Why do some companies recommend not shooting steel out of their uppers?

[CMBrowning]

There are two reason...one for the upper itself and one for the barrel.

As far as the upper goes, steel is known to be slightly harder than brass and the idea is that it will wear harder on parts like the extractor causing premature wear. I personally haven't found this to be true but then again, i've never done any actual scientific experiments.

As far as the barrel goes, steel doesn't obdurate as well, meaning it doesn't expand to seal off the chamber during firing as well as brass, so there is the potential of hot gas damage.

Again, with the cost of ammo being what it is, i wouldn't worry too much about this. By the time you've damaged anything (if ever), you can go buy a new barrel/upper parts.

There is also a study done by luckygunner out there somewhere....it's a useful read.

Literally none of that is true. Steel casing is much softer than the tool steel on bolts, tool.
The steel case expands in the chamber when firing. It does not shrink down after expansion like brass. Causing potential for FTE. Also the projectile is usually bi metal. You can run the rifling out of the beginning and end of your barrel with a high round count in a short amount of time. The heat of consistent fire accelerates the wear.

[langss]

I think what the OP is trying to understand is what the problem is. Well Many have said the same thing, Hard Primers, Hard on the Ejector, Does not expand at the same rate as brass.....All True. But I think the Main Reason is..... Generally The Steel Jacketed Bullet. True its very soft steel, some is even "Copper" Washed. But the bottom line is..... Its still steel rubbing against steel with hot gas pushing it down the barrel with no "Lube". Now for the guy in the field that's shooting to save his life, He does not own the gun or give a rats behind about steel on steel or round count either for that matter. But you guys that have spent Mega Bucks on your High end poodle shooter...... well it is your gun after all and Randall is very reasonable on barrel replacement. And again you might have to shoot Hundreds of Thousands of rounds to actually know or see a difference, but if that's what floats your boat so be it. As always, just my .02.

[rob1516]

[QUOTE=k1dude;21463537]IIRC, steel case is usually polymer or lacquer coated. That coating is known to gum up some actions and cause FTE's or FTF's. Especially those actions built with tight tolerances.
QUOTE]

Um, no.

[k1dude]

Um, no.

Um, yes.

This is from a manufacturers own website:

Lacquer Coated Ammo

If you plan on using lacquer-coated ammo in our AR-15, please be aware of the following. We have received many recent phone calls, as well as some rifles sent in for repair, complaining about reliability problems in our AR's. The first question usually asked is, "What ammunition are you using?" The answers to the question, as well as seeing the chambers of the rifles that were sent in are showing us that lacquer coated ammo is clogging the chambers badly.

What we are seeing is that once the chamber in the rifles gets hot, it is melting the lacquer off of the casings, and leaving a gelatinous goo in your chamber. Under continuous fire, this is usually not noticed, but once you stop, the barrel cools, the lacquer sets and you now cannot chamber and/or properly extract your ammunition. You will experience this in AR-15's much more frequently than other rifles such as the SKS and AK/MAC variants. In most cases the 7.62x39 rifles have chambers cut to the large end of the safety spectrum so that feeding and reliability is uncompromised by the type of ammunition or the consistency of the case dimensions. AR style rifles, and especially those from quality manufacturers will have tighter chambers so that you can experience a greater level of accuracy that these rifles are capable of performing. Our chambers specifically are cut to 5.56 NATO specs via Clymer reamers in all button rifled barrels, and minimum SAAMI spec .223 Remington on all Ultramatch barrels. Our rifles will provide superior accuracy, partly based on that fact.


Major brands of lacquer coated ammo we have seen are Wolf, most Russian ammo (even if it has the Remington head stamp), Norinco (or most Chinese) and most all former eastern block countries.


Our recommendations: DO NOT USE LACQUER COATED AMMO. Otherwise, be prepared for the consequences. Additionally, most lacquer-coated ammo utilizes steel cases instead of brass. BAD FOR YOUR CHAMBER.


The Consequences: Poor feeding, poor extraction, poor accuracy, and an impossible to clean chamber possibly resulting in a rifle that simply does not work.

[FeuerFrei]

The polymer and laquer used on this ammo will not melt. It's just there to make it moisture resistant.
It will scratch from loading/ejection tho.
The build up of carbon in the chamber due to the fired steel case expansion/shrinkage in the chamber can cause a build up of crud from shooting this stuff. Some gas gets back into the chamber. You'll see black streaks on the fired cases. (AR15 DI gass)
The powders used are not very clean burning either and are prone to quicker carbon buildup.
That carbon will also take a set and make extraction sticky.
Wolf uses polymer.
Brown Bear uses laquer.
Silver Bear uses zinc.
They are all lower powered compared to xm193 etc..
*Surplus old stuff is usually corrosive primed. I don't know of any current ammo maker that uses corrosive priming.

Sent using a long string and 2 Dixie cups

[BigPimping]

I tend to use steel cased ammo at times in my Del Ton. No issues ever.

[Califpatriot]

Why do it unless you are a cheapskate. Most ranges won't allow and nowhere on BLM .

Every range I've been to in NorCal allows it. Most ranges I've been to in SoCal ban it. Has to do with fires or something.

I run steel because my AR-15s aren't intended to be tack drivers. I have a precision rifle and I mostly run brass through it.

[CMBrowning]

I shoot steel ammo all the dang time. The only issue is after 1000 rounds, a circular spot of laquor will build up on the bolt around the primer area. I take my knife and scrape it off. Nothing gums up the action. Nothing drips. No failures. You guys are fools, man.

[floogy]

Most of the reasons are already mentioned. Lacquer gumming up in a hot barrel, a slightly higher failure rate and harder primers (sometimes). Unless you bought someone's stash of steel case ammo from the 80s, it's unlikely to be corrosive. There have been rare cases of corrosive primers being used in commercial berdan primed ammo over the years. Not for .223 though that I'm aware. Most of the 7.62x39 corrosive surplus ammo imports were banned many years ago because they're armor piercing cop killer bullets with magical powers.

Bottom line, if you don't reload and can shoot steel case ammo, it's not a big deal to shoot steel cased\jacketed ammo. You'll burn up your ammo budget long before you burn up a barrel. Just be aware of the potential issues and don't go complaining to your rifle's manufacturer because you got a stuck case.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[floogy]

I shoot steel ammo all the dang time. The only issue is after 1000 rounds, a circular spot of laquor will build up on the bolt around the primer area. I take my knife and scrape it off. Nothing gums up the action. Nothing drips. No failures. You guys are fools, man.

That's the primer sealant. If the chamber gets very hot it can melt the lacquer and start causing FTEs. Not going to happen as often with 10 round mags.

It's not a big deal anyway. Steel case ammo is for casual shooting and there's nothing wrong with that.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[MarikinaMan]

They do so as a warranty disclaimer.

[Jimi Jah]

My cryo-melonited AR-47 barrel was made for steel. Over 3k rounds and it's as good as day one. ARD makes it.

[SVT-40]

Any foreign made AK EXPECTS it.

Actually not.

The Yugoslavians used brass cased lead core projectiles in their domestically produced 7.62x39MM ammo.

Now every other Comblock AK yes.

[spfabrication]

Only problem I have with shooting steel cased ammo is that for every 1000 rounds I shoot , there ends up being an extra hundred bucks in my wallet. Yep, I buy more steel cased ammo with it. I will shoot it through any rifle regardless of pedigree.

[divingin]

Every range I've been to in NorCal allows it. Most ranges I've been to in SoCal ban it. Has to do with fires or something.

The fire danger and range bans are two different things. Both have to do with steel in the projectile, not steel cases.

Steel bullets can spark when hitting certain materials, which makes them a fire risk. If you have doubts about that, imagine being responsible for the NorCal or SoCal fires last year. Doesn't take much to start one.

In addition, ranges may ban steel in projectiles due to penetration/ricochet concern. Kind of depends where the ranges are, how they're built, and what's around them.

The range I shoot at had a ban on steel cased ammo for a while, until the board figured out the member who initiated the ban was full of it, and had basically invented a problem to get his way.