Help with Big 5 C&R rifles

[GoodEyeSniper]

cash and carry only if you have C&R license, correct? Isn't there still a 10 day waiting period for people without it?

And by "take the bolt out and look down the rifle" does that just mean have the action all the way open, and look down the muzzle end? I'm gonna have to swing by again and see if they even still have any in stock. One Big 5 had nothing, another had two Mausers and an Enfield on display, not sure what else might've been in stock.

[Blue]

Sometimes if you ask they'll give you the last sale price on it.

[TRICKSTER]

cash and carry only if you have C&R license, correct? Isn't there still a 10 day waiting period for people without it?
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No, most of the guys selling C&R's at the show are not licensed dealers. If the rifle is 50+ years old and you are not prohibited from owning a weapon, you pay the cash and walk out with the gun.

[glennsche]

What shoots the biggest fireballs?? heh, thanks for that ammunition information, Trickster. Enfield also seem to be more expensive than the others around here, so might have to rule that one out.

I was a pretty darn good shot with the K98 in COD2, though...

m44s without a doubt are the loudest biggest fireball shootingest milsurp guns.

[socomIInato]

m44s without a doubt are the loudest biggest fireball shootingest milsurp guns.

enfield #5 is close

[Rem222]

[QUOTE=GoodEyeSniper;2635415]What shoots the biggest fireballs??

A Mosin carbine..M38 /M44 /91-59

Watch the private firearm sales here. I saw a nice looking M38 just sell.

[Amacias805]

earlier this year i bought a m44 mosin nagant from big 5... i payed 99 bucks for it, it was listed as 189... but they had just ended a sale for m39 i believe for 89 bucks, so he gave me the m44 for 10 bucks more since they were out of m39s (i believe)...

anyways, after thinking that i was buying the one he was showing me, he grabs one from the back (in better condition, so i wasn't gonna argue...)
point being... if the one your looking at is in bad condition, ask them if they have others, or if your buying a different one

[GoodEyeSniper]

Hmm. Went back just now, all they had were 4 Steyr M95s, and I have no clue about these guns... Mostly concerned about being able to find cheap, bulk ammo. I believe it's 8x56??

Wish they would've had some Mausers still, though.

I only looked at one briefly, the one that had the nicest looking finish, it was a lighter finish than the rest, too. But everything's so gunked up with cosmoline or whatever I'm still not sure exactly what to be looking for. Have any pictures of good/bad bore conditions?

Should I look at getting one of these Steyrs or hold out for a Mosin or Mauser??

[GoodEyeSniper]

Oh, also. I asked the gentleman if that's all they had. He said it was, but that he just got a letter saying they'd be getting some M1 rifles in....

I was a bit skeptical, and said, "M1s?? Really???" and he replied that he is pretty sure. I've never seen M1s at Big 5, or heard of it, but I'm not the most informed on these subjects. He didn't specify Carbine or Garand or anything, so not sure what to make of that. He didn't seem the most well versed on the milsurp guns, so take it as you will.

[Crusader]

Big5 carries M1 Carbines from time to time. All of them that I've seen at their stores are in just about the worst shape you could imagine, with cracked stocks, pitted metal, etc. Oh, and they charge about $900 for one.

If you have chosen to purchase a rifle from Big5, check out the new Yugo Mausers they are getting in right now. I saw one the other day that was absolutely cherry. Unfortunately, when I went back today to buy it, I found out the manager had just purchased it haha.

The other Mausers I've seen there were in good shape, with the worst one having a mildy ugly stock repair. The metal is sound and usually looks nearly brand new.

[GoodEyeSniper]

Yeah, the Mausers mine had a couple weeks ago looked decent from behind the counter. All gone now, though.

Any opinions on the Steyrs?

Edit: the Steyrs are all $95, or maybe it was $99. Either way, under a hundred bucks before taxes and fees.

[Crusader]

The M95 is a great looking carbine. I've never shot one but heard they are great rifles. The problem lies in the ammunition the rifle is chambered in. 8x56r is an extremely rare cartridge. When it is found for sale, surplus is often $1/round or more. Hornady makes this ammo now, but it is still at least $1/round.

If you wanted the M95 just to have one, cool. You won't go wrong, it's a solid weapon. It would be cool to shoot once or twice a year on special occasions or whatever. Or if you don't mind the ammo, buy it all haha.

If you wanted something to shoot a lot, go with the Mosin while surplus is still about $.20/round. A Mauser is a good choice as well (and my #1, personally) because 8mm is easy to find for about $.25-$.30/round.

[GoodEyeSniper]

Okay, that was my biggest concern. Looks like the Steyr is a no go for now. I'm not at the point where i need a gun "just to have it". If I have a gun I darn well better be able to go shoot it without checking my bank account first.

[Crusader]

Haha well in that case a 22 rifle might be best. You'll be surprised how quickly your rack up the bills when feeding a Mauser. At least that's been my experience.
Just look at this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIE5N1W0oCQ

I tried to do a Mad Minute on my Mauser, and shot about $10 in ammo in a minute 30.

If you want a military rifle that isn't too hard on the wallet, I'd say get the Mosin. It's fun, cheap, and you really can't break it. Try, $20 says whatever you do to it bounces back and hits you in the nuts. And yes, my friends and I do have experience in this.

[8200rpm]

For getting into C&R's, I'd start with something chambered in 7.62x54R or 8mm Mauser (aka 8x57mm). Ammo is abundant and still relatively cheap (~20-30 cents per round). However, it is getting more expensive with time. Once all the surplus ammo is gone, it's gone.

Sticking to the two cartridges I mentioned, you'll be looking at Mosin Nagants (MN 91/30, MN M44, MN M38, MN 91/59, Finn M39, etc.) and Mausers (German K98k, Czech CZ Brno v24, Yugo M48, etc.)

Here's a great resource: http://www.surplusrifle.com/index.asp

When looking at a rifle, I'd look at the bore as a general indicator of condition. You can take a small pen light or key chain light with you. I like the INOVA Micro ($6 at Target)...
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Open the bolt. Check to make sure that the rifle is unloaded. Place the buttstock on the ground or carefully lay the rifle on the counter. Look down the bore from the muzzle end while holding the light in the action towards the chamber.

Ideally, what you want to see are strong, pronounced lands (rifling) with clean grooves. The crown should be undamaged with the rifling should be pronounced. In a new gun, the bore is "in the white" and typically shiny.



With use/abuse, the bore will turn dark (black) from oxidation and fouling. You may also see roughness in the grooves from pitting/corrosion. The rifling will become dull and rounded instead of angled and distinct. The crown will lose the distinct rifling and become smooth and rounded from careless cleaning with a steel rod.

Most milsurps are somewhere in the middle of the extremes, but you will find both extremes if you look at enough of them!!! One thing to note about some (especially Soviet) muzzles is that they are counterbored. The muzzle is bored larger to erase the worn crown and create a new crown an inch or two down the bore. This is not necessarily a bad thing.



Just to complicate things a little more, many milsurps were stored with a generous portion of cosmoline (a preservative) in the bore. So no matter how pristine the bore may be, all you'll see during bore inspection is a large smear of greasy, reddish brown gunk. Or worse, the cosmoline may be hiding a totally shot out bore.

Ultimately, no matter how nice or ugly the bore, the only way to find out how well the gun will shoot is to shoot it. So buy the rifle that "speaks" to you from the racks. Order a case of ammo online, go to the range and have fun. If you're not happy with it, post it for sale. You can even sell it face to face since the rifle is over 50 years old. As long as you didn't get hosed when you first bought it, you should be able to sell it for nearly what you paid. The great thing with milsurps is that they rarely lose value. These old rifles are no longer produced. And consequently, the supply of these rifles in the retail market dwindles with time.