1907 .351 WSL Rifle

[Mustang]

I've got a thing for the old classic semi-auto rifles used by Law Enforcement back in the day for "high risk" arrests. The Remington 8 and 81, as well as the Winchester '07, were used by State, Local, and Federal Officers to take on John Dillinger, Lester Gillis ("Baby-face Nelson"), and Bonnie and Clyde.

I've posted pics of my Remington 81...here is my Winchester '07 SLR. It shoots a .351 Winchester Self Loading round.

[Mustang]

My younger son visited over July 4th weekend and we hit the range. Shot some of the lesser fired rifles, including the 1907 Winchester. Because of some initial problems sighting in a Garand, (unnoticed loose front sight), we ended up with limited time to shoot some of the other rifles, including the '07.

I also found a source for a limited quantity of .351 WSL loaded ammunition.



My son shot this 3 round group at 50 yards with the PCI ammo. It seemed to shoot about as well as the Buffalo Arms ammo. Noted that the trigger was heavy with a lot of creep.

[watt79]

I saw one of these for sale and was tempted to pick it up. If the ammo was more common I probably would have done it. These early auto loaders are pretty cool.

[mosinnagantm9130]

I wouldn't mind having one of those, and one of the early remingtons in the future.

What's the recoil like on one of those? I can't imagine it's any worse than an M1.

[dfletcher]

My younger son visited over July 4th weekend and we hit the range. Shot some of the lesser fired rifles, including the 1907 Winchester. Because of some initial problems sighting in a Garand, (unnoticed loose front sight), we ended up with limited time to shoot some of the other rifles, including the '07.

I also found a source for a limited quantity of .351 WSL loaded ammunition.



My son shot this 3 round group at 50 yards with the PCI ammo. It seemed to shoot about as well as the Buffalo Arms ammo. Noted that the trigger was heavy with a lot of creep.

I picked up a 1924 made 1907 a few weeks back and am getting it set up. I found some loaded ammo ($60.00 for 50 rounds) from Selway Armory and am on everyone's "wish list" for brass. Everything else was an easy find.

I found an old post from a fellow who makes 351 WSL brass (sort of) from 223 brass. He cuts the 223 down to 1.380" then trims & expands the case mouth, fire forms with 2400. Seems to work fine. The main problem is that while the 223 and 351 base diameter are nearly the same (.377) the 351 rim diameter is .407 - slightly rimmed. Evidently the 1907 extractor holds the case in place and of course the hammer fall is heavy as hell.

The 30 Remington family shows some promise as "to be 351" brass. Rim diameter is a bit large, but that's easy to correct. Main question is whether the 30 Remington's .421 diameter base can be sized down to the 351's .377.

When I cleaned my 1907 for the 1st time I made the mistake of removing the recoil spring. Darn what a challenge getting it back in. This fellow has a good method of pulling it through - even then, took some work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtK4eI2RKl0

[Mustang]

I saw one of these for sale and was tempted to pick it up. If the ammo was more common I probably would have done it. These early auto loaders are pretty cool.

Ammo is definitely an issue. I've got a small collection of ammo for it, but no reloading dies.

Like dfletcher, I grabbed some ammo recently at Selway armory. I also have some Jamison and Buffalo Arms loaded ammo, as well as a few boxes of old Western .351 ammo.

[Mustang]

I wouldn't mind having one of those, and one of the early remingtons in the future.

What's the recoil like on one of those? I can't imagine it's any worse than an M1.

Worse than a Carbine...the .351 WSL ammo is based on a 180 gr bullet (vs the carbine's 110 gr bullet) and is loaded pretty hotly.

[Mustang]

I picked up a 1924 made 1907 a few weeks back and am getting it set up. I found some loaded ammo ($60.00 for 50 rounds) from Selway Armory and am on everyone's "wish list" for brass. Everything else was an easy find.

I found an old post from a fellow who makes 351 WSL brass (sort of) from 223 brass. He cuts the 223 down to 1.380" then trims & expands the case mouth, fire forms with 2400. Seems to work fine. The main problem is that while the 223 and 351 base diameter are nearly the same (.377) the 351 rim diameter is .407 - slightly rimmed. Evidently the 1907 extractor holds the case in place and of course the hammer fall is heavy as hell.

The 30 Remington family shows some promise as "to be 351" brass. Rim diameter is a bit large, but that's easy to correct. Main question is whether the 30 Remington's .421 diameter base can be sized down to the 351's .377.

When I cleaned my 1907 for the 1st time I made the mistake of removing the recoil spring. Darn what a challenge getting it back in. This fellow has a good method of pulling it through - even then, took some work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtK4eI2RKl0

I remember your 1907. I think you got a good deal on it.

I grabbed some of Selway's .351 ammo myself...glad you got some also.

Thanks for the link.

[Bobby Ricigliano]

These are neat weapons. I do not know why a 1920's lawman would field one of these instead of a Chicago typewriter though......

[Mustang]

The .351 WSL launched a 180 gr bullet at almost 1900 f/s, so they had substantially more ME than the .45 ACP. They were hampered by a 5 or 10 round magazine.

These were popular during the Motor Bandit era and I think the extra penetration through cars, etc was its main selling point, though.

[Air]

Very Interesting!

Are dies and bullets even available for that?

[Mustang]

Yeah, I think so. Graf's has 180 gr .351 bullets for about $16/100. I think Redding dies are also available for about $90

[Sabot]

I picked up a 1924 made 1907 a few weeks back and am getting it set up. I found some loaded ammo ($60.00 for 50 rounds) from Selway Armory and am on everyone's "wish list" for brass. Everything else was an easy find.

I found an old post from a fellow who makes 351 WSL brass (sort of) from 223 brass. He cuts the 223 down to 1.380" then trims & expands the case mouth, fire forms with 2400. Seems to work fine. The main problem is that while the 223 and 351 base diameter are nearly the same (.377) the 351 rim diameter is .407 - slightly rimmed. Evidently the 1907 extractor holds the case in place and of course the hammer fall is heavy as hell.

The 30 Remington family shows some promise as "to be 351" brass. Rim diameter is a bit large, but that's easy to correct. Main question is whether the 30 Remington's .421 diameter base can be sized down to the 351's .377.

When I cleaned my 1907 for the 1st time I made the mistake of removing the recoil spring. Darn what a challenge getting it back in. This fellow has a good method of pulling it through - even then, took some work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtK4eI2RKl0

I picked one of these up a few years ago with my C&R license and never got around to shooting it. I bought some ammo from Buffalo Arms and they used .357 Maximum brass. I have also heard that you can use .357 Mag dies for reloading.

[Mustang]

I picked one of these up a few years ago with my C&R license and never got around to shooting it. I bought some ammo from Buffalo Arms and they used .357 Maximum brass. I have also heard that you can use .357 Mag dies for reloading.

I'll look into the .357 magnum die issue...would be a lot cheaper than $90.

I've shot a couple of the old Western rounds. The cases split.

[dfletcher]

I picked one of these up a few years ago with my C&R license and never got around to shooting it. I bought some ammo from Buffalo Arms and they used .357 Maximum brass. I have also heard that you can use .357 Mag dies for reloading.

I got on Buffalo Arms "notify when they're in" list for Jamison brass and after they did I hopped on it - the site said "ample supply" so I clicked in "150" quantity. By the time I checked out I ended up with 65 being shipped, 85 on back order.

Folks must really be hunting for this stuff.

Between this and a box from Selway ($60.00 for 50 rounds) I think I'll be OK for a bit, but will be on the lookout for more.

I've found two pretty good substitutes - 300 Blackout and 221 Remington Fireball. Of course each is rimless and smaller than the .407 of the 351, but the dummy rounds cycle fine so far. Instead of crimping I chamfer the case mouth and seat to 1.87" OAL. The 221 case is 1.4" and Blackout 1.365", bringing a 22 case nek up to 35 caliber is a PITA.

I don't know if 357 mag/max resizing die will work, but will give it a try - great if it does.

The YouTube video and that poster have a pretty neat "brass deflector" - he has a separate video on making it. Dousn't look al that tough to make and it works well, looks right.