C&R handgun acquisition record question

[twitcher]

I have a C&R license. When I buy a C&R handgun over the Internet and have it shipped to my 01FFL who does the DROS and all that, whose name goes into my bound book? The out-of-state person/dealer or my local 01FFL? I would guess the out-of-state person/dealer, but maybe I'm wrong?

Thank you!

[hoffmang]

Having never done this exact transaction it is a novel question. The intent of the 03 would be the person out of state but because of CA's wacky requirements, I believe that it would actually be the 01 local FFL. In a perfect transaction, the out of state FFL would log the firearm out to the CA 01 FFL who will log it in to his AD book. Then he'll log it out to you and you'll log it in from the CA 01 FFL. However, I'd keep a record outside of your log book of who the originating seller was in case an ATF person doesn't catch the complexities.

-Gene

[twitcher]

Wow, I *had* a feeling it would all be backwards here in CA Thanks!

[zinfull]

Your FFL01 does the DROS but you put the name of the person you bought the gun from. The same as if it is a long gun. It is just state law requiring the extra step. You did not buy the gun from the dealer so his name is not used. Consignments are a little different. Some time you do not know who the owner is so then use the shops name. If at all possible use the owners name.

Jerry

[EOD Guy]

Your FFL01 does the DROS but you put the name of the person you bought the gun from. The same as if it is a long gun. It is just state law requiring the extra step. You did not buy the gun from the dealer so his name is not used. Consignments are a little different. Some time you do not know who the owner is so then use the shops name. If at all possible use the owners name.

Jerry

I don't think so. It doesn't matter who he purchased the firearm from. BATF doesn't care about ownership. They care about possession. The firearm is being transferred through the dealer's books to twitcher who should log it from the dealer.

[hoffmang]

Based on the Fact that it will go in the 01 FFL's log book and the whole principal behind these logs is to be able to conduct traces, you will want to log it in as from the 01 FFL and just have a separate record of the original seller. EOD is correct that this is all about possession - not ownership.

-Gene

[zinfull]

If it is about possession then put the ups guy down. That is who delivered your rifles. It is about who you bought the gun from. This is Federal, not State, the 01 is just a middle man for State law.

Jerry

[dfletcher]

So although use of the C & R license played no part in acquiring the handgun one must enter the handgun in their bound book?

[ke6guj]

So although use of the C & R license played no part in acquiring the handgun one must enter the handgun in their bound book?

Yes, you are required to log all C&R transactions that occur while licensed, not just those transactions in which you use your license.

[762cavalier]

So although use of the C & R license played no part in acquiring the handgun one must enter the handgun in their bound book?

You don't "USE" your license to acquire firearms. You are "LICENSED". Any C&R you acquire while you are licensed gets logged.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

It is about who you bought the gun from. This is Federal, not State, the 01 is just a middle man for State law.

It's not about who you bought the gun from or sold it to. It's about who you acquired the gun from or who you disposed of it to.

If an out of state FFL ships a firearm to your local FFL then the out of state FFL is going to log the gun out as a disposition to your local FFL.

Your local FFL is then going to log the gun into his bound book as an acquisition from the out of state FFL.

Your local FFL is then going to log the gun out as a disposition to you.

You will then log the gun into your bound book as an acquisition from your local FFL.

As was mentioned above, this whole system is about the ability to trace firearms.

The out of state FFL can not log a gun out to you but then ship it to your local FFL. He has no way of knowing if you really will ever acquire the firearm. What if you never show up to your local Dealer to pick the gun up? The original FFL would still show the gun as being disposed of to you even though you never acquired it.

[Scout106]

I put both the seller and the local 01 dealer. That way BATFE can talk to whomever they want. Print small!

I am buying from the seller while the 01 is simply handling a transfer mandated by stupid CA law and costing me an additional $50.

[zinfull]

I hate being wrong. Just got off the phone with ATF. You put down who DROSed the gun. It is all about paper trail. They informed me that I could fix my book by inserting the FFL who did the transfer. That makes it easier when I let my FFL03 expire, I will not have any reason to keep the book. It will be pretty boring because I get almost all my guns through one dealer.

It took 2 months for the ATF to reply to my email question with a " ATF cannot respond to e-mail inquiries related to technical, policy, and/or legal questions. Inquiries of this nature can only be addressed through a letter outlining your questions to the following address
I then called the local office and they got back with an answer in 2 days.


Jerry