C&R Private Party Transfer Question...

[speeedracerr]

Sorry if this question has been posted before as I couldn't find it...

BUT... I wanted to know the legality of transferring a Mosin-Nagant rifle to a friend as a gift.

Does he need to DROS this rifle or can I just give it to him?

Sorry, Im a newb at this PPT stuff.

Thanks for the help!

[Mssr. Eleganté]

Sorry if this question has been posted before as I couldn't find it...

BUT... I wanted to know the legality of transferring a Mosin-Nagant rifle to a friend as a gift.

Does he need to DROS this rifle or can I just give it to him?

Sorry, Im a newb at this PPT stuff.

Thanks for the help!

If both of you are California residents then you can transfer the rifle to your friend without going through an FFL. C&R long guns that are over 50 years old are exempt from California's dealer transfer requirements.

[speeedracerr]

If both of you are California residents then you can transfer the rifle to your friend without going through an FFL. C&R long guns that are over 50 years old are exempt from California's dealer transfer requirements.

Are there any type of form I need to get and have him complete and keep for my record? or pretty much can I just give him the rifle? We both are California residents.

Yes the rifle is stamped 1942 so I guess it qualifies as older then 50 years old.

Thanks again for the help... Just want to cover myself and make sure im not breaking any laws.

[paul0660]

It would be a good idea to invoice the exchange with his DL#. Also, he can't have the rifle if he is a prohibited person (felon, restraining order, nutz, etc.)

[speeedracerr]

It would be a good idea to invoice the exchange with his DL#. Also, he can't have the rifle if he is a prohibited person (felon, restraining order, nutz, etc.)

Thanks for the advice, I'll probably make a copy of his California ID for my records...

Not worried about him being a felon or any of the like, since he's not.

Thanks for the help.

[coop44]

none of the previous post info really matters, you seem to be under the impression that this gun is somehow registered to you, it is not. If you bought it from a dealer you underwent a 10 day wait and backround check, that is all. No where on the dros is there info on the specific long gun you bought. The 4473 stays with the dealer, along with his log book.

keeping some info on him may make you feel better, but in the long run, what's it gonna do?

[My-AK47]

none of the previous post info really matters, you seem to be under the impression that this gun is somehow registered to you, it is not. If you bought it from a dealer you underwent a 10 day wait and backround check, that is all. No where on the dros is there info on the specific long gun you bought. The 4473 stays with the dealer, along with his log book.
keeping some info on him may make you feel better, but in the long run, what's it gonna do?

Can you clarify this more?

[coop44]

In other words, the specifics of your purchase are not entered into a database. This has been rehashed here many times. The state dros is only interested in how many long guns you are buying. all info on the gun is kept with the dealer.

the 4473 is the federal form (Yellow) with stupid questions.

long guns are not registered in the state of california. only hand guns

[My-AK47]

Thats what I thought but wasnt sure.. It makes sense now, so this is why you can buy as many long guns you want in a one month period. Handguns you are limited to one a month unless it's on consignment. I guess buying a crapload of long guns could spark the interest of the DOJ and ATF and they may pay you a visit just to see why you bought so many.

[paul0660]

Any gun that went through a dros is indeed in the FFL files, and ATF AND DOJ can and do make copies of those files when they do audits. Any gun that was part of a 03 collection that was audited may have been listed by ATF during an audit. Most MN's started as Century imports, and a chain of ownership would take few hours for a ATF agent with a fast laptop and cell phone.

Long guns aren't "registered", but that doesn't mean they don't know where they are. Create your own little paper trail, it doesn't do any harm.

[coop44]

Any gun that went through a dros is indeed in the FFL files, and ATF AND DOJ can and do make copies of those files when they do audits. Any gun that was part of a 03 collection that was audited may have been listed by ATF during an audit. Most MN's started as Century imports, and a chain of ownership would take few hours for a ATF agent with a fast laptop and cell phone.

Long guns aren't "registered", but that doesn't mean they don't know where they are. Create your own little paper trail, it doesn't do any harm.

actually, with repeating numbers on most non U.S. military rifles, being traceable is a little tougher than you think.
Yes, I know the century mosins have freshly assigned serials, have you ever been on the phone with century? I don't care who you are, century (like any company) will not easily grant access to anyone with a freaking laptop. Pretty hard to flash a badge over a phone.

With MILLIONS of long guns sitting in private hands in this country, The BATF has a pretty tough time. All of the auditors I have met gave me the impression that they would rather be somewhere else.

I have been through and seen several audits and not seen a copy made of a 4473, or anything for that matter. The auditor will usually check the 4473 against the bound book to make sure they match, and even then, only of random selections.


Any gun that was part of a 03 collection that was audited may have been listed by ATF during an audit

where?
what data base?

please don't spread any more disinformation and fear, it doesn't help us, and it doesn't make you important.

[Vladimir]

im a little confused, how are you suppose to know if they are a felon or nuts? Ive done private party transfers a lot, and maybe i can suspect if ones crazy... but not a felon. (unless dressed like a gang member or something.)

[coop44]

You are essentially acting "in good faith" you can only see what is presented to you, but, if you feel in the least bit odd about a buyer, don't do it. I have turned down a few, funny, they didn't get mad, they just went away.

Ankle monitoring devices are a dead give away,
so are jailhouse tatoos,
and questions about "how do I convert it"