as a process is a poor choice for long thin pieces because minor defects can cause catastrophic failure. My main gripe about MIM parts is they are horribly ugle (smith wesson hammers and triggers).

[bountyhunter]

Extractors should always be made of tool/spring steel .....

And parts like safety levers or any thin piece subject to a lot of stress should be tool steel.

[bountyhunter]

MIM is only as good as the quality control just like any non MIM parts.

True, but parts machined from stock will likely break during the process if the material has a defect. Cast and MIM parts are not stressed until you put them into service which means any defects show up then.

[bountyhunter]

I don't know that MIM is any less reliable than non MIM if the parts are correctly engineered for the stress they will encounter.

MIM is even used in aircraft parts but with first rate quality control (X-rayed for internal defects). MIM itself is not evil but it was implemented to save money which means there is no QC at all.

[JDay]

Jet turbines on commercial aircraft have many MIM parts in them. Think about that.