MG question

[eighteenninetytwo]

Does anyone know anyone in CA that has successfully got the ATF form 4 and whatever signed off by the local sherriff? Is it still technically at the discretion of the law or does CA have other laws that preclude that from happening even if one has a gun friendly law dept??

[jl7422]

The form 4 no longer requires CLEO sign-of. . . only that they be notified.

[CAL.BAR]

At present, ATF is denying AOW form 4's for CA as they claim it violates CA law. (we know it doesn't) and they USED to approve them, but that is the state of things

[eighteenninetytwo]

So in a nutshell, don't bother?

[emcon5]

For a Machinegun in CA you need to have a state permit, which for all practical purposes, they do not issue.

http://www.gunlaw.com/faq/30-machine-gun-frequently-asked-questions.html

Can I Legally Possess A Machine Gun In California?
Technically, yes but practically speaking, no. Not only must the machine gun be properly registered with the ATF, a permit or license from the California Department of Justice is also required. However, the machine gun in violin caseCalifornia Code of Regulations limit issuance to persons or companies who either manufacture or sell machine guns to law enforcement agencies or the military, or, provide machine guns as props for motion picture or television productions. Obtaining a California machine gun license or permit is very difficult and the various requirements include a background check and that the applicant demonstrate, by "clear and convincing evidence" that there is a bona fide market or public necessity sufficient to justify issuance. Each year to renew, you must demonstrate that you are actually operating a business.

[CAL.BAR]

So in a nutshell, don't bother?

Well, in a word... yes. Don't bother. I noticed the thread title mentions Machine gun. Don't even dream about it in CA. As for the AOW shotguns, basically, unless you have the wherewithal to sue ATF, you might want to wait before you plunge in on this.

[aghauler]

For a Machinegun in CA you need to have a state permit, which for all practical purposes, they do not issue.

http://www.gunlaw.com/faq/30-machine...questions.html

Yep don't bother unless you gots lotsa money!

Yeah ask George Lucas about his fully functional "movie props" that they use at the " fun shoots" they have at his Sky Walker Ranch for special guests only in very antigun Marin County, CA.
Purported to be one of the largest private collections of Class 3's.

[Quiet]

MG question

Does anyone know anyone in CA that has successfully got the ATF form 4 and whatever signed off by the local sherriff? Is it still technically at the discretion of the law or does CA have other laws that preclude that from happening even if one has a gun friendly law dept??

In regards to MG...

BATFE will not approve a Form 4 for a MG, unless the applicant has a CA DOJ Dangerous Weapons Permit for a MG.

In order to obtain a Dangerous Weapons Permit for a MG, you need a valid "good cause" for issuance.

Using the MG beyond the scope of your "good cause" is grounds for the Dangerous Weapons Permit to be revoked and your entire inventory confiscated/destroyed.

Current acceptable "good causes" for issuances are:
1. To import, make, sell, loan, and demonstrate to Gov/Mil/LE agencies.
2. For training and R&D pursuant to a Gov/Mil contract.
3. To import, make, and use in the movie/tv entertainment industry.
4. For repair and maintenance for other Dangerous Weapons Permit holders.

[pitfighter]

In regards to MG...

BATFE will not approve a Form 4 for a MG, unless the applicant has a CA DOJ Dangerous Weapons Permit for a MG.

In order to obtain a Dangerous Weapons Permit for a MG, you need a valid "good cause" for issuance.

Using the MG beyond the scope of your "good cause" is grounds for the Dangerous Weapons Permit to be revoked and your entire inventory confiscated/destroyed.

Current acceptable "good causes" for issuances are:
1. To import, make, sell, loan, and demonstrate to Gov/Mil/LE agencies.
2. For training and R&D pursuant to a Gov/Mil contract.
3. To import, make, and use in the movie/tv entertainment industry.
4. For repair and maintenance for other Dangerous Weapons Permit holders.

This - + my 5 cents

It is a yearly permit - you pay per "permit/license" (yes an MG permit and an MG license are separate), there are several permits/licenses within the range of a DWP.
And is not a guaranteed renewal - so you have to wait anxiously as the permit is returned.
Your inventory of permitted weapons requires a yearly tax per weapon - approx $100 or so per firearm - which may or may not add up into the $1000's.
Often you will have to retain legal representation to ensure the true around of the said permit - this starts out in the four figures.
Your vehicle must be inspected too, storage container must be bolted to vehicle - BOF
Home will of course be inspected, and they do inspect on this one, it ain't your C+R FFL.

Some will and do have different experiences with this, but, DOJ doesn't want you to have this permit, and at no time will it feel otherwise.

The ATF is the least of your concerns.