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  • #16
    Bull Elk
    Veteran Member
    • Jan 2011
    • 4209

    Some people, not all, who spend $1,000 or more rifle will tell you that those $500, $600 and $700 rifles are junk. If true, then Remington 700's, Browning A-bolts, Tikka, Weatherby and other top manufacturers are making junk...right? Wrong. Even the $350 Marlin SL7 is an excellent economy rifle that will last a hunter a lifetime. Nothing wrong with Marlin's, as I own two. Many are the same folks who say that you should spend 3x the amount on a scope that you spend on a rifle. I don't know who these people hunt with or where they hunt or how much money they make, but I don't know of any of my hunting buddies that spend $1,000 or $1,500 on scopes and we kill just as many animals as the rest. I've killed 13 elk and more deer than I can remember, and all were shot with scopes costing less than $250. These animals were killed on days with clear skies, snowy conditions or during rain storms, mornings, afternoons and late in the evening. My scopes never failed, and I never had a problem finding enough light to make an ethical and clear shot.

    If you hunt pigs, deer, bear, etc. a half dozen times a year and maybe spend a half dozen sessions at the range each year, there is nothing wrong with any of the Nikons, Leupolds, Redfield or Vortex scopes priced between $160 and $250. All of these have decent glass for those who typically hunt a few times a year or have a limited budget. And all of these price point scopes have lifetime warranties. These are very good quality scopes, with manufacturers having a lifetime of experience producing quality products. I just bought two Leupold VX-II's at the Sportsman's Warehouse for under $250 each. Does someone want to go out on the ledge and say that these are junk or poor scopes? Vortex....I absolutely love them. They are clearly equal (some say better) than Leupold. Nikon? Gee, they've only been in the scope and lens business for 50 years. All have lifetime warranties for their hunting scopes.

    If anyone wants to go out and spend $500, $700, $1,000 or more on quality glass, then go right ahead - it's probably good money spent. Just don't make silly unsubstantiated claims that spending anything less results in low quality or junk scopes. It's all in one's personal perspective and bank account.

    Comment

    • #17
      TechSoldier
      Member
      • Dec 2011
      • 135

      I spent about $250 on my AR optic setup which is a PA micro dot and PA magnifier. Sure the glass quality isn't on par with EOTech or Trijicon but for how much I paid, I'm extremely happy with the setup. Gone through about 1k rounds without a glitch. In fact my buddy liked my setup so much he went the same route.

      If you have the cash, go with EOTech or Trijicon or Aimpoint. Otherwise I'd suggest looking at Primary Arms.

      Comment

      • #18
        Danforth
        Junior Member
        • Feb 2008
        • 46

        Normally, I agree with the 'buy cheap, buy twice', 'you get what you pay for' mantra. However, I needed a variable for my 3-gun rifle(ar 15 platform/.223) and was between a rock and a hard place financially. So, rolled the dice on a used Leapers 1x - 4x with resetable target turrets, flip covers, and lit, mil dot reticle... @ $82 with shipping. Now the 1x is more of a 1.15x and I wouldn't drop it off a roof or drive a truck over it but, the glass is clear and, 2k to 3k rounds and @ a dozen matches later the covers are good, the turrets stay locked, original battery is still strong, and it's held zero. I can't vouch for use with heavier cals. and, maybe I got lucky, but, essentially, you don't have to break the bank for a decent optic. Especially if you're patient and shop the used market.

        Comment

        • #19
          PrimaryArms
          Vendor/Retailer
          • Jun 2011
          • 2676

          We offer great quality products for a good price
          take a look

          AR 15 Parts and Accessories for sale at Primary Arms. Your one stop shop for all your firearms and gun parts with outstanding customer service.


          Thanks again
          Dimitri
          Last edited by PrimaryArms; 05-04-2012, 1:22 PM.
          www.primaryarms.com

          Comment

          • #20
            ejhc11
            Senior Member
            • Aug 2010
            • 1214

            Originally posted by Frank92612
            Any thoughts on the Weaver Kaspa 3-12X44SF ILL Ballistic-X Tactical Rifle-Scope for $200?
            Nah, pass on that. Its Weaver's lower lineup, made in China.
            Get this instead at MidwayUSA, mil on mil scopes, Japan made.

            Comment

            • #21
              Dinosaur Jr
              Senior Member
              • May 2012
              • 1707

              I picked up a lowly $75 TRUGLO 2x red dot that absolutely rocked last time I went to the range. Its easy to use and has a large ocular and objective making it quick and easy to find the dot and put it on target. Put a good 400 rounds thru it and it performed solidly. I'm also impressed with the solid, quality feel of the rheostat in this price range. No issues seeing the dot in very bright sunlight with the rheostat well below the maximum intensity. I also love the 2x boost over 1x.

              If you've got the cash to burn, Trijicon, Aimpoint, and EOTech are great. However, there are plenty of good alternatives out there to spending big bucks on optics. My votes go to Burris and Vortex for really decent quality glass at affordable price points.

              Caution:
              I have tried to get away too cheap and ignored some reviews - there's always some bad ones right?. My first scope was a Barska Contour IR 3-9x40 That unfortunate POS only lasted two months before the optics "bricked" themselves from recoil and turned it into a maraca. Barska was more than willing to honor their warranty...for $25 . There's something very fundamentally wrong when a company burdens YOU to offset THEIR costs for warranty service. Burned & lesson learned.
              Last edited by Dinosaur Jr; 07-04-2012, 10:23 AM. Reason: expanded comments
              Laws against murder and attempted murder should have been the only gun control laws ever needed in America...

              Comment

              • #22
                CSACANNONEER
                CGN/CGSSA Contributor - Lifetime
                CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                • Dec 2006
                • 44094

                I have a few SNOWWIS scopes that were inexpensive and work for me. Unfortunately, they are pretty rare.
                NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
                California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller
                Ventura County approved CCW Instructor
                Utah CCW Instructor


                Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners.

                sigpic
                CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE

                KM6WLV

                Comment

                • #23
                  .22guy
                  Calguns Addict
                  • Nov 2006
                  • 5863

                  Mueller makes a good scope in the APV (All-Purpose Variable). I have one on my .17HMR and it's a great deal for around $130.

                  I'm hoping to replace several of my cheaper scopes on my .22's with APV's someday.
                  Originally posted by sholling
                  Someone else's lack of foresight and planning is no reason for you to take less than the current market value despite all of the wailing and crying for 2nd Amendment socialism and welfare pricing.

                  Comment

                  • #24
                    Kappy
                    Calguns Addict
                    • Jul 2007
                    • 5349

                    All I care about is semi-clear glass, decent cross hairs, and that it will hold zero. I shoot 99% of my shots at 100 yards and pretty much all of those are at a .7" shoot'n'see. For that purpose, anything that isn't Barska or worse will do.
                    Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.

                    Comment

                    • #25
                      KTM RICK
                      Senior Member
                      • Mar 2011
                      • 564

                      Originally posted by Bull Elk
                      Some people, not all, who spend $1,000 or more rifle will tell you that those $500, $600 and $700 rifles are junk. If true, then Remington 700's, Browning A-bolts, Tikka, Weatherby and other top manufacturers are making junk...right? Wrong. Even the $350 Marlin SL7 is an excellent economy rifle that will last a hunter a lifetime. Nothing wrong with Marlin's, as I own two. Many are the same folks who say that you should spend 3x the amount on a scope that you spend on a rifle. I don't know who these people hunt with or where they hunt or how much money they make, but I don't know of any of my hunting buddies that spend $1,000 or $1,500 on scopes and we kill just as many animals as the rest. I've killed 13 elk and more deer than I can remember, and all were shot with scopes costing less than $250. These animals were killed on days with clear skies, snowy conditions or during rain storms, mornings, afternoons and late in the evening. My scopes never failed, and I never had a problem finding enough light to make an ethical and clear shot.

                      If you hunt pigs, deer, bear, etc. a half dozen times a year and maybe spend a half dozen sessions at the range each year, there is nothing wrong with any of the Nikons, Leupolds, Redfield or Vortex scopes priced between $160 and $250. All of these have decent glass for those who typically hunt a few times a year or have a limited budget. And all of these price point scopes have lifetime warranties. These are very good quality scopes, with manufacturers having a lifetime of experience producing quality products. I just bought two Leupold VX-II's at the Sportsman's Warehouse for under $250 each. Does someone want to go out on the ledge and say that these are junk or poor scopes? Vortex....I absolutely love them. They are clearly equal (some say better) than Leupold. Nikon? Gee, they've only been in the scope and lens business for 50 years. All have lifetime warranties for their hunting scopes.

                      If anyone wants to go out and spend $500, $700, $1,000 or more on quality glass, then go right ahead - it's probably good money spent. Just don't make silly unsubstantiated claims that spending anything less results in low quality or junk scopes. It's all in one's personal perspective and bank account.
                      Well said.

                      Comment

                      • #26
                        FMJBT
                        Veteran Member
                        • Mar 2007
                        • 4888

                        Yeah, this is the perfect part of Calguns to get into "scope" measuring contests, LOL I've read thread after thread on here bashing the budget scopes. Lots of "If you pay $XXX for rifle, you should pay at least $XXX for scope" type of comments. Lots of blanket statements condemning entire brands, etc.

                        My test of a scopes quality is pretty simple. I'm looking for the following criteria to be met:

                        -Has to be clear enough to see an 11"X18" steel plate at 1000 yards
                        -Has to have enough internal travel to dial a 308 out that far from a 0 moa base
                        -Has to have accurate and repeatable adjustments
                        -Has to have a mil based reticle, preferably glass etched
                        -Has to hold zero through repeated adjustments for at least several hundred rounds

                        A lot of scopes don't make the cut, mostly due to elevation range. 80+ moa is a lot to ask for out of a cheap scope. I phased out all the Bushnell 3200 series 10X40 Mil Dots I had because of this, Their Mil Dot reticle also has a bad tendancy to wash out in bright sunlight, which is why I try to stick mostly to glass etched reticles now.

                        I ended up replacing all the Bushnell scopes with these super cheap 4-14X44 FFP scopes from FM Optics:

                        Surprisingly good customer service from their importer , DKG Trading. I received one with a slightly crooked reticle. I emailed DKG, they had me send it in and I had a new one within a week, they even paid the shipping on the new scope. I've had one of these mounted to my Savage 10FP McMillan for a few years now, and it has never given me any issues after countless trips to the range banging steel at 1000 yards.

                        Another good FFP scope is this one from BSA that's distributed by Midway USA:

                        They go on sale about every other month at Midway for $249.99. I'm running one of these on an LR-308 with SASS barrel. Tracks perfectly and holds zero over several hundred rounds. Awesome reticle too, with matching mil turrets. For long range on a budget, these are a lot of scope for the money.

                        For lower magnification SFP scopes, I've been really impressed by the newer Sightmark 2.5-10X32 Mil Dot scopes. For roughly the same price as the Bushnell 10X40 mil dot, these have variable magnification, glass etched reticles, better glass than the Bushnell and nearly twice the internal travel (Advertised as 100 moa of travel, both of mine are 130-135 moa of elevation travel)

                        This is a good scope to put on a mid range semi auto like a DMR or SPR type rifle. I have one on a 16" 308 AR and the combo is just about perfect. Very solid performance out to 1000 yards. The recoil on this rifle is pretty stout, and the Sightmark holds zero without fail (although I have had to tighten the rings several times, finally lock-tited the whole mess)
                        U.S. Navy (Retired) 1994-2015

                        Comment

                        • #27
                          CSACANNONEER
                          CGN/CGSSA Contributor - Lifetime
                          CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                          • Dec 2006
                          • 44094

                          I like most of your requirements. But, I have little use for mil based reticles or mil based adjustments. I prefer moa based optics.
                          NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
                          California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller
                          Ventura County approved CCW Instructor
                          Utah CCW Instructor


                          Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners.

                          sigpic
                          CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE

                          KM6WLV

                          Comment

                          • #28
                            capnemo
                            Member
                            • Dec 2011
                            • 236

                            Originally posted by joash
                            There's a lot of discussion of high-tech, high-end optics and other firearms accessories, but what about high quality low price?

                            What are some of the best low budget options out there?

                            You did not specify a budget. Look for CamerlandNY specials, especially end of the year when the manufacturers sell off stock to bring out the new. They also sell demos. Examples:

                            Minox ZA-3 3x9x40 for $229 shipped, fantastic scope and great lifetime no questions warranty, however I do not call this budget, just great value

                            Vortex Crossfire 6x40, final closeout price $49 shipped! Also a good warranty

                            If you cannot wait for a closeout or a sale, Nikon Pro-staff are great value

                            Lower end ($120) ppl seem happy with Mueller

                            Keep in mind the more you pay after a point increasingly the image gets
                            better in slighter increments, but you do get better build quality and often
                            no questions asked warranty service/replacement. ED glass and better coatings can easily extend 20 minutes longer into dusk low light conditions.

                            Also, for hunting, a fixed scope will offer cheaper price and likely better site picture, chances are you can do just fine with a fixed 4x for a .22 or 6x for
                            centerfire and big game. Obviously if you are hunting mountain goats at 600+ yards you might need a longer range optic.

                            Generally Vortex are great scopes for the money, if possible try to buy at least one level above Crossfire, IE Diamondback or better. I feel the same is true for all brands, if possible try to buy at least one level above their lowest cost offering.
                            Right now CamerlandNY has the Vortex Viper 2-7x32 for $199...a screamin' deal. BTW I have no relationship with them, but have purchased two scopes and one binoculars from them in the last year, Doug and Neil are great,

                            Do not rule out used optics. I would rather buy a lightly used second hand scope than a cheaper new one. Check warranties, some manufacturers attach the warranty to the first owner only, others warranty the scope regardless of how many owners it has been through! I purchased a Sightron
                            Sll (non-Big Sky) 4-14 AO scope barely used, it is a killer optic...cheap

                            Check review sights: Nutnfancy on youtube, Chuck Hawks website

                            Ask questions at 24hourcampfire optics forum etc.

                            eBay is a bit of a gamble unless the seller has 100% + feedback and a 14 day return policy. 24hourcampfire marketplace has sellers who seem reliable and give honest assessments on the quality of their gear. Not too many scopes available here.
                            Last edited by capnemo; 07-04-2012, 9:14 AM.
                            Looking to buy: Ruger Speed Six 9MM revolver

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                            • #29
                              cortayack
                              Senior Member
                              • Dec 2008
                              • 1758

                              tag

                              Comment

                              • #30
                                RudyCakes
                                Senior Member
                                • Nov 2011
                                • 524

                                Zeiss Conquest 3-9X40 is $400 everywhere right now. Buy through Amazon using the CalGuns link. Can't get much more value than a Zeiss for $400.

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