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New 870 old shells ejecting problems

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  • #31
    twodko
    Junior Member
    • Oct 2013
    • 71

    Auto loaders

    Auto loaders seem to prefer rounds 1300fps or better for consistent
    Hull ejection. Especially 20 gauge scatter guns.

    Comment

    • #32
      XVIga_Rob
      Senior Member
      • May 2012
      • 2354

      Nice Job CJ5&G23!!

      Not sure what may have been happening with Rem QC. But, I did buy a couple of new 870 express models (from different shops) in the last ~6 months, both have smooth chambers, and no ejection issues.

      Comment

      • #33
        jay_cue
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2012
        • 1236

        mine had problems with Winchester bulk ammo from Walmart.

        Comment

        • #34
          KeepItCal
          Member
          • Jan 2013
          • 171

          Originally posted by CJ5&G23
          Today I cleaned it up. Wrapped a piece of PVC pipe with 400 grit sandpaper to provide uniform sanding pressure to avoid "hills and valleys". All sanding with PVC-wrapped pipe was done by hand - no motors.



          400 grit was too smooth, so repeated with 220 grit:



          220 works, but would take too long to remove that much material. Used a dremel on the slowest speed to remove most (not all) of the ridges, then back to using the PVC wrapped with 220. Getting close:



          Kept at it with 220 until everything was uniform, then went with PVC wrapped with 400:



          Then applied bluing (lighting is bad):



          Then reassembled. What looks like a horizontal scratch is from me pushing hard on a test shell as I pulled it out of the chamber. No drag now. Note scratch starts where low-base Winchester round's case exits chamber (~ 1/4") which was where tooling marks were bad. A high-base shell would have pulled out of the chamber further before the base exiting the chamber and shifted over.



          I'm not a gunsmith, but a home defense shotgun that might hang up on certain ammo had to be fixed, so I did it myself. All in all, came out better than I expected. But, I took my time and did things slowly.
          That's a great job! Will follow the steps. My barrel looks just like the second picture. IS bluing necessary after sanding down the area? Will it rust if I dont?

          Comment

          • #35
            jeffrice6
            Calguns Addict
            • Jan 2006
            • 5165

            Originally posted by KeepItCal
            IS bluing necessary after sanding down the area? Will it rust if I dont?
            Just keep some oil on it & there shouldn't be an issue. Besides, have you ever seen how well cold blue and the like really hold up?!?
            WTB: S&W 617 4" 10 shot Pre-Lock

            Comment

            • #36
              KeepItCal
              Member
              • Jan 2013
              • 171

              Originally posted by jeffrice6
              Just keep some oil on it & there shouldn't be an issue. Besides, have you ever seen how well cold blue and the like really hold up?!?
              haha thanks j!

              Comment

              • #37
                Jimmybacon43
                Senior Member
                • Jun 2013
                • 2000

                You guys are all telling him to polish the chamber of his 870 and replace the extractor....

                when he said that it was only 20 year old ammo that wouldn't function right and that new factory ammo functioned fine.

                Maybe it's the ammo? Anyone think of that?
                Originally posted by RookieShooter
                One of the theory is that the hormones they put in the milk. That is why there are more obesity and homosexual today then back in the 60's.

                Comment

                • #38
                  kentactic
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2012
                  • 1127

                  Glad my tips worked out well for you CJ5! I drink keystone light

                  Comment

                  • #39
                    The Last American Hero
                    Senior Member
                    • Apr 2014
                    • 1215

                    my 870 Supermag didn't like the cheapest low brass at Walmart(Fed?), but Rem low brass was A-OK at about $1 more per 100rd value pack.

                    All other high brass, mini-shells(1 3/4"?) were OK.
                    Am I a good shot!?!, YEAH I'M A GOOD SHOT!....i just got bad aim

                    Comment

                    • #40
                      KeepItCal
                      Member
                      • Jan 2013
                      • 171

                      Update:

                      870 did have factory tooling marks
                      -Dremel and sanded it down a bit
                      -hand sanded with 400grit
                      -then 600grit
                      -Dremel with polishing tip and compound
                      -nice, shiny, and smooth chamber/barrel

                      Went to shoot trap and after 75 targets it felt great. It didn't jam like before. I wouldn't be able to pull the pump back at all before but didn't have issues now.

                      New problem though. Around 3 times I had extraction problems. The pump went down no problem but the empty case was still seated in the chamber. So imagine me pulling the pump back(assuming the shell extracted), dropping in a shell into the receiver and pushing the pump forward but it wouldn't go. Then I realized the case was still seated and the extractor wouldn't catch the brass. I tried pushing the pump forward and pulling it back and still wouldn't catch. Ended up eventually pulling the case after multiple controlled pumps.

                      What do you think is the culprit? Need new extractor? I'm worried this might be a sign that I might of taken too much metal and when the extractor pulls the brass, the shell gets pushed too much and extractor cant engage solidly. Thoughts?

                      Comment

                      • #41
                        Jimmy310
                        Senior Member
                        • May 2009
                        • 1766

                        Were you still using Winchester ammo? My shooting buddies 870 express chamber had lots of tool marks and jammed frequently. I did some reading online, then i polished the chamber which helped alot. I polished it some more (only used scotchbrite pads both times) and the ejecting problems were gone. Didn't use winchester shells. The next time we went out we used Winchester shells again and the problems came back. I did a lot of research on the topic and the general consensus says to stay away from Winchester shells. Federal and Remington brand shells are winners!

                        Originally posted by KeepItCal
                        Update:

                        870 did have factory tooling marks
                        -Dremel and sanded it down a bit
                        -hand sanded with 400grit
                        -then 600grit
                        -Dremel with polishing tip and compound
                        -nice, shiny, and smooth chamber/barrel

                        Went to shoot trap and after 75 targets it felt great. It didn't jam like before. I wouldn't be able to pull the pump back at all before but didn't have issues now.

                        New problem though. Around 3 times I had extraction problems. The pump went down no problem but the empty case was still seated in the chamber. So imagine me pulling the pump back(assuming the shell extracted), dropping in a shell into the receiver and pushing the pump forward but it wouldn't go. Then I realized the case was still seated and the extractor wouldn't catch the brass. I tried pushing the pump forward and pulling it back and still wouldn't catch. Ended up eventually pulling the case after multiple controlled pumps.

                        What do you think is the culprit? Need new extractor? I'm worried this might be a sign that I might of taken too much metal and when the extractor pulls the brass, the shell gets pushed too much and extractor cant engage solidly. Thoughts?



                        WTT: Federal hydrashock 40s&w JHP's for 9mm fmj's locally


                        http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=927721

                        Comment

                        • #42
                          KeepItCal
                          Member
                          • Jan 2013
                          • 171

                          Originally posted by Jimmy310
                          Were you still using Winchester ammo? My shooting buddies 870 express chamber had lots of tool marks and jammed frequently. I did some reading online, then i polished the chamber which helped alot. I polished it some more (only used scotchbrite pads both times) and the ejecting problems were gone. Didn't use winchester shells. The next time we went out we used Winchester shells again and the problems came back. I did a lot of research on the topic and the general consensus says to stay away from Winchester shells. Federal and Remington brand shells are winners!
                          hmmm yes I was still using Winchester Super X #8 shot. I'll make sure to get a few boxes of something different to see if its any better.

                          @cj5 I didn't get a chance to try to pull it out with my finger. What I ended up doing was slowly pumping it back and forth until I was able to extract the shell. IF the extractor wasn't getting full bite, is that an extractor issue or is it a chamber issue? (possbily taking too much metal out and when extractor hooks brass, there isn't the same kind of backing to make it a real positive engagement????)

                          Comment

                          • #43
                            kentactic
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2012
                            • 1127

                            Originally posted by KeepItCal
                            hmmm yes I was still using Winchester Super X #8 shot. I'll make sure to get a few boxes of something different to see if its any better.

                            @cj5 I didn't get a chance to try to pull it out with my finger. What I ended up doing was slowly pumping it back and forth until I was able to extract the shell. IF the extractor wasn't getting full bite, is that an extractor issue or is it a chamber issue? (possbily taking too much metal out and when extractor hooks brass, there isn't the same kind of backing to make it a real positive engagement????)
                            Unless you removed a LOT of material its going to be one of three issues.

                            1. You need to upgrade to a Non-MIM Extractor due to the current one being out of spec.
                            2. You need to file more out of the notch for the extractor that is cut into the barrel. If it hits that and cant drop in front of the shells rim then it cant grab it. Be aware that it is normal for it to make contact with that notched area if there is no shell in the chamber so dont go filing it until it dosent. Too much material removed from this area can expose too much shell brass and could be dangerous.
                            3. Broken/damaged extractor spring and or gummed up area and or the bolt isnt properly cut and its rubbing the extractor bad, causing the extractor to stick up. Pull the action back and test for smooth operation with your finger.

                            I say do #1 and #3 first. If that doesn't solve it look into #2.
                            Last edited by kentactic; 05-27-2014, 9:55 PM.

                            Comment

                            • #44
                              TRAP55
                              Calguns Addict
                              • Jul 2008
                              • 5536

                              20 yr old ammo might affect the cycling of an 1100, but it shouldn't on an 870. I just got through with a headache 870 Express that was locking up as the bolt started to move back. When it wasn't locking up, it still had sticky extraction.
                              Burnished the chamber, polished the barrel extension, installed a non-MIM extractor and stoned the hook for a 100% contact surface on the hull rim. Huge improvement, but it would still have the occasional lockup.
                              After lots of cussing and hair pulling, I finally figured it out.
                              In the pic, you can see a machined groove between the polished area, and the chamber lip. It's recessed deeper than the polished area. The pressure from the extractor was pushing the rim of the hull over into that groove. It was just enough to catch the rim solid, and it wouldn't cycle. Jiggle the pump back and forth, and it would pop loose.

                              I made a smooth taper from the rear edge of the groove and polished out the groove and the taper to blend into the extension. The cheap crap WalMart aluminum low base bulk ammo was the worse culprit, and even it cycles now.
                              I compared this barrel with some older Wingmaster barrels, and they they only had a hint of that groove.
                              Appi, have you run across this before? I would like to hear your input on it!

                              Comment

                              • #45
                                kentactic
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2012
                                • 1127

                                ^^^^ bingo! Most common cause of sticky extraction is the area DIRECTLY behind the shells rim when chambered.

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