WWI Artillary Lugar

[Decoligny]

I have a quick question. My cousin will be receiving a family hierloom in a couple of months. A pretty much mint condition 9mm WWI Artillary Lugar with Holster, Wooden Carbine Stock and a 32 round snail magazine. This weapon was taken off of a German Cavalry Officer by my great grandfather.

What does he need to do to legally bring this into California and legally own this weapon?

[thefifthspeed]

If it is from family he an intra family transfer it depending on who is giving it to him. Will it be from father to son? Not sure who is in what state but if he were to aquire it out of state and bring it back into CA he can do that as long as he reports it within the certain timeframe (I think it's like 2 weeks but I'm not sure) Also, sadly enough he cannot import the 32round mag. Have him contact DOJ about aquiring the magazine as disassembled parts without the intention of building back into a magazine so that one day he may use it again in either a free state or is CA law were to change.

And if you check it out snap some pics and post them.

[30Cal]

Does the stock complicate matters (making it a rifle with a barrel under legal limits)?

[moulton]

Does the stock complicate matters (making it a rifle with a barrel under legal limits)?

I believe that certain historical pistols are exempt from the SBR requirement; Broom Handle Mauser, Artillery luger, etc.

[Alan Block]

One more I am aware of

The Ingliss Highpower also can be had with a shoulder stock. I think the rule is that the pistol MUST have been originally fitted for a stock but that the stock you have now may be original or a reproduction.

[Decoligny]

I believe I have found my answer. He can import this curio/relic Artillary Luger into California, including the 32 round snail magazine.

a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto

A "collector" as defined in U.S. Code Title 18 Chapter 44 is pretty much anyone who isn't legally barred from possessing a firearm, acquires, holds, or disposes of firearms as curios or relics, as the Attorney General shall by regulation define.

So pretty much if the firearm is considered a curio or relic, and you have it, you are a "collector" and exempt from the provisions listed below.


CALIFORNIA CODES
PENAL CODE
SECTION 12020-12040

12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or in the state prison:
(1) Manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, or possesses any cane gun or wallet gun, any undetectable firearm, any firearm which is not immediately recognizable as a firearm, any camouflaging firearm container, any ammunition which contains or consists of any flechette dart, any bullet containing or
carrying an explosive agent, any ballistic knife, any multiburst trigger activator, any nunchaku, any short-barreled shotgun, any short-barreled rifle, any metal knuckles, any belt buckle knife, any leaded cane, any zip gun, any shuriken, any unconventional pistol, any lipstick case knife, any cane sword, any shobi-zue, any air gauge
knife, any writing pen knife, any metal military practice handgrenade or metal replica handgrenade, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, billy, sandclub, sap, or sandbag.
(2) Commencing January 1, 2000, manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity magazine.
(3) Carries concealed upon his or her person any explosive substance, other than fixed ammunition.
(4) Carries concealed upon his or her person any dirk or dagger. However, a first offense involving any metal military practice handgrenade or metal replica handgrenade shall be punishable only as an infraction unless the offender is an active participant in a criminal street gang as defined in the Street Terrorism and Enforcement and Prevention Act (Chapter 11 commencing with Section 186.20) of Title 7 of Part 1). A bullet containing or carrying an explosive agent is not a destructive device as that term is used in Section 12301.
(b) Subdivision (a) does not apply to any of the following:
(1) The sale to, purchase by, or possession of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles by police departments, sheriffs' offices, marshals' offices, the California Highway Patrol, the Department of Justice, or the military or naval forces of this state or of the United States for use in the discharge of their official duties or the possession of short-barreled shotguns and short-barreled rifles by peace officer members of a police department, sheriff's office, marshal's office, the California Highway Patrol, or the Department of Justice when on duty and the use is authorized by the agency and is within the course and scope of their duties and the peace officer has completed a training course in the use of these weapons certified by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training.
(2) The manufacture, possession, transportation or sale of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles when authorized by the Department of Justice pursuant to Article 6 (commencing with Section 12095) of this chapter and not in violation of federal law.
(3) The possession of a nunchaku on the premises of a school which holds a regulatory or business license and teaches the arts of self-defense.
(4) The manufacture of a nunchaku for sale to, or the sale of a nunchaku to, a school which holds a regulatory or business license and teaches the arts of self-defense.
(5) Any antique firearm. For purposes of this section, "antique firearm" means any firearm not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional center fire ignition with fixed ammunition and manufactured in or before 1898 (including any matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system or replica thereof, whether actually manufactured before or after the year 1898) and also any firearm using fixed ammunition manufactured in or before 1898, for which ammunition is no longer manufactured in the United States and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.
(6) Tracer ammunition manufactured for use in shotguns.
(7) Any firearm or ammunition that is a curio or relic as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations and which is in the possession of a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto. Any person prohibited by Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code from possessing firearms or ammunition who obtains title to these items by bequest or intestate succession may retain title for not more than one year, but actual possession of these items at any time is punishable pursuant to Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code. Within the year, the person shall transfer title to the firearms or ammunition by sale, gift, or other disposition. Any person who violates this paragraph is in violation of subdivision (a).

[CSACANNONEER]

I believe I have found my answer. He can import this curio/relic Artillary Luger into California, including the 32 round snail magazine.

a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto

A "collector" as defined in U.S. Code Title 18 Chapter 44 is pretty much anyone who isn't legally barred from possessing a firearm, acquires, holds, or disposes of firearms as curios or relics, as the Attorney General shall by regulation define.

So pretty much if the firearm is considered a curio or relic, and you have it, you are a "collector" and exempt from the provisions listed below.


CALIFORNIA CODES
PENAL CODE
SECTION 12020-12040

12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or in the state prison:
(1) Manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, or possesses any cane gun or wallet gun, any undetectable firearm, any firearm which is not immediately recognizable as a firearm, any camouflaging firearm container, any ammunition which contains or consists of any flechette dart, any bullet containing or
carrying an explosive agent, any ballistic knife, any multiburst trigger activator, any nunchaku, any short-barreled shotgun, any short-barreled rifle, any metal knuckles, any belt buckle knife, any leaded cane, any zip gun, any shuriken, any unconventional pistol, any lipstick case knife, any cane sword, any shobi-zue, any air gauge
knife, any writing pen knife, any metal military practice handgrenade or metal replica handgrenade, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, billy, sandclub, sap, or sandbag.
(2) Commencing January 1, 2000, manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity magazine.
(3) Carries concealed upon his or her person any explosive substance, other than fixed ammunition.
(4) Carries concealed upon his or her person any dirk or dagger. However, a first offense involving any metal military practice handgrenade or metal replica handgrenade shall be punishable only as an infraction unless the offender is an active participant in a criminal street gang as defined in the Street Terrorism and Enforcement and Prevention Act (Chapter 11 commencing with Section 186.20) of Title 7 of Part 1). A bullet containing or carrying an explosive agent is not a destructive device as that term is used in Section 12301.
(b) Subdivision (a) does not apply to any of the following:
(1) The sale to, purchase by, or possession of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles by police departments, sheriffs' offices, marshals' offices, the California Highway Patrol, the Department of Justice, or the military or naval forces of this state or of the United States for use in the discharge of their official duties or the possession of short-barreled shotguns and short-barreled rifles by peace officer members of a police department, sheriff's office, marshal's office, the California Highway Patrol, or the Department of Justice when on duty and the use is authorized by the agency and is within the course and scope of their duties and the peace officer has completed a training course in the use of these weapons certified by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training.
(2) The manufacture, possession, transportation or sale of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles when authorized by the Department of Justice pursuant to Article 6 (commencing with Section 12095) of this chapter and not in violation of federal law.
(3) The possession of a nunchaku on the premises of a school which holds a regulatory or business license and teaches the arts of self-defense.
(4) The manufacture of a nunchaku for sale to, or the sale of a nunchaku to, a school which holds a regulatory or business license and teaches the arts of self-defense.
(5) Any antique firearm. For purposes of this section, "antique firearm" means any firearm not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional center fire ignition with fixed ammunition and manufactured in or before 1898 (including any matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system or replica thereof, whether actually manufactured before or after the year 1898) and also any firearm using fixed ammunition manufactured in or before 1898, for which ammunition is no longer manufactured in the United States and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.
(6) Tracer ammunition manufactured for use in shotguns.
(7) Any firearm or ammunition that is a curio or relic as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations and which is in the possession of a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto. Any person prohibited by Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code from possessing firearms or ammunition who obtains title to these items by bequest or intestate succession may retain title for not more than one year, but actual possession of these items at any time is punishable pursuant to Section 12021, 12021.1, or 12101 of this code or Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code. Within the year, the person shall transfer title to the firearms or ammunition by sale, gift, or other disposition. Any person who violates this paragraph is in violation of subdivision (a).

Don't get legal advise from the internet! The above is a prime example of BAD advise! It is ILLEGAL to import a "high capacity" magazines without a permit! If you notice the highlighted exception does not except magazines! Play it safe and disassemble the mag!

[jamesob]

old broomhandles are exempt.

[CSACANNONEER]

old broomhandles are exempt.

Not magazines!

[Sampachi]

The Artillery Luger is exempt from the NFA and California law regarding it's SBR status. The 32 round magazine is not. Without a C&R Lic. you cannot bring the pistol in from out of state without going through a regular FFL dealer.
The snail drum magazine is worth quite a pretty penny by itself.