S+B PM 5-25 vs. 12-50

[captbilly]

I am putting together a long range target .308 rifle, and want some help with the scope selection. I am pretty much set on a Schmidt and Bender (though I would look at others if someone thought they were simply better) but am having a hard time with choosing the 5-25 PM or the 12-50 PM. I have seen the 12-50 for sale on a number of sites but when I go to S+Bs site they don't seem to show the 12-50 at all. Anyone know anything about the 12-50 S+B PM? Is it an out of production model?, a grey market Europe only model? I noticed that in the specs presented at the stores selling the 12-50 (optics Planet and others) that the 12-50 is listed as weighing only 620 grams while the 5-25 is over a KG, which makes me wonder if they are completely different scopes, not just a different power range.

The gun will never be used for hunting, only target. I will be using mil adjustments and wonder if the scope has sufficient elevation range for 1000 yards on a .308 without special mounts (just plain flat picatinny rail). my computer says that I need about 13mr of elevation to shoot 1000 yards and the 5-25 PM2 shows 26mr of elevation, but I wasn't sure if that was 26mr from zero or from top to bottom of the range. I am also planning on a FFP reticle with mil dots or mil markings, and problem with that plan?

Any help would be appreciated.

I went to S+Bs German website, and they do list a 12-50 PM scope, but my high school German isn't good enough to really understand everything, even with Google translate helping. It does seem to weigh significantly less than the 5-25 PM, but I can't tell if it available with a first focal plane reticle.

[McLarenRoss]

What type of target shooting are you talking about? Tactical UKD type stuff where a matching retical/turrets and FFP will be useful or known distance benchrest/F-Class type shooting? For the first, a S&B 5-25 will be more than enough for you and you wont get much use of the 18-25x range on a hot day with a mirage. Their PF4 fine reticule is very good and well liked by the tactical crowd. Youll thank yourself for the Mil/Mil FFP setup in a tactical match with variable power. If its the latter your shooting then look at the Nightforce BR series and the March brand of scopes with dot or other target reticles with 1/8 MOA turrets for fine adjustments at long range. Remember 1 Mil at 1K yards is 3 feet, 0.1 Mil is 3.6in per click. 1 MOA is only 10 inches and 1/8 MOA is 1.25in per click. A lot finer for paper targets where X count wins the matches. All the scopes in this class should have enough elevation to get to 1K with a 308 with a flat base but a 20MOA or 30 MOA base costs the same so you might as well get that and be able to zero closer to the bottom of your travel and have the ability to dial out farther, cause once youve mastered 1K(and you will) youll get board with it and want to see how far you can stretch the rifle. FWIW my 308 only needs 9.7 Mil to get to 1K at 4000' DA.

[brando]

Even a 5-25x is a bit overkill for a .308WIN, let alone the 12-50x. A lot of people assume it's all about magnification, but that's much lower on the list of importance. For .308WIN I would suggest the new 3-20x or the older 4-16x. Anything beyond that is going to give you too tight of an FOV among other things. Let me put it to you this way, when shooting at a mile I'm rarely above 20x and inside of 1000 yards I rarely go above 12x.