.17 VS .22

[Californio]

We don't shoot coyotes with rimfire only centerfire. Centerfire is overkill for squirrels unless you are going out over 200 yards. I have shot squirrels at 450 yards with .223 36gr. NTX bullets but a waste of dollars/rounds under 200 yards. I use 6.5mm centerfire on pigs. Different tools for distance and animals.

May I pose a question for which I am confused about. I have read a bit regarding the argument that a 17 hmr is frangable and may hit a coyote's fur and explode with poor penetration....not sure if that is accurate or consistent...but if true....does this carry to the 17 wsm.....and secondly....does a 22 mag, which is just a little bigger have the same risk....or for some other reason possesses greater penetration secondary to design?

[Jack L]

We don't shoot coyotes with rimfire only centerfire. Centerfire is overkill for squirrels unless you are going out over 200 yards. I have shot squirrels at 450 yards with .223 36gr. NTX bullets but a waste of dollars/rounds under 200 yards. I use 6.5mm centerfire on pigs. Different tools for distance and animals.

[NRai2001]

Not that I have a coyote problem but what is a good caliber for coyote sized animals?

[Californio]

The no-lead .223 Remington's tend to take more than one round especially out at 400 yards. It stops them but doesn't kill them on the first shot. .243 Remington which is 6mm would be my minimum choice with no-lead. I use one round/rifle for Coyotes and Pig which is 6.5 Creedmoor and does well in the GMX or TTSX loads. I have an older .308 but have never been able to get it to group worth beans using no-lead.

Not that I have a coyote problem but what is a good caliber for coyote sized animals?

[Jack L]

CA F&G told me lead free rounds are not required for predation. I live on a ranch surround by cattle ranches and vineyards.... I have not researched it. Probably has to be owned by you, your family or you are hired to shoot varmints and larger animals that rip up the crops or kill newborns..

[Californio]

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/wildlife/hunting/condor/docs/LeadInformation.pdf

This link would not support that claim in the Condor areas.

Don't get me wrong I think no-lead is a joke but not willing to lose my license over it.

[Jack L]

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/wildlife/hunti...nformation.pdf

This link would not support that claim in the Condor areas.

Don't get me wrong I think no-lead is a joke but not willing to lose my license over it.

[Jack L]

I just found this. If anyone knows anything about it concerning ground squirrels, post it. See the section in red print.

What are the regulations and options for hunting with .22 caliber or smaller rimfire
firearms?
Rimfire firearms are not legal in California for hunting big game or for depredation killing
of big game animals (these are primarily deer and wild pig in condor range).
Rimfire firearms are legal for nongame animals (coyotes and ground squirrels primarily)
and for sport hunting of small game mammals [hares (jackrabbits), cottontail, and tree
squirrel]. However, for nongame animals the Commission has prohibited use of lead
projectiles in .22 rimfire or smaller firearms as part of this regulation change in condor
range.
The Commission has not addressed the issue of hunting small game mammals because
that section of the regulations was not “opened” for potential change. Therefore, hunters
can legally hunt jackrabbit, cottontail, and tree squirrel using lead projectiles, but not
ground squirrels in the same area. Part of the reasoning for this is that unlike nongame
animals that are hunted and usually left in the field, game species must be retrieved and
not wasted.
The Department and Commission are of the understanding that non-lead projectiles for
rimfire are not readily available or manufactured at this time and that the only non-lead
rimfire is in .22 caliber magnum, and not for the very popular .22 short, long, or long rifle.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And this;

For those of you shooting on your own property or private property you have the owner’s permission to be on, contact the local game warden. Ask them specifically, “Can I use lead.22LR ammunition for non-game animal, pest depredation?”

From what I have been told on two separate occasions by two different game wardens as well as when calling the local office, we are fine to shoot ground squirrels and rabbits with leaded .22 ammo with the purpose of pest depredation.

Please check with your local fish cops first and you should get the same answer. Just make sure you Do Not use the word hunting, just pest depredation.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/archive/index.php/t-277451.html

[Hdawg]

If I could only have one rimfire rifle it would be a .22lr.

This, now that I've edited it a bit. Every gun owner should have a 22 rifle. The specific model isn't critical. If you like to tinker get a 10/22. If you want great accuracy at a good price without changing anything, get a CZ bolt action. Under anything approaching normal ammo supply conditions, you can shoot bulk .22 LR for a third to a quarter the price of the .17 HMR. If you want to shoot for accuracy, match .22 is about the same cost as regular .17 HMR which is very accurate also.

[primers]

Or you could wait and see when the new 17 Win Magnums come to town....Thats what I am waiting for.......

[NRai2001]

Or you could wait and see when the new 17 Win Magnums come to town....Thats what I am waiting for.......

Is that different than 17hmr?

[d0wnShifT]

Is that different than 17hmr?

Yes, it's different. Check this out.

http://www.winchester.com/library/news/Pages/worlds-fastest-rimfire-cartridge.aspx

[Jack L]

The bummer, and one the manufacture does not mention is; We (who live in the CA condor lead free zone), unless shooting paper, have to use lead free rounds. They are hard to find, cost more and........most agree the rimfire ammo’s accuracy and stopping power is terrible. Few are manufacturing it.

[primers]

Yes Sir very different...and suposedly the rounds are going to be priced similar to 17HMR.....

[Viper49]

Stay with the 22lr is a much better and the selection of the 22 are countless. 17 HMR and 17 HM2 only manufacture by CCI and Hornady, but if you have a heart on the 17 HMR the CZ455 combo will be good to go. CZ455 combo will get you a 17HMR barrel and a 22LR as well.