Semi Auto w/ Detach Mag 2017 Questions

[Atlantic Firearms]

So going forward into 2017 will the semi auto shotguns with detachable mags and pistol grips be legal ? The way we read the law it would be NO but others have said yes . Any input would be helpful as we transition our offerings to reflect the new law taking effect in 2017.

[rromeo]

Semi-auto shotguns with detachable mags are still illegal as they have been. However, the Bullet Button and other types of magazine locks are still legally viable for shotguns.

[Quiet]

So going forward into 2017 will the semi auto shotguns with detachable mags and pistol grips be legal ? The way we read the law it would be NO but others have said yes . Any input would be helpful as we transition our offerings to reflect the new law taking effect in 2017.

Semi-auto shotguns that accept detachable magazines are still illegal. [PC 30515(a)(7)]

It appears semi-auto shotguns are not affected by the change in the definition of a "fixed magazine".
^Since a fixed tubular magazine can be removed from a semi-auto shotgun without disassembling the firearm's action, it could be a reason why shotguns were not included in the change to what constitutes a "fixed magazine".

Which means a semi-auto shotgun with a "bullet button" style maglock should still be CA legal.

100% certainty will not come about, until CA DOJ BOF releases the finalized regulations governing the changes to the assault weapons laws.


Penal Code 30515Penal Code 30515 {Starting 01-01-2017}
(a) Notwithstanding Section 30510, "assault weapon" also means any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer's hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
(b) For purposes of this section, "fixed magazine" means an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm in such a manner that the device cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.

[dblcrwn]

New Firearms Legislation: "Bullet Button" Firearms will be Considered Assault Weapons Effective January 1, 2017

Pursuant to Assembly Bill 1135 (Stats. 2016, ch. 40) and Senate Bill 880 (Stats. 2016, ch. 48) effective January 1, 2017, the definition of assault weapon is revised.

These bills will require that any person who, from January 1, 2001, to December 31, 2016, inclusive, lawfully possessed an assault weapon that does not have a fixed magazine, as defined in Penal Code section 30515, including those weapons with an ammunition feeding device that can be readily removed from the firearm with the use of a tool, shall register the firearm before January 1, 2018, but not before the effective date of the regulations adopted by the DOJ.

These bills will also require registrations to be submitted electronically via the Internet utilizing a public-facing application made available by the DOJ. These bills will require the registration to contain specified information, including, but not limited to, a description of the firearm that identifies it uniquely and specified information about the registrant. These bills will permit the Department to charge a fee of up to $15 per person for registration through the Internet, not to exceed the reasonable processing costs of the Department to be paid and deposited, as specified, for purposes of the registration program. These bills will require the Department to adopt regulations for the purpose of implementing those provisions and will exempt those regulations from the Administrative Procedure Act. These bills will also make technical and conforming changes.

Assembly Bill 1135 and Senate Bill 880 also define the meaning of "fixed magazine" to mean an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm in such a manner that the device cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.

This new legislation closes the "bullet button" loop hole and categorizes "bullet button" firearms as assault weapons.

[JohnCCW]

Once your bullet-buttoned firearm is a RAW with paperwork, you can take off that bullet button and add as many Evil features as you wish, as long as you don't make it a SBR.

[Atlantic Firearms]

Folks just to be clear we are asking about semi auto shotguns that are NEW purchases shipped into CA in 2017 with the pistol grip and detachable mag.

[Quiet]

Folks just to be clear we are asking about semi auto shotguns that are NEW purchases shipped into CA in 2017 with the pistol grip and detachable mag.

For 2017...

Semi-auto shotgun + detachable magazine = illegal [PC 30515(a)(7)]

Semi-auto shotgun + "bullet button" style maglock + magazine = still appears to be legal.
^100% certainty will not be obtained until CA DOJ BOF releases the finalized regulations pertaining to the changes in the assault weapons laws for 2017

Semi-auto shotgun + fixed magazine that can't be removed without disassembling the firearm's action = legal

[Atlantic Firearms]

Quiet , Does the semi auto shotgun with a mag and PISTOL Grip have any impact on how you see the gun with the mag lock / bullet button installed ?

[strongpoint]

[COLOR="Blue"]So going forward into 2017 will the semi auto shotguns with detachable mags and pistol grips be legal ? The way we read the law it would be NO but others have said yes .

Let me approach this from the opposite direction. How do YOU read the law?

According to the legislature's own analysis of the changes to PC 30515, neither SB-880 nor its identical lower-house counterpart, AB-1135, changed the AW criteria regarding semiautomatic shotguns by even a single word.

Just to satisfy my own curiosity: The governor signed this bill into law on July 1. Why is an out-of-state retailer that appears to take its California business fairly seriously still attempting to parse actual changes to the law on Dec. 26? Don't get me wrong -- I'm an Atlantic customer and a happy one at that, and I welcome the effort, but it strikes me as coming awfully late.

[Atlantic Firearms]

Yes we have spoken with several of our FFL contacts in CA that are also Cal Guns members and all have told us the semi auto mag fed shotguns with pistol grips are banned in 2017 with the new law. However we continue to be contacted by others saying otherwise that is why we are asking these questions .

[Quiet]

Quiet , Does the semi auto shotgun with a mag and PISTOL Grip have any impact on how you see the gun with the mag lock / bullet button installed ?

Pistol grip has no impact, unless the semi-auto shotgun has a folding/collapsible stock.

Current, CA assault weapons laws prohibits a semi-auto shotgun in having both a pistol grip and a folding/extending stock. [PC 30515(a)(6)]

[Quiet]

Summary for 2017:
semi-auto shotgun + detachable magazine = illegal [PC 30515(a)(7)]
semi-auto shotgun + detachable magazine + pistol grip + fixed shoulder stock = illegal [PC 30515(a)(7)]
semi-auto shotgun + detachable magazine + pistol grip + folding/collapsible stock = illegal [PC 30515(a)(6)&(7)]

semi-auto shotgun + "bullet button" maglock + 10 or less round magazine = illegal* [PC 30515(a)(7)]
semi-auto shotgun + "bullet button" maglock + 10 or less round magazine + pistol grip + fixed shoulder stock = illegal* [PC 30515(a)(7)]
semi-auto shotgun + "bullet button" maglock + 10 or less round magazine + pistol grip + folding/collapsible stock = illegal [PC 30515(a)(6)&(7)]

semi-auto shotgun + fixed 10 or less round magazine that can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action = legal
semi-auto shotgun + fixed 10 or less round magazine that can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action + pistol grip + fixed shoulder stock = legal
semi-auto shotgun + fixed 10 or less round magazine that can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action + pistol grip + folding/collapsible stock = illegal [PC 30515(a)(6)]


*legal status is not 100% certainty and it will not be certain, until CA DOJ BOF releases the finalized regulations pertaining to the changes in the assault weapons laws for 2017
* CA DOJ BOF released new regulations that define "ability to accept a detachable magazine" for semi-auto shotguns to mean it does not have a fixed magazine that can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action.

[Librarian]

As an out-of-state seller you may not know this... All CA FFLs haved recently received DOJ regulation that basically says any firearm that requires bullet button to stay compliant in 2016, WILL be considered as an assault weapon in 2017.

Note that the DOJ is simply lying by omission in that announcement. The amended Penal Code has been posted in the thread; the amendment for rifles was not applied to shotguns.

[strongpoint]

Semi Auto w/ Detach Mag 2017 Questions

A lot of non-FFL folks here like to play lawyers by interjecting their own interpretation of the new laws, and that kind of talks is protected by the 1st amendment.

Plain text of the amended law = "interpretation"? Orwell would have loved you.

[Atlantic Firearms]

It all seems to be clearly unclear .Are there any FFL transfer dealers that are agreeing to accept transfers on detachable mag shotguns with mag locks ?