Mossberg 590 Shockwave 12ga 14" - legal in California? NO - CA says it's an SBS

[Quiet]

So now C&R SBS's are no longer exempt?

C&R SBS are still exempt. [PC 17705(a)]

But, problem is finding C&R SBS.

Per BATFE...
Taking a C&R shotgun and making it into a SBS, voids it's C&R status and makes it a "modern" SBS.
In order to be a C&R SBS, it had to be made into a SBS 50+ years ago or be listed on the BATFE C&R list as a C&R SBS.

[superhondaz50]

So, does anyone have any other info on denials for other forms (1 or 4)? Maybe they're only getting their panties in a bunch about the form 3 dealer to dealer, it's a very curious issue. Maybe it's time to submit a form 1 for something to test it, to see if it's just Judge's they don't like. Maybe a 50bmg pistol as a DD.

[aippi]

I feel the pain of anyone living in the Unamerican territory of California where the rights of every living thing on the planet are protected with the full force of the state government, well except the 2nd amendment rights of you guys. I can hardly keep up with your approval list and have not a clue about the NFA stuff out there. But reading this peeked my curiosity as to why the Judge is not simply a pistol since the barrel has rifling. Will stay tuned for a response as there are some guys here that really know the NFA and CA DOJ stuff.

[superhondaz50]

The judge meets California's definition of a short barreled shotgun. It becomes exempt once registered as an aow.

[Quiet]

But reading this peeked my curiosity as to why the Judge is not simply a pistol since the barrel has rifling.

Under Federal laws/regulations...

Taurus Judge is a Title 1 Handgun.

Title 1 Handgun because it has a rifled barrel, no shoulder stock, and overall length of less than 26".


Under CA laws/regulations...

Taurus Judge is both a "handgun" and a SBS.
^This applies to all handguns that are chambered in .45LC/.410.

A firearm can be classified as a "handgun" and a SBR/SBS, if it meets the definitions of them. [PC 16530(b)]

It is a "handgun" because it is a firearm with a less than 16" barrel length. [PC 16530(a)]

It is a SBS because it is a firearm that can shoot shotgun shells & has a less than 18" barrel length [PC 17180(a)] and is a firearm that can shoot shotgun shells & has a less than 26" overall length [PC 17180(b)].

A firearm that is classified as a Title 2 AOW under Federal laws, is exempt from CA SBR/SBS/unconventional handgun laws. [PC 17710(a)]

[champu]

Mitch. I was told by an ATF Agent that you don't have to put a shoulder stock on one of these. If you simply shoulder it to fire it you have just committed a Felony.

Same BS with Sig Braces

This is inconsistent with my understanding of the argument made with the sig braces. (Doesn't mean I'm right, it would just mean the sig brace determination isn't as sensible as I thought it was.)

My understanding was not that "shouldering the gun made it an SBR/SBS" it was that "shouldering the gun was evidence that you put the brace (which is suspiciously stock-like) on there with the intent of it being a stock and with the intent of it being a firearm that was fired from the shoulder" which is the actual thing you're not supposed to do.

If you just take some random gun and hold it against your shoulder awkwardly, the above doesn't apply.

[aippi]

Thanks Quiet. So I get it now. They use the Chambering as an excuse to further deny you guys your rights. Your DOJ sure put a lot of effort into this approval list. If they would put as much effort into fighting crime as they do screwing you guys over, CA would be the safest state in the Union. However, I'm sure gang bangers and thieves would never use a gun in a crime that was on the restricted list as that could really get them in trouble.

[Quiet]

This is inconsistent with my understanding of the argument made with the sig braces. (Doesn't mean I'm right, it would just mean the sig brace determination isn't as sensible as I thought it was.)

My understanding was not that "shouldering the gun made it an SBR/SBS" it was that "shouldering the gun was evidence that you put the brace (which is suspiciously stock-like) on there with the intent of it being a stock and with the intent of it being a firearm that was fired from the shoulder" which is the actual thing you're not supposed to do.

If you just take some random gun and hold it against your shoulder awkwardly, the above doesn't apply.

Under the current BATFE determination...
A Title 1 Handgun with an arm stabilizing brace being used as intended (braced along the shooting hand's forearm) does not change the classification of the Title 1 Handgun.
A Title 1 Handguns with an arm stabilizing brace being used as not intended (such as being shouldered) changes the classification to a Title 2 SBR.
SIG and other arm stabilizing brace manufacturers support the current BATFE determination.


Under CA laws/regulations...
Some DA's Offices have concluded that installing an arm stabilizing brace onto a handgun makes it a SBR/SBS, because they contend that installation is proof of the person redesigning the firearm to be fired from the shoulder.
^CA DOJ is silent on this issue and has let all 58 DA's Office to come up with their own determination.

[BigPimping]

I have a Shockwave blade on my AR pistol. It works pretty well. They do make a good product.

[smith and wesson]

mossberg shockwave

are they cali legal?

http://www.mossberg.com/category/series/590-shockwave/

[SkyHawk]

No, several threads on this

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=19623746

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=19670198

[smith and wesson]

No, several threads on this

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...php?p=19635615

tha ks for the link.

[nickleplatedbrass]

Mossberg 590 Shockwave 12ga 14" - legal in California? NO - CA says it's an SBS

Is this legal to own in California?

[nickleplatedbrass]

From another post:

Under CA laws...
A firearm that shoots shotgun shells and has a barrel length of less than 18" is a SBS. [PC 17180(a)]
A firearm that shoots shotgun shells and has an overall length of less than 26" is a SBS. [PC 17180(b)]
A firearm that is made from a shotgun and has a barrel length of less than 18" or has an overall length of less than 26" is a SBS. [PC 17180(c)]

Therefore...
If the firearm that shoots shotgun shells has a barrel length of 18" or greater and an overall length of 26" or greater, then it is CA legal.

[keith1911]

What about the Any Other Weapon (AOW) thing? I've seen shotguns with way shorter barrels legally sold in CA.