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can and does the ATF make laws

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  • takto101
    Junior Member
    • Dec 2013
    • 6

    can and does the ATF make laws

    can and does the ATF make laws???

    if do can some one post a link with some info on it...

    i would like info wether thay can or cant.

    thanks
  • #2
    ke6guj
    Moderator
    CGN Contributor - Lifetime
    • Nov 2003
    • 23725

    they can't make "laws", only congress can make laws that the president signs.

    however, they do have the power to write regulations to support those laws.
    Jack



    Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

    No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.

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    • #3
      protohyp
      Vendor/Retailer
      • Sep 2014
      • 3349

      They have been know to make statements that people interpret as law. Then it gets spread around forums like this and turned into FUD and everyone throws in their interpretation of said statement.
      MESSAGE ME FOR ARMAGLOCK COUPON CODES!!!!
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      • #4
        odysseus
        I need a LIFE!!
        • Dec 2005
        • 10407

        Defined:

        "Just leave me alone, I know what to do." - Kimi Raikkonen

        The moment the idea is admitted into society, that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence.' and that `Property is surely a right of mankind as real as liberty.'
        - John Adams

        http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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        • #5
          Librarian
          Admin and Poltergeist
          CGN Contributor - Lifetime
          • Oct 2005
          • 44652

          Originally posted by ke6guj
          they can't make "laws", only congress can make laws that the president signs.

          however, they do have the power to write regulations to support those laws.
          And violating those regulations can be and has been used to initiate prosecution.
          ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page

          Frozen in 2015, it is falling out of date and I can no longer edit the content. But much of it is still good!

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          • #6
            Victor Cachat
            Senior Member
            • Apr 2014
            • 1546

            All administrative agencies make regulations that have the force of law.
            Even worse, they can try you in administrative courts, where you have fewer options if found guilty.

            The Congress needs to take back oversight and responsibility for these agency's actions.
            Democrats>Socialists>Communists - Same goals, different speeds.

            The most effective and pervasive enemy of American freedoms today is the Legacy Media. Defeat them first.

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            • #7
              sl0re10
              Calguns Addict
              • Jan 2013
              • 7242

              Originally posted by takto101
              can and does the ATF make laws???

              if do can some one post a link with some info on it...

              i would like info wether thay can or cant.

              thanks
              Yes; as regulations are law... administrative law.

              Authority to allow it:


              I like to bug liberals that they took the main ideas for this from the Italian fascists.
              Last edited by sl0re10; 04-26-2015, 4:23 PM.

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              • #8
                Mitch
                Mostly Harmless
                CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                • Mar 2008
                • 6574

                Originally posted by odysseus
                This is a point that seems to elude many folks who get upset whenever the ATF publishes this or that regulation. In fact, the ATF has been directed by Congress to promulgate regulations tp enforce the NFA of 1934, the GCA of 1968 and other laws. It's what they do.
                Originally posted by cockedandglocked
                Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.

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                • #9
                  Jimi Jah
                  I need a LIFE!!
                  • Jan 2014
                  • 18760

                  Selective enforcement is commonly used from the President on down.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    lhecker51
                    Senior Member
                    • Nov 2009
                    • 704

                    Originally posted by Librarian
                    And violating those regulations can be and has been used to initiate prosecution.
                    That being the case, there is no difference between laws and regulations other than congress having a much more difficult time enacting laws while it only takes a few minutes for the ATF to do so with a regulation.

                    Hypothetically, congress could spend months drafting and finally getting a law to ban green tip ammo, but ATF can spend less than a day to spit out a regulation that has the very same force of law to include criminal charges for violating it.


                    Who needs a congressman when you can do more damage with an appointed department head? Seems to me that these alphabet agencies have MUCH more power to make life miserable than a congressman could ever have.
                    sigpicNRA Life Member***I have not and will not ever comply****

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      lhecker51
                      Senior Member
                      • Nov 2009
                      • 704

                      Originally posted by Mitch
                      This is a point that seems to elude many folks who get upset whenever the ATF publishes this or that regulation. In fact, the ATF has been directed by Congress to promulgate regulations tp enforce the NFA of 1934, the GCA of 1968 and other laws. It's what they do.
                      But the ATF can and has taken poorly written law and had a field day with it regarding interpretations. We live in a society of elastic definition of words. Given time, black can be defined as white and white as black.
                      sigpicNRA Life Member***I have not and will not ever comply****

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                      • #12
                        barrage
                        Banned
                        • Oct 2012
                        • 3351

                        This government's many agencies can and will effectively create whatever laws it feels like because the American people as a whole still believe civil participation like writing letters to their "representatives" is an effective means of preserving their rights.

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                        • #13
                          Mitch
                          Mostly Harmless
                          CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                          • Mar 2008
                          • 6574

                          Originally posted by lhecker51
                          But the ATF can and has taken poorly written law and had a field day with it regarding interpretations.
                          That's just a consequence of poorly written laws. Someone has to decide, for example, which bit of a modular rifle is the receiver; and at what point, precisely, a hunk of aluminum becomes a firearm. Congress never said.

                          California's assault weapon laws were poorly written, both of them. In those cases, it worked to our advantage.
                          Originally posted by cockedandglocked
                          Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            jeffrice6
                            Calguns Addict
                            • Jan 2006
                            • 5165

                            Originally posted by barrage
                            This government's many agencies can and will effectively create whatever laws it feels like because the American people as a whole still believe civil participation like writing letters to their "representatives" is an effective means of preserving their rights.
                            Baring better voters, what's your alternative?
                            WTB: S&W 617 4" 10 shot Pre-Lock

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                            • #15
                              MrPlink
                              I need a LIFE!!
                              • Mar 2010
                              • 12532

                              Originally posted by barrage
                              This government's many agencies can and will effectively create whatever laws it feels like because the American people as a whole still believe civil participation like writing letters to their "representatives" is an effective means of preserving their rights.
                              Separation of powers is not a right of the people.
                              Nice try though.
                              The California Moderate Centrist Militia member in exile

                              disclaimer:
                              everything I post is for arguendo and entertainment purposes only, and should not be construed to be legal advice

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