Black powder muzzle loader back ground check?

[crazy]

Life has been difficult and challenging over last couple of years so I have not been following every new law that has been passed. I was in LGS and they had a couple of blackpowder rifles. One was a Ruger 77 and I can't remember the other. I was told that I needed to do a background to purchase. I didn't think that was the case with BP. What's the story?

[Wheellock]

There are some newer muzzle loaders that are built on the same action as bolt action rifles. You could change the barrel and bolt to centerfire, so they they don't fall into the antique status. Remington used (maybe still) to make a muzzle loader with a model 700 action, as an example.

[Flintlock Tom]

The Ruger 77/50 is a modern, in-line percussion black powder gun. Modern black powder guns that do not replicate an antique gun do not qualify for cash and carry.

[MajorSideburns]

The Ruger 77/50 is a modern, in-line percussion black powder gun. Modern black powder guns that do not replicate an antique gun do not qualify for cash and carry.

That’s not true. The reason is either the gun is built on the same receiver as a modern firearm like the previous poster said or the store just decided to implement that as policy, despite not being required by law. I’m not familiar with the black powder Ruger but I know for certain the Remington one as the previous poster described uses the same receiver as a Remington 700 so it is seen as a Remington 700 by the ATF

[Flintlock Tom]

"Modern black powder guns that do not replicate an antique firearm do not qualify for cash and carry."

If the Remington muzzleloader, built on a 700 receiver does not "replicate an antique firearm" it does not qualify for cash and carry.

So, which part of my statement is "not true?"

[k1dude]

IIRC, Bass Pro/Cabelas also requires a background check if you try to buy a black powder pistol from them. Because some felon bought a black powder pistol from them over the counter and used it to kill someone. I'm sure their lawyers told them they had to do background checks for liability protection from then on. Maybe some mom-and-pop gun shops started to do the same for liability reasons.

But yes, the centerfire vs black powder difference is being blurred by new developments in BP rifles. So some need to be DROS'd. They aren't only muzzleloaders anymore.

[MyOdessa]

That’s not true. The reason is either the gun is built on the same receiver as a modern firearm like the previous poster said or the store just decided to implement that as policy, despite not being required by law. I’m not familiar with the black powder Ruger but I know for certain the Remington one as the previous poster described uses the same receiver as a Remington 700 so it is seen as a Remington 700 by the ATF

You are misunderstanding the federal law on blackpowder guns. Modern replicas of antique guns are exempt. Modern BP guns that are not replicas of existing antique designs are not exempt.
Flintlock Tom stated it correctly.
P.S. He should know, it's in his name.

[Tallship]

You are misunderstanding the federal law on blackpowder guns. Modern replicas of antique guns are exempt. Modern BP guns that are not replicas of existing antique designs are not exempt.
Flintlock Tom stated it correctly.
P.S. He should know, it's in his name.

That is not true. Modern muzzleloaders are exempt if they meet the following criteria:

18 USC 921 (a)(16)(C)
(C)  any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or a black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition.  For purposes of this subparagraph, the term “antique firearm” shall not include any weapon which incorporates a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle loading weapon which can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any combination thereof.

[Wheellock]

Tallship is right on this one. Here is a little note the ATF put out mentioning this issue

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/newsletter/federal-firearms-licensees-newsletter-february-2005/download

And building on MyOdessa's rules, I can only be challenged by someone with matchlock in their name, because wheellocks are senior to flintlocks