CA DOJ illegally requiring upload of FFL-03 when renewing COE

[Imageview]

I can’t even find where to upload it.

[EM2]

I can’t even find where to upload it.

At the bottom of the application page there is a button for uploading your driver's license, presumably you can upload it there.

[Imageview]

At the bottom of the application page there is a button for uploading your driver's license, presumably you can upload it there.

It doesn't actually have an option for FFL 03. I uploaded it there under the category "court documents" which was the closest thing. We'll see how they respond.

[EM2]

I understand we have some CRPA attorney who is a member here at calguns, does anyone recall is name?
I would like some input as to whether anyone believes I will be able to get the BoF to move on this or if I will be FORCED to upload my FFL-03 in order to get the COE.

Here is their non-response to my response...
All they are doing is reiterating that they want my FFL-03.

To bring everyone up to speed, I responded (see post 14), but got an email from the guy processing (BOFcris@ doj.ca.gov) that he could not help and that I needed to forward the email to COE@ doj.ca.gov, so I did, and this is their response.

Hello,

Thank you for contacting the Certificate of Eligibility (COE) Unit.

Per the California statutes relating to collector COEs, all mention that an applicant should be federally licensed prior to obtaining a COE for a collector. For example, Penal Code 26970, states that "licensed as a collector pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto". Additional requirements require a COE. The statutes relating to COEs are identified in PC 26970(a)(4), PC 26585, PC 27670, PC 27966, PC 31700. We will be unable to process your application without verification that you have a FFL-03. Please upload a copy of your FFL-03 promptly so we can continue with processing your application.

The FFL-03 should be uploaded to your existing application by using any available drop-down file type. For example, you can use the drop-down file type “Court Documents.” Do not email, fax or mail it to the COE Unit. If your FFL-03 is in progress with the ATF, wait until you've received it to upload it, then re-submit the existing CFARS COE application.

Kindly,

Bureau of Firearms
Certificate of Eligibility Unit

[IronsightsRifleman]

Failing to issue a COE is a clear violation of PC 26710. Consult an attorney.

[EM2]

Failing to issue a COE is a clear violation of PC 26710. Consult an attorney.

I am attempting to get them to move without the use of an attorney, start with the least effort and go from there.
Two years ago I had the same issue and emailed them an explanation as to why I was sending them my FFL, and they approved my renewal within a couple days.
This year their insistence is more focused.

[EM2]

That's what they should do.

CA DOJ has evidently told its employees to hold firm.

CRPA has been advised; looks like an 'underground regulation' but DOJ is unlikely to bend until sued.

Do you happen to know if CRPA is collecting data on this issue, or have a contact to which I could forward my email string with the BoF?

[Imageview]

Interestingly once I uploaded my “court documents” it completed in 24 hours and was approved.

[EM2]

Interestingly once I uploaded my “court documents” it completed in 24 hours and was approved.

Of course, you submitted what they wanted, I did not.

My contention is that they can ask for the FFL-03 documentation, but they are not permitted by law to require I provide the FFL-03 documentation.

[Imageview]

Understood. Although them doing their jobs even when complied with is still surprising.

I get the point you are making, I just don't have enough fire on this topic to fight them. I found the fact that they didn't even have an appropriate means to provide what they are asking for noteworthy, and just wanted to provide an update on what happened when I did comply with the request in the half assed manner I could.

[Spyder]

If being licensed as a collector is a requirement to be issued the COE, then how do you expect them to know you are licensed without them seeing your 03?

I'm opposed to underground regulations, but I'm also rational and tend to choose my battles.

[EM2]

Understood. Although them doing their jobs even when complied with is still surprising.

I get the point you are making, I just don't have enough fire on this topic to fight them. I found the fact that they didn't even have an appropriate means to provide what they are asking for noteworthy, and just wanted to provide an update on what happened when I did comply with the request in the half assed manner I could.

Understood, it is not easy, and I am constantly evaluating my position until it is resolved.

[GunDog]

If being licensed as a collector is a requirement to be issued the COE, then how do you expect them to know you are licensed without them seeing your 03?

I'm opposed to underground regulations, but I'm also rational and tend to choose my battles.

Ought to be able to just provide Sacramento with the license number of one's C&R FFL. They can look it up themselves for verification purposes. I'm sure they frequently liaise with their counterparts on the federal level at BATFE.

[nbk992h]

It doesn't actually have an option for FFL 03. I uploaded it there under the category "court documents" which was the closest thing. We'll see how they respond.

I selected that same category with my upload and my renewal was approved in less than 24 hours. I think in the email I got asking for it they said select any category. My renewal took about 10 business days to process, and I did it first day I could (60 days out from expiration).

[DrewN]

How does COE work for non 03s? Clerks and such. Do they need to prove they work for an FFL or something?