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The 1000 yard range at Sac Valley - who can use & when

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  • Pthfndr
    In Memoriam
    • Oct 2005
    • 3691

    The 1000 yard range at Sac Valley - who can use & when

    This question comes up kind of frequently so I thought I would try and clarify things for everyone.

    The 1000 yard range -range #12 - is a competition range, also called the High Power range, with firing lines at 200, 300, 500, 600, 800, 900 and 1000 yards. There are 25 shooting positions at each firing line with 25 corresponding target carriers. There are NO target stands at any distance. The target carriers are designed to hold a 6'x6' target frame. There are NO steel targets on this range.

    The 1000 yard line is the only one with a cover (roof). There are some heavy steel/concrete benches at 600 and 1000 yards. No stools or chairs. All the firing lines are covered with crushed gravel.

    The range does not provide targets for the 1K range. Targets and frames are controlled by the main groups that use the range for competition. The 4 main groups being:

    Palma- long range, iron sight, prone shooters (800 to 1000 yards).
    Bench Rest - 600 & 1000 yard Bench Rest shooters.
    High Power (HP) - Short to Mid range XTC (across the course) positions shooters (200 to 600 yards).
    Tactical Long range - Kind of a combination of F Class, long range and position shooting with scoped rifles (200 to 1000 yards). Or as Ahhnother8 calls us, F'ers

    The first 3 groups keep all their target frames and targets in a conex box in the target pits of the 1K range. The Tactical group has their own conex with with their targets and frames.

    Only specified people from each of those groups has a key and/or access to their conex box, and is authorized to open up the 1K range for use.

    All of those groups have established practice days, and have generally allowed anyone, Sac Valley member or not, to shoot with them. You need only be willing to follow their planned Course of Fire (COF) agenda and rules for the day. Palma typically will only shoot at 800, 900 and 1000 yards. Bench Rest at EITHER 600 or 1000. HP at 200, 300, 600 yards. Tactical at 200 - 1000.

    Bench Rest practices on Monday.
    Palma practices on Tuesday.
    HP on Thursday only when scheduled.
    Tactical on the 1st Saturday of each month, and more often than not on each Friday pending range availability.

    To find out more details one should contact the match director for each discipline. That info can be found here:


    Except for Palma - Send a PM to Ahhnother8 for that

    To see if there is a scheduled practice check the Sac Valley range monthly calender here: http://www.sacvalley.org/SacVal/Monthly_Calendars.html

    Sometimes a person from one of those groups, or the whole group, will schedule a practice day that will not show up on the calender, such as when someone from the Tactical group will reserve the 1K range on a Friday because it becomes available. So it's always a good idea to call the range office and ask the staff if anyone is scheduled to practice on a day not shown the calender. They can be reached at the range at (916) 354-9668.

    Anyone can also shoot in any of the competitive events on the 1K range without being a member of the Sac Valley range. But competitive events have specific rules regarding types of equipment that can be used, time limits, positions, etc. So before coming to a competitive event check with the match director or come observe one first.

    The 1K range has a 2 person rule. Part of that is for safety in case something happens to someone. The other is because if one person is shooting, someone has to be in the target pits working/marking the target.

    Not just any Sac Valley member can open the 1K range. They HAVE to be on the approved list as mentioned earlier. This is because each group pays for and supplies their own targets and frames, and pays for and maintains the target carriers. When they break/get shot up, we pay for the materials and we make the repairs.

    As long as one of the two persons is a Sac Valley member AND on one of the approved lists, they can open and shoot on the 1K range if it is available. People get on the approved lists at the discretion of the match directors from each discipline.

    The target carriers are designed to be used with a 6 foot x 6 foot target frame. No other frames are allowed.

    Ok, those are pretty much the basic facts. Some of the other 1K users might chime in if I've missed something.

    Some helpful information.

    If you come to a practice session, it's best if you come with a partner. Because someone has to pull your target when you are shooting and vice versa.

    Sometimes there is an odd number of people and you might be asked to pull 2 targets.

    A stint in the pits pulling a target can last from 30 minutes to 1-1/2 hours. Bring something to eat and drink.

    Dress for the weather. Some groups shoot rain or shine.

    If you have never shot long range before, have "dope" (a drop card/chart) for the load/rifle combination you are shooting that day. Working your way up by trial and error method is frowned upon and you will probably be asked to stop shooting. If you don't have a dope card, the Sac Valley range normally has a chronograph that can be rented. Chronograph your load and then run the numbers you get through the JBM online ballistics calculator http://www.jbmballistics.com/~jbm/cg...bmtraj-5.0.cgi This will get you close and at worse will have your first shot on paper to be marked.

    All the groups will have you pay a range fee that goes to the Sac Valley range. Some will ask you to pay an additional fee to help them cover the cost of their targets, etc. On the competition ranges Sac Valley charges $5 for members, $14 for non members - that's for as long as you are on the range that day.

    All the groups are good guys. While they may be biased towards the discipline they shoot, (Tactical thinks Palma/HP use too much equipment, Palma/HP thinks Tactical are wimps for needing a bipod) if you need help they will help you if you are a) safe and b) humble about asking for help. The Palma shooters are some of the best wind readers in the game. Shooting long range accurately is all about reading the wind.

    At this time, the largest cartridge these groups allow is 338 Lapua Magnum.

    The Tactical group has no problems with a rifle that has a muzzle brake. It's part of our game.
    The Palma and Bench Rest people you need to ask. If they are shooting under the roof at 1K they might say no (they are incredibly loud under the roof).

    If I think of anything else I'll add it.
    Last edited by Pthfndr; 08-08-2013, 10:31 PM.
    Rob Thomas - Match Director NCPPRC Tactical Long Range Match

    Match Director Sac Valley Vintage Military Rifle Long Range Match
  • #2
    Barney Gumble
    Senior Member
    • Apr 2009
    • 1047

    Great post. Superbly written. This should be added to the range's website too.

    Comment

    • #3
      Requiem
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2008
      • 1725

      Thanks for this post!

      So from the NCPPRC site it looks like if a non-member (of club AND range) wants to shoot during their practice on the 1k range they can just pay range fees plus their club fee and perform the course of fire with that club correct? Or is one of those cards they hand out that say you can shoot past 2/300 yds required before that point?
      .

      Comment

      • #4
        swerv512
        Veteran Member
        • Mar 2006
        • 3076

        thanks for the awesome post!

        Comment

        • #5
          Pthfndr
          In Memoriam
          • Oct 2005
          • 3691

          Originally posted by Requiem
          Thanks for this post!

          So from the NCPPRC site it looks like if a non-member (of club AND range) wants to shoot during their practice on the 1k range they can just pay range fees plus their club fee and perform the course of fire with that club correct?
          This is correct. If you come out with the NCPPRC or one of the other groups, you do not need the "300 yard" card the range requires to shoot on the public 300 yard range.
          Rob Thomas - Match Director NCPPRC Tactical Long Range Match

          Match Director Sac Valley Vintage Military Rifle Long Range Match

          Comment

          • #6
            Requiem
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2008
            • 1725

            I've got another clarification question.... sorry to make this so complicated.

            Say I went there as a sac valley range member, are there any days when its just a free shoot at 1k or less range or is the 1k range only used when one of those specific groups are practicing?
            .

            Comment

            • #7
              Pthfndr
              In Memoriam
              • Oct 2005
              • 3691

              Originally posted by Requiem
              I've got another clarification question.... sorry to make this so complicated.

              Say I went there as a sac valley range member, are there any days when its just a free shoot at 1k or less range
              No, not on the 1K range. But if you are a member, you would also have access to the 500 Meter (550 yards) steel silhouette range. That range also has a 2 person rule. It is generally not used by any group on weekdays, and is frequently available during the later weekends of a month.

              or is the 1k range only used when one of those specific groups are practicing?
              Not exactly. As I tried to explain in the OP, if there is no regularly scheduled event or regularly scheduled practice, someone who is a Sac Valley member AND on one of the approval lists to open and operate the 1K range might call in and ask to reserve the range on an open date for their use. They have to adhere to the 2 person rule, and that person can be a non member guest.

              Example: I'm on the approved list for the Tactical Long Range group (among others). The Nor Cal Practical Precision Rifle Club (NCPPRC). We're a club independent of the Folsom Shooting Club (which owns and operates the Sac Valley range) and we put on the Tactical Long range matches. I'm also a Sac Valley (FSC) member.

              So I see there is nothing scheduled for the 1K range on Friday Sept 3. (actually there will be a NCPPRC practice that day because we are putting on a long range clinic on the 4th) I call the Operations Manager at the range and confirm that and tell I'd like to reserve the 1K for that day. He puts me on his schedule book for that day. I show up that day with at least one other person (they don't have to be a member of anything), unlock the NCPPRC conex, put up targets and we shoot on the 1K range for all day if we want to

              The NCPPRC has a rule of it's own that as a condition of using their targets, frames, etc, any member that reserves the 1K range has to allow any other NCPPRC members (and their guest) to come share the range with them. The person who reserved the range does have the right to set any COF/schedule of shooting for that since they reserved it. That person is also obliged to post on the NCPPRC discussion forum that they have the range reserved, and any specific format they are going to follow that day.

              Examples of that:
              The NCPPRC has a "standard" practice day format that specifies how much time is spent at each firing line of 10 minutes. This is so everyone does not have to spend all day at the range.

              Another is last weekend I reserved the range because I and some other shooters wanted to spend some lengthy time at certain distances specifically working on reading wind conditions. Lots of watching conditions, less shooting.

              In the second instance, I as a Sac Valley member, who is also on the Tactical Long range approved list, opened the 1K range to anyone who wanted to come shoot on it. It was not the "group" who opened it that day. And there have been more than a few times that people who have never been to one of our matches showed up and asked if they could practice with us. Not a problem.

              But one cannot just show up any time during the day and start shooting with us. Other conditions we (the NCPPRC) have is that there be a safety brief before the shooting starts that covers safety procedures and firing line SOPs. Everyone also has to sign the NCPPRC waiver (because you are shooting under the supervision of one of our people) and non NCPPRC members pay $10 (because you would be using our equipment).

              The person who reserved the range is the range officer for the day unless he designates someone else. As long as you do what the RO says, you are good to go. Just as if you were on the 100 yard public range.
              Last edited by Pthfndr; 08-08-2013, 10:35 PM.
              Rob Thomas - Match Director NCPPRC Tactical Long Range Match

              Match Director Sac Valley Vintage Military Rifle Long Range Match

              Comment

              • #8
                Texas Boy
                Senior Member
                • Sep 2008
                • 804

                Great post and thanks for the info. A nice addition to this would be suggested equipment for the various types of long range shooting.

                I'm probably like many here - in that 100 yards is the longest course of fire readily available to me. I'd love to try my hand at longer range shooting, but don't really want to purchase a 338 Lapua just to try it out. I'm thinking more along the lines of a long barreled 223 with a good scope (and maybe a bipod), since all I care about is holes in paper or rings on a gong. So how about a "here is the minimum you need to get started with long(er) range shooting" thread/post?

                Thanks!
                ...the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Pthfndr
                  In Memoriam
                  • Oct 2005
                  • 3691

                  Originally posted by Texas Boy
                  Great post and thanks for the info. A nice addition to this would be suggested equipment for the various types of long range shooting.

                  I'm probably like many here - in that 100 yards is the longest course of fire readily available to me. I'd love to try my hand at longer range shooting, but don't really want to purchase a 338 Lapua just to try it out. I'm thinking more along the lines of a long barreled 223 with a good scope (and maybe a bipod), since all I care about is holes in paper or rings on a gong. So how about a "here is the minimum you need to get started with long(er) range shooting" thread/post?

                  Thanks!
                  Ask and ye shall receive.



                  That's for scoped rifles such as used in various types of mid to long range tactical matches. They would also be acceptable for starting out in F T/R class prone matches, or just plinking at steel at distance.

                  A rifle in .223 is generally good for 100-600 yards with good ammo, a .308 will get you out to 1000 yards. No need for a 338LM.
                  Last edited by Pthfndr; 08-31-2009, 12:04 AM.
                  Rob Thomas - Match Director NCPPRC Tactical Long Range Match

                  Match Director Sac Valley Vintage Military Rifle Long Range Match

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Texas Boy
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 804

                    Thanks!!!!
                    ...the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      ocabj
                      Calguns Addict
                      • Oct 2005
                      • 7903

                      This video recorded at the National LR Championships in Camp Perry was posted recently:



                      It's the only youtube video I know of that explains how the butts/pits work.

                      Distinguished Rifleman #1924
                      NRA Certified Instructor (Rifle and Metallic Cartridge Reloading) and RSO
                      NRL22 Match Director at WEGC

                      https://www.ocabj.net

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Acorn556
                        Senior Member
                        • May 2009
                        • 2107

                        Looks interesting. I'll have to look into this more once I get my SPR setup. Coming from a free state where I could find 1000m ranges to this is fun. I'm building this rifle FOR long distance shots because I've always thought it was cool to be able to do that and I'd like to figure out how to do it.

                        Is there any of those groups that might help a shooter advance and learn about this so they don't "waste people's time not knowing what they're doing"?

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          fusionstar
                          Senior Member
                          • Apr 2007
                          • 2332

                          Originally posted by Acorn556
                          Looks interesting. I'll have to look into this more once I get my SPR setup. Coming from a free state where I could find 1000m ranges to this is fun. I'm building this rifle FOR long distance shots because I've always thought it was cool to be able to do that and I'd like to figure out how to do it.

                          Is there any of those groups that might help a shooter advance and learn about this so they don't "waste people's time not knowing what they're doing"?
                          Go and watch one of their matches. Watch how everything flows and you'll get the hang of it. Gun owners are incredibly nice people, 95% of people will help you. Then again I tend to avoid shady looking people.
                          Last edited by fusionstar; 08-31-2009, 10:26 AM.
                          If you seek peace, prepare for war

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Vu 308
                            Veteran Member
                            • Oct 2007
                            • 2565

                            Originally posted by Requiem
                            Thanks for this post!

                            So from the NCPPRC site it looks like if a non-member (of club AND range) wants to shoot during their practice on the 1k range they can just pay range fees plus their club fee and perform the course of fire with that club correct? Or is one of those cards they hand out that say you can shoot past 2/300 yds required before that point?

                            That is correct. No membership require. All you need to do is pay sac valley fees + 5.00 to NCPPRC so that we can cover our cost.

                            If you are new just let us know and we try to pair you up with someone shooting the same caliber so that they can help you with wind calls and what not.

                            The only thing we are anal about is safety. Other than that we will do our best to ensure shooters have a safe and good experience shooting long range.



                            Rob,

                            Great post. This question comes up about 20 times a month while we are out there.

                            Vu
                            sigpic

                            Please visit us @ www.ncpprc.com for more info.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              GrizzlyGuy
                              Gun Runner to The Stars
                              CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                              • May 2009
                              • 5468

                              Excellent info! You answered about a dozen questions that I planned to ask someone eventually.

                              Clarifications please on these points, my interest is Tactical Long Range:

                              Originally posted by Pthfndr
                              This is because each group pays for and supplies their own targets and frames, and pays for and maintains the target carriers.
                              If I show up and pay the fees, does that mean the targets are provided and I don't need to bring any? Or can I at least buy them there for an additional fee?

                              Originally posted by Pthfndr
                              If you come to a practice session, it's best if you come with a partner. Because someone has to pull your target when you are shooting and vice versa.
                              If I don't have a partner to bring, is it best to come alone and try to pair up with someone else on arrival, or should I try to pair up with someone in advance (via the ncpprc forum or similar)? I can get my wife out to the local "range", but 2 hours down to Sacto... not so much.

                              Originally posted by Pthfndr
                              But one cannot just show up any time during the day and start shooting with us. Other conditions we (the NCPPRC) have is that there be a safety brief before the shooting starts that covers safety procedures and firing line SOPs.
                              Is there a typical start time for the safety brief? Or does it vary for each practice session? I'd be driving about 2 hours, just trying to figure out if I need to start making motel reservations. :-)

                              P.S. - If you guys happen to have a video of one of your safety briefs available, that would be nifty-swell to watch in advance.
                              Gun law complexity got you down? Get the FAQs, Jack!

                              sigpic

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