1914 dated Winchester M1897 Takedown Model 12GA, Info requested

[deoxys987]

Hey guys, I picked up a Winchester 1897 Takedown model today, at a friends pawn shop. It seems to be in decent shape, stock needs some repairs to it, and other than that it seems sound. Serial number dates it back to 1914, and it has some electro pencil numbering on it ( was told it was most likely done by the original owner as a property stamp) This one has the regular uncut 30" barrel. I know these chokes are fine with 2 3/4" shells, i'm just unsure of which ones would be safe to shoot out of it. I know no magnum or anything else considered "heavy". What would be a decent light load shell i could fire it, in terms of buckshot/birdshot? I'll probably take it to a gunsmith to have it inspected beforehand, just to be safe due to the age. Any ideas on a value, or the ammo type that would be suitable for it? What do you guys think this 1897?

[Sputnik]

Nice '97. The wood looks rough but can likely be repaired. If you really want the work done right you might consider sending it to someone like Tom at Old Western Gun Repair (http://www.dustybunch.com/prices.htm). He pretty much has the '97 down to a science.
My 1908 '97 runs super smooth.


ETA: As far as loads go you can safely shoot most any low base target loads no problem. Normal and low recoil buckshot would likely be fine, too, but I'd ask a gunsmith to be sure. I was told by Tom at OWGR, regarding my gun: 2-3/4" shells only, max load 1-1/4oz, 3-1/4 dram eqiv, no steel shot.

[deoxys987]

Nice '97. The wood looks rough but can likely be repaired. If you really want the work done right you might consider sending it to someone like Tom at Old Western Gun Repair (http://www.dustybunch.com/prices.htm). He pretty much has the '97 down to a science.
My 1908 '97 runs super smooth.


ETA: As far as loads go you can safely shoot most any low base target loads no problem. Normal and low recoil buckshot would likely be fine, too but I'd ask a gunsmith to be sure. I was told by Tom at OWGR, regarding my gun, 2-3/4" shells only, max load 1-1/4oz, 3-1/4 dram eqiv, no steel shot

What kind would be a safe target equivalent 00 buck? I saw a video of hickock45 using regular winchester 00 buck target loads out of his. I did also notice something in the mag tube when i flip it upside down theres some movement on the inside of the mag tube yet the mag tube has full spring tension, any ideas?

[Madpyro]

Nice Take-down! Mine was made in 1909, just shot my 1st cowboy match yesterday with it. was shooting Federal 2 3/4 dram Eq., 1 1/8 oz #8. it handled them, no problem. You will have a problem with that crack though, it will go to both sides of the stock fast, found that out yesterday. I repaired a similar crack in mine before taking it out, if your's is as oil soaked as mine, glue won't hold. new stocks are easily available. Once again, nice gun!

[deoxys987]

Nice Take-down! Mine was made in 1909, just shot my 1st cowboy match yesterday with it. was shooting Federal 2 3/4 dram Eq., 1 1/8 oz #8. it handled them, no problem. You will have a problem with that crack though, it will go to both sides of the stock fast, found that out yesterday. I repaired a similar crack in mine before taking it out, if your's is as oil soaked as mine, glue won't hold. new stocks are easily available. Once again, nice gun!

Any ideas how much a replacement set would be? Might need a new pump too, it has a hairline split on it, I'd like a replacement set thats identical, or close to it.

[Madpyro]

They go for <$130, depends on how nice you want, This place has some http://classicoldwestarms.com/winche...product_page=6 They sell most of the parts for them also.

[Sputnik]

What kind would be a safe target equivalent 00 buck? I saw a video of hickock45 using regular winchester 00 buck target loads out of his. I did also notice something in the mag tube when i flip it upside down theres some movement on the inside of the mag tube yet the mag tube has full spring tension, any ideas?

When you say movement inside the tube...do you mean the tube itself? They do rotate as part of the takedown process but as far as inside afaik its just a spring and follower in there.

I think any buckshot that's 1-1/4oz or less, non magnum should be OK but I'd take it to a 'smith or send it to someone who specializes in '97s for a full going over to make sure everything is safe. I use mine for Wild Bunch(Cowboy Action stuff) so all I ever use is #7-1/2 birdshot but I have some Estate 00 I keep meaning to try out. I just never get around to it.
I'm always amazed that this gun of mine is 108 years old and still runs like a champ

[deoxys987]

They go for <$130, depends on how nice you want, This place has some http://classicoldwestarms.com/winche...product_page=6 They sell most of the parts for them also.

Cool! good to know! i do have a couple questions for you since you have one also, Is there anything to look for while disassembling it that would deem it unsafe to fire? Nothing stood out for me when i took it apart. I also noticed some movement on the inside of the magazine tube when i move it upside down to upright, and the tube spring is at full tension, any ideas what it could be? or is it normal?

[Sputnik]

Any ideas how much a replacement set would be? Might need a new pump too, it has a hairline split on it, I'd like a replacement set thats identical, or close to it.

If you want that 97 running like new contact Old Western Gun Repair.
ETA: Based on some input by another member I thought I'd put out some other options for 97 smiths...Camp Verde Gun Repair in AZ does pretty nice work and I have personal experience with them. Cowboys and Indian Store in Santa Ana has a very good reputation for working on old and old west guns but I've never used them I only know by reputation.

[deoxys987]

When you say movement inside the tube...do you mean the tube itself? They do rotate as part of the takedown process but as far as inside afaik its just a spring and follower in there.

I think any buckshot that's 1-1/4oz or less, non magnum should be OK but I'd take it to a 'smith or send it to someone who specializes in '97s for a full going over to make sure everything is safe. I use mine for Wild Bunch(Cowboy Action stuff) so all I ever use is #7-1/2 birdshot but I have some Estate 00 I keep meaning to try out. I just never get around to it.
I'm always amazed that this gun of mine is 108 years old and still runs like a champ

There's something inside the magazine tube i'm assuming thats moving when i move it end to end. any ideas what it might be?

[Madpyro]

Mine was pretty nasty, rusty, dirty when I got it hadn't been shot in ?? years. Cleaned and lubed her up, tried to repair the stock (wood glue, clamps), and went shooting. If she locks up tight, and functions well with dummy shells I'd shoot it. If your uneasy about it, have some one look at it. The tube sounds like something is behind the follower, maybe a dowel to limit the mag capacity for hunting?

[deoxys987]

Pyro, hadn't thought of that. I'm gonna see if I can take it apart tonight and see what it is. Seems to lock up tight, I'm just weary of using any live rounds to test feeding, I don't have any snap caps or anything for testing.

[Madpyro]

You do know that if you hold the trigger and keep pumping it will keep shooting? FUN!!!!

[deoxys987]

Sure do know about the slam fire! Looks fun!!

[Sputnik]

There's something inside the magazine tube i'm assuming thats moving when i move it end to end. any ideas what it might be?

Is the follower being pushed all the way to the end of thetube by the spring? Is it loose at all? There really isn't anything else parts-wise inside the mag tube that should be moving...it could be something like loose screw or ...? Take the end cap off (see parts 10, 11, 12) and take the spring and follower out and see what else is moving.


eta I see madpyro may have figured it out. Good thinking on the mag limiter/dowel