Class III

[dc2allday]

How does one in a free state Purchase a Sbr or a can? I've heard of setting up a trust. What is it? How does it work? What about the tax stamp? What is it and how does one go about it?

[dc2allday]

Paging Librarian....

[Quiet]

What type of Title 2 firearm are you looking to acquire?


FYI. No such thing as a Class 3 item.

Two Titles of firearms.
Title 1 = handgun, rifle, shotgun, other
Title 2 = AOW, DD, MG, NS, SBR, SBS

Three Classes of SOT.
Class 1 = importer of Title 2 firearms
Class 2 = manufacturer of Title 2 firearms
Class 3 = dealer of Title 2 firearms

Since most people interact with a Class 3 SOT to obtain Title 2 firearms, people mistakenly think Title 2 firearm are Class 3 items.

[dc2allday]

Updated op

[pdsmith505]

My experience, in the state of VA went something like this:

Decided I wanted to build a suppressor. Most of the steps would have been the same if I simply wanted to buy a suppressor.

Looked at the differences between setting up a trust and simply putting in my Form 1 (to "make" an NFA item) as an individual.
1) Wife could have legal possession of the suppressor with a trust, but not with an individual Form 1.
2) Did not have to obtain Chief LEO approval with a trust, had to with an individual Form 1.
3) Did not have to submit fingerprints or a photo with a trust, had to with an individual Form 1.

Based on those three points, I set out to find an affordable trust from a Lawyer in VA. Found one for $100.

Trust established and notarized, I submitted the Form 1 via ATF's eFile, along with the $200 tax payment. Form 1 contained the following information:
1) Trust name and location
2) Model and serial number I wanted to assign to the suppressor.
3) Length of suppressor
4) Caliber of suppressor
5) My signature as Trustee

Form 1 approved in approximately 45 days (the eFile wait is now in the 3-4 month range I believe). On eFile forms the "stamp" is simply an image on the PDF they send you. On paper forms, the "stamp" is a no-**** stamp applied to the form.

Added the suppressor to the trust.

Obtained and built the parts required for my suppressor. Assembled suppressor. Etched trust name, city, and state as well as suppressor's model name, serial number and caliber on the tube of the suppressor.

Profit!




If purchasing an NFA item, one would find a dealer in your state licenced for such items and purchase it. Then, a Form 4 would have be used to "transfer" the item from the dealer to yourself or your trust. The item will remain in the dealer's possession until the Form 4 is approved, at which point you are free to take possession.

The common theme between Form 1 and Form 4 is that you do not possess the item until you receive your approved Form back with the stamp affixed. When "making" my suppressor, I chose to not even have the necessary parts prior to having my approved form back. For an SBR, I would most likely have already built the SBR as a pistol, and bought a stock once I had the approved form back.

There are other paths with their own complexities, such as purchasing a dealer from another state (who would transfer the item to the dealer in your state), etc.

And, just for fun, 'cause I've painted it since that photo:

[Quiet]

Basically...
1. Find a FFL/SOT dealer that will facilitate the transfer.
2. Buy the Title 2 firearm. (you pay for it and the FFL/SOT holds it, until you are approved)
3. You submit a Form 4 with $200 to the BATFE NFA branch.
3a. If you submit as an individual, you will need the CLEO of your city/county to sign off on your Form 4.
3b. If you submit as a trust or corporation, you do not need a CLEO sign off.
4. Wait for the Feds to do a background check and process your Form 4.
5. If approved, BATFE will mail you a $200 tax stamp with your approved Form 4.
6. You take your approved Form 4 and $200 tax stamp to the FFL/SOT, who then completes the transfer (4473/NICS) of the Title 2 firearm.

[dc2allday]

Thanks all

[thetaxman]

All very easy. I run mine through one of my LLC's as opposed to the trust route.

Usually approved in 90 days. 4473 then done the same way as a firearm. About 5 minutes to do all of that and walk out the door with the NFA item.

I'm going to have to build a suppressor now.......

[audiophil2]

Basically...
1. Find a FFL/SOT dealer that will facilitate the transfer.
2. Buy the Title 2 firearm. (you pay for it and the FFL/SOT holds it, until you are approved)
3. You submit a Form 4 with $200 to the BATFE NFA branch.
3a. If you submit as an individual, you will need the CLEO of your city/county to sign off on your Form 4.
3b. If you submit as a trust or corporation, you do not need a CLEO sign off.
4. Wait for the Feds to do a background check and process your Form 4.
5. If approved, BATFE will mail you a $200 tax stamp with your approved Form 4.
6. You take your approved Form 4 and $200 tax stamp to the FFL/SOT, who then completes the transfer (4473/NICS) of the Title 2 firearm.

I've never had a customer walk in with an approved FORM 4 from the ATF. It has always gone to the transferor as stated on page 5 of ATF FORM 4.

[Mr. Beretta]

Basically...
1. Find a FFL/SOT dealer that will facilitate the transfer.
2. Buy the Title 2 firearm. (you pay for it and the FFL/SOT holds it, until you are approved)
3. You submit a Form 4 with $200 to the BATFE NFA branch.
3a. If you submit as an individual, you will need the CLEO of your city/county to sign off on your Form 4.
3b. If you submit as a trust or corporation, you do not need a CLEO sign off.
4. Wait for the Feds to do a background check and process your Form 4.
5. If approved, BATFE will mail you a $200 tax stamp with your approved Form 4.
6. You take your approved Form 4 and $200 tax stamp to the FFL/SOT, who then completes the transfer (4473/NICS) of the Title 2 firearm.

Quiet

You would know if this FUD or true.

Prior to approving the Form 4, etc....BATF requires the individual grant BATF permission to check for the Title 2 weapon anytime, day or night. Essentially, forfeiting the individual's 4th Amendment rights in regards to the Title 2 weapon. Also the individual must provide the location where the Title 2 weapon is store as well as how it is secured (safe, etc.?)

Thanks!

[russ69]

How does one in a free state Purchase a Sbr or a can?...

Basically...
1. Find a FFL/SOT dealer that will facilitate the transfer....

That is really all it takes (in a free state).

[dustoff31]

Quiet

You would know if this FUD or true.

Prior to approving the Form 4, etc....BATF requires the individual grant BATF permission to check for the Title 2 weapon anytime, day or night. Essentially, forfeiting the individual's 4th Amendment rights in regards to the Title 2 weapon. Also the individual must provide the location where the Title 2 weapon is store as well as how it is secured (safe, etc.?)

Thanks!

This is absolute nonsense. You are paying a tax, not getting an FFL.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2015/04/jeremy-s/the-truth-about-nfa-inspection/

[Mr. Beretta]

This is absolute nonsense. You are paying a tax, not getting an FFL.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...fa-inspection/

Yep.....That's what I figured.

It seems a little over the top but the "expert" who told me this was convinced these tings took place.

Thanks for the clarification!