Beretta Shotgun Question, Need Help

[Deal]

Thanks all for reading this. I was recently asked by a good friend of mine a question I was not sure I could answer with all certainty. I knew I could come here and someone with the expertise might be able to better advise him.

My friend has a birth defect that limits his shoulder movement and ability to handle too much weight very far out away from his body.

Thus after some searching we discovered the best shotgun for him weight and size wise was a Beretta 1201fs shotgun for home defense. It was a weight he felt comfortable with, even loaded, and the length seemed ok. Being a semi auto shotgun meant he could fire it without a pump action (which is impossible for him). He selected one that has already been outfitted with the pistol grip/stock combination and he likes it. (see pic 1)



Now, he has been given the idea by a Turner's salesperson that he should add a vertical grip on the foregrip of this shotgun. The had a Mossberg set up with one and now my friend thinks the Turner's guy must know what he is talking about (note; this same salesperson at the San Marcos location suggested he didn't need a shotgun bore snake or any cleaning supplies I had recommended he pick up, saying "that so long as he doesn't shoot it much it will never need cleaning and won't get dirty just sitting around").

He tried to sell my friend a CX4 Beretta vertical foregrip (see pic 2) but my friend wanted to ask me first if he should do it. He is set on buying it but wants to know what I thought first.



I don't think this will even fit the shotgun. He said the salesguy suggested putting a rail or "clamp" on it! Arrgghh!

Am I right?

I suggested if he wants to reduce the weight of carry that he can add a sling and that they make several different designs that would fit his needs.

Help me be certain that this is a bad idea to modify the shotgun and try to clamp or screw a vertical grip on it.

Thanks in advance.

[biloutkast]

I'm not 100% but semi auto shotguns in CA can only have one 'evil feature' which is the pistol grip. I'm sure others will chime in or check out the flowchart.

[hcbr]

the foregrip will give him a chance to secure the gun closer to shoulder in case he can't hold it up properly with both hands. I'm not sure to what extent in how much movement he has with his shoulders, but it can indeed help , if you can tell us to what extent his limited movement is.

as for foregrip, he's ok, just so long as there's no collapsable stock which most guns (including the ones you mentioned and have depicted) don't have. so you're ok.

[Deal]

Thanks for the replies so far.

His movement in his shoulders is quite limited.

Let's say his reach is about the length of his forearms away from his body and the further he tries to reach beyond that point requires a little lean and far less strength.

The other alternative is that bullpup design such as the Kel-Tec KSG keeps saying they are unveiling this year. Might be a long wait still.

Just trying every option to put the weight in the center and work around his reach limitations. The vertical grip is something he likes because his forearm and hand strength are not an issue.

[Deal]

Any suggestions as the best way to install this grip to this particular shotgun?

I don't think it was meant for this gun.

[mrkam]

Personally I wouldn't get a folding grip, unless if you really love how it feels to hold it when it's folded. The folding feature doesn't seem to add much IMO, and just adds more possibility for breaking or having wobble. I'd rather get a solid grip, like a TangoDown or something.

How to mount it is pretty simple. Either buy a replacement forend, or be willing to drill some holes in the forend. Buy pretty much any 1913 rail that has holes in it, and screw the rail onto the forend. Mount the grip onto the rail like any other rail, and there you go. The only thing to watch out for is making sure the screws don't extend through the forend and interfere with any internals.

Basically, it would look something like this, which is a factory Saiga forend with a rail screwed onto it. You don't have to make it stick down so much, that's just the particular rail that guy got. Or it would look like the rail on the bottom of this Remington 870 factory forend. (Neither are mine, just found it on the web)





However, I don't think him putting a VFG on it will make a world of difference. Contrary to what the salesman said, it's not like he "should." It's just a different feel, a different way to handle and control it that depends largely on opinion. Then again, now that I think about it, it might allow him to always go to the spot that allows him to comfortably hold the shotgun, and never worry about his hand sliding forward and causing him to lose support of the shotgun.

Another thing that might help your friend is a reduced LOP stock. It would bring the shotgun and it's weight closer into his body. I'm not sure if that Beretta is compatible with Benelli stocks, but that pistol grip looks just like the Benelli stocks. If that shotgun was able to accept Benelli M1 stocks, which it sorta looks like it might be able to, then you could try a Mesa Tactical Urbino stock for the M1, which has a 12" LOP.

[Deal]

Thank you very much for the reply and information mrkam.

[jumpthestack]

If he's firm on getting a shotgun then I'd agree that a shorter stock would be the most helpful thing, and the VFG wouldn't really help much. If they make that model in 20 gauge, that would be a good way to go too, to reduce weight.

Or, just get a handgun, with laser sights if he can't extend his arms all the way out to use the iron sights.

[Jeffy]

If he's firm on getting a shotgun then I'd agree that a shorter stock would be the most helpful thing, and the VFG wouldn't really help much. If they make that model in 20 gauge, that would be a good way to go too, to reduce weight.

Or, just get a handgun, with laser sights if he can't extend his arms all the way out to use the iron sights.

That's how I see it as well.

He could have the stock cut down. I've seen some Benelli's, which use the same stock, cut down then a slip-on limbsaver is added to cover the opening. Or if he wants it to look unmodified:

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=6&f=1&t=236766

http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hk-long-gun-talk/80819-shortening-benelli-tactical-stock-la-ned-christiansen.html

[stockranger]

Sounds like your buddy should get a handgun and forget the shotgun. It will be alot easier on the shoulders. By the time you get your butt out of bed to retrieve your shotgun the intruder with a handgun has already killed you. A handgun could be easy to access and fired while laying down in bed.

Even more likely is he'll have 1,000 dollars sitting in the closet for the next 70 years and it will never see a home invasion. Atleast a handgun he can shoot at your local range for fun.

[Deal]

Sounds like your buddy should get a handgun and forget the shotgun. It will be alot easier on the shoulders. By the time you get your butt out of bed to retrieve your shotgun the intruder with a handgun has already killed you. A handgun could be easy to access and fired while laying down in bed.

Even more likely is he'll have 1,000 dollars sitting in the closet for the next 70 years and it will never see a home invasion. Atleast a handgun he can shoot at your local range for fun.

I gave him that advice first actually. He has invested in a couple of snubbies for home defense already.

But he is one of the anti's that actually started paying attention and talked himself along with some help from me, to convert. He doesn't like the direction the country is headed. Hoping for the best. Voting for the best. And stocking up on food, water, meds, ammo, a few handguns and he wanted a shotgun.

Get this, he is a banker and has "protesters" outside his bank. I am proud of him converting and seeing things a little different that before. His motivation is his two young daughters.

Next goal, get him to Calguns and the NRA.



Thanks all. I like the idea of a shorter stock rather than screwing a VFG into the fore grip.

[stockranger]

well I hear that. I purchased all the semi automatic weapons I think I will want to own before they are made Illegal.

Just have to say he would of been better off with a semi that has two barrels and standard stock. He has HD totaly covered with a couple snubbies. Then he could shoot trap with a 28" BBL and rock the 18" at home in the closet. To each his own. Atleast the gun is cool to look at while it collects dust.

[Deal]

well I hear that. I purchased all the semi automatic weapons I think I will want to own before they are made Illegal.

Just have to say he would of been better off with a semi that has two barrels and standard stock. He has HD totaly covered with a couple snubbies. Then he could shoot trap with a 28" BBL and rock the 18" at home in the closet. To each his own. Atleast the gun is cool to look at while it collects dust.

He was set on a shotgun. I even let him try one of my coach guns but he was set on having something like this. I have several and he found one at a Turners on consignment and had to have it. Now he has found it is probably not for him and wants to add a VFG. I think he is just going to ruin a nice shotgun.

He listens to me and then he runs down to Turners to listen to some kid behind the counter and does whatever the kid suggests. I hate to see it happen but I think I am going to have to let my friend learn the hard way.
He still, in spite of anything I have said, thinks the kid is right about "not having to clean the shotgun unless you shoot it allot."

I probably should not call the Turners employee a kid. That sounds bad on my part. I really don't know what age he actually is. That said...

[stockranger]

People that work at turners general don't know what they are talking about.

Anyone who thinks they shouldn't clean a gun, especialy a self defense gun, is clueless about firearms.

A gas operated semi automatic needs to be cleaned. If ever a weapon needed cleaning this is it! You can get away with never cleaning a pump. You might even do ok with a long recoil or inertia gun. The inside of the gas ports etc get all gunked up. Just having the powder in contact with the metal is corrosive. Who in their right mind doesn't clean and oil a weapon? Even the powder residue building up in the chamber can cause the shells to stick and cost someone their life in a defense situation.