WARNING: Do not buy anything from Roggio Arsenal, here is why

[Reconsnake]

Awesome! The only people I have ever been able to get any sort of communication from were "Jim" and "Heather". So far, it looks like my lower is the least of their problems if they are indeed out of business. I bet Jim just might be our James

[CrazyJeep]

I got hosed by a company in FL that I had sent parts to for AR pistol builds, when they suddenly dropped off the radar and went out of business. Despite promises to ship the parts back to me they never arrived and the owner is now impossible to reach.

Not to hijack this thread, but that sounds like Dana Reed in FL.

[Ron-Solo]

report it stolen. that will put a fire under their ***. ive heard of things like this happening i would be lit...

Reporting it "stolen" would amount to a crime, since this is a civil business dispute.

[SJgunguy24]

Reporting it "stolen" would amount to a crime, since this is a civil business dispute.

Just a question Ron, this involves a shipment to an FFL. I do know theft of any shipment of serialized receivers to or from an FFL makes that a federal crime. Would reporting this to the ATF be a better route?

[Cherns]

so sorry to hear about the bad luck, thanks for letting us all know.

[thrillhouse700]

Yeah I emailed them and got the same error msg. Looks like they are gone. Report them to EVERYONE. Make sure you have some sort of paper trail proving you are not in possession of your lower "Just in case."

[Twystd1]

If you did pay with a credit card.
YES you can charge it back IF the merchants CC processing bank still has funds to cover the purchase.
Cause this was fraud. And the 60 day contractual VISA / MC agreement doesn't hold in this instance. Fraud trumps the 60 day C/B deal.
And how do I know this you may ask?
I do this for a living.

Twystd1

[shark92651]

Not to hijack this thread, but that sounds like Dana Reed in FL.

No, it was John Krueger at Anvil Arms.

[Ron-Solo]

Just a question Ron, this involves a shipment to an FFL. I do know theft of any shipment of serialized receivers to or from an FFL makes that a federal crime. Would reporting this to the ATF be a better route?

I would report it to the ATF. It's not really a theft of a shipment since the FFL acknowledged that he received it, so filing a claim on the carrier is out also.

ATF may not have been advised they have gone out of business and they may be using their license under another DBA since the license may be issued to an individual. ATF will be all over that, and there may be a criminal federal violaton in that arena.

It may evolve into an embezzlement, which is very hard to prosecute, especially across state lines. You have to be able to prove they had the specific intent to deprive the OP of his property before it was sent, which will be almost impossible to prove at a state level.

This is similar to some of the problems with "Freakshow Manufacturing" on several group buys thru Calguns. People sent him money and he got in over his head and couldn't deliver the goods as promised. It is wrong and unethical, but it is a civil matter, not criminal.

Small claims court doesn't work well with an out of state party either. You can serve them with papers if you can find them, but you will never get them to come to California to appear in court. They will not extradite across state lines on a civil warrant. (We cant get misdemeanor warrants served out of state and some felonies are tough enough)

It is a sad situation and the OP will probably never see his lower or money again. It is happening a lot in this economy. The sellers had good intentions when they started, but got in over their heads and have jumped ship. This is especially common with sellers that bought/made materials or goods when the prices were high and now the bubble has burst, everything they sell is at a loss. You can't stay in business long that way.

If the deal sounds too good, walk away or be aware of the risks you are taking. I use a CC for as much as possible because of the protections they offer. You just have to be aware of the time deadlines. While vendors hate AmEx, they are the best at protecting the customer.

Aloha,

Ron

[SJgunguy24]

Thanks Ron, I always feel like I can trust your advice, I will make sure to keep this for future reference.
To the OP, take this info and run with it. Make a few calls and see what happens.

I would report it to the ATF. It's not really a theft of a shipment since the FFL acknowledged that he received it, so filing a claim on the carrier is out also.

ATF may not have been advised they have gone out of business and they may be using their license under another DBA since the license may be issued to an individual. ATF will be all over that, and there may be a criminal federal violaton in that arena.

It may evolve into an embezzlement, which is very hard to prosecute, especially across state lines. You have to be able to prove they had the specific intent to deprive the OP of his property before it was sent, which will be almost impossible to prove at a state level.

This is similar to some of the problems with "Freakshow Manufacturing" on several group buys thru Calguns. People sent him money and he got in over his head and couldn't deliver the goods as promised. It is wrong and unethical, but it is a civil matter, not criminal.

Small claims court doesn't work well with an out of state party either. You can serve them with papers if you can find them, but you will never get them to come to California to appear in court. They will not extradite across state lines on a civil warrant. (We cant get misdemeanor warrants served out of state and some felonies are tough enough)

It is a sad situation and the OP will probably never see his lower or money again. It is happening a lot in this economy. The sellers had good intentions when they started, but got in over their heads and have jumped ship. This is especially common with sellers that bought/made materials or goods when the prices were high and now the bubble has burst, everything they sell is at a loss. You can't stay in business long that way.

If the deal sounds too good, walk away or be aware of the risks you are taking. I use a CC for as much as possible because of the protections they offer. You just have to be aware of the time deadlines. While vendors hate AmEx, they are the best at protecting the customer.

Aloha,

Ron

[Reconsnake]

Thank you. I am going to report this to the ATF, because at the very least, I want nothing more to do legally with that firearm. I appreciate all the input.

[rmasold]

bump it up

[ohlone]

just saw this post, i got a roggio arsenal lower from while back, built it with DTI LPK and a UTG 6 pos stock, only tired it few times with a DTI middy upper + .22 conv few times, didn't see problem. recently i saw some bad about it around the net, i checked the one i have, here is what i foudn out

1. it only takes UTG commercial tube, no other tube fits in
2. mag well is out of spec, but mag can be inserted with a bit power

i heard from a friend that river city in sac still selling it....

[Carsgunsandchics]

i heard from a friend that river city in sac still selling it....

As of a week or so ago this is true. Still putting them on the shelf.

[Subotai]

I hope you reported your receiver as stolen to the ATF. You're on the hook if something happens. Better get with it.