Load data to replicate surplus ammo?

[Bhobbs]

I am setting up my Lock n Load AP progressive press and want to start reloading 8mm Mauser, 7.62x54r and .30-06 M2 Ball. I have data for M2 ball but I don't really have data for 8mm Mauser or 7.62x54r. Where is a good place to start getting the data I need?

I have a few hundred 198 grain 8mm projectiles, so I would like to use those if possible.

[Flyin Brian]

Hopefully you have a few reloading manuals you can refer to for load data? Lee & Sierra both have pretty good info on both 7.62X54r and 8X57. I also like to check the Hodgdon site as they have plenty of data on both with WIN, IMR & Hodgdon powders.

What dies are you using? I'm not experienced with a LNL, or how they work with other dies. Just curious if you are using Hornady dies if they come with both buttons for 308 & 311?

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[Bhobbs]

Hopefully you have a few reloading manuals you can refer to for load data? Lee & Sierra both have pretty good info on both 7.62X54r and 8X57. I also like to check the Hodgdon site as they have plenty of data on both with WIN, IMR & Hodgdon powders.

What dies are you using? I'm not experienced with a LNL, or how they work with other dies. Just curious if you are using Hornady dies if they come with both buttons for 308 & 311?

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I have a few manuals but I wasn't sure how close to the original military loads they got.

My 7.62x54r die set is Lee. I think my 8mm Mauser is RCBS.

[emcon5]

There really are no "recipes", except trying to match bullet type and velocity of the original rounds.

This is true for M2 ball as well, the "recipes" that float around from various period manuals are also pretty much useless, as the powder they used is not the same as the powder you can buy today.

There were several different bullets available in surplus ammo for both the 8X57 and the 7.62X54r, based on the timeframe and country making the ammo.

The WW2 German s.S. Patrone was a ~198 FMJBT at ~2500 FPS, so look in your manuals and work up to that velocity. the WW1 load was ~150gr @ ~2880 fps.

The M2 ball was a ~150 flat base at 2740 fps measured at 78 feet from muzzle.

I don't recall ever seeing a specification for 7.62X54, but there is a lot of data for the various manufacturers here, with measured velocities here: http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo.htm

[Flyin Brian]

I have a few manuals but I wasn't sure how close to the original military loads they got.

My 7.62x54r die set is Lee. I think my 8mm Mauser is RCBS.

Ok, well the first question would be what bullet size are you planning to use on the 7.62X54r? If .311, then you should look at getting the larger expander from Lee, as I believe they only come with the .308 expander. Here is a link to the part on the Lee site:

http://leeprecision.com/ez-x-exp-303-b.html

If you are using boattail bullets, you could squeeze by with the .308 expander, but you will be using the bullet to size the neck, which is not the best for accuracy. Flat base bullets will crush the rim if you try to stuff a .311" flat base into a neck that was sized with a .308 expander.

I've had good results with H4895, Varget, IMR4064, and many others. I use the Quickload program to run the numbers on my loads, so if you have access to it, that is a good place to enter all the data and check the pressures prior to pulling the trigger IRL.

[Enfield47]

One thing I've found is that full power loads aren't necessarily the most accurate. If you tailor a load to your gun you'll be amazed at how much better your groups will be. In my 1903A3 and M1 Garand both prefer a load closer to 47.5 gr of IMR4064 than the full power 50 gr load using a 150 gr M2 ball bullet. For my M39 I load about 1/3 up from the starting point with good results using IMR4064 and Prvi 150 gr .311 bullets. The M91 likes a longer bearing surface so I use the 174 gr Hornady .311 bullets.

The plinker ammo formula I use is to subtract the starting charge from the max charge, divide by 3 and add it to the starting charge. It gets you in the ballpark pretty quickly for a good load that can be adjusted to you rifle's liking. I learned this formula from Big Bronco and it works well across all my guns.

[Bhobbs]

Ok, well the first question would be what bullet size are you planning to use on the 7.62X54r? If .311, then you should look at getting the larger expander from Lee, as I believe they only come with the .308 expander. Here is a link to the part on the Lee site:

http://leeprecision.com/ez-x-exp-303-b.html

If you are using boattail bullets, you could squeeze by with the .308 expander, but you will be using the bullet to size the neck, which is not the best for accuracy. Flat base bullets will crush the rim if you try to stuff a .311" flat base into a neck that was sized with a .308 expander.

I've had good results with H4895, Varget, IMR4064, and many others. I use the Quickload program to run the numbers on my loads, so if you have access to it, that is a good place to enter all the data and check the pressures prior to pulling the trigger IRL.

I haven't bought any bullets for 7.62x54r yet. I was going to make sure what expander I have first.

One thing I've found is that full power loads aren't necessarily the most accurate. If you tailor a load to your gun you'll be amazed at how much better your groups will be. In my 1903A3 and M1 Garand both prefer a load closer to 47.5 gr of IMR4064 than the full power 50 gr load using a 150 gr M2 ball bullet. For my M39 I load about 1/3 up from the starting point with good results using IMR4064 and Prvi 150 gr .311 bullets. The M91 likes a longer bearing surface so I use the 174 gr Hornady .311 bullets.

The plinker ammo formula I use is to subtract the starting charge from the max charge, divide by 3 and add it to the starting charge. It gets you in the ballpark pretty quickly for a good load that can be adjusted to you rifle's liking. I learned this formula from Big Bronco and it works well across all my guns.

Sounds like a good plan. I'll give that a try


Thanks for the replies.