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Hello fellow calgunners. I am leaning towards a bolt action rifle still not sure on caliber? This will be my first bolt action and this will be strictly bench shooting. Inquiring on brand and budget is about $700 to 1k so i can add in extra cash for a mid level scope. Any advice will be much appreciated.
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Mossberg MVP Varmint 223. http://www.mossberg.com/products/rif...es/mvp-varmintsigpic
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When it comes to bolt action I prefer .308. When it comes to .223 I personally prefer the AR platform. The .308 really shines in a bolt action rifle. But that is largely personal preference.
In your price range the Remington 700 SPS Tactical .308 or Remington 700 SPS Varmint .308 makes for a nice base for a project rifle. I am assuming you want a target/precision rifle since you said it would be shot from the bench. For most hunting applications other than varmint, you might want a thinner barrel and the standard Remington SPS .308 rifle would do the trick. But for a precision/tactical/varmint/target type rifle you want the thicker barrels that come with the two options I mentioned. The stocks the SPS series come with are not that great. But there are a plethora of aftermarket upgrades available should you decide to poor more money into the project down the road. And the metal parts are fabulous, worthy of those upgrades. Or you could just run the stock that they come with. They are more than decent for the money spent.
As for which of the two, it doesn't really matter when shooting paper. From a practical standpoint, it all depends on how long of a distance you will be shooting. From a tactical perspective, in an urban environment, an 18-20" barrel will do the trick just fine. The distance between buildings in minimal, and the odds of needing to make a really long shot decrease. In a rural environment, the opposite may be true. You are going to want a 26" barrel if you live in the sticks. The reason for this is that the shorter the barrel the quicker you begin to loose terminal velocity. You can still hit targets really long distances, but they are not as lethal. Obviously less of an issue when shooting only paper. The downside of a longer barrel in real life, is that it is a clumsy thing to carry. You end up knocking into everything around you. The shorter the barrel, the easier it is to carry it without bumping into everything under the sun. So if you are just putting holes in paper, or live in a city then a shorter barrel might be more practical. I personally prefer a 20" barrel myself.
An affordable scope option is the SWFA 10X SuperSniper scope. It is a nice piece of glass for the money. Again though, if this is a hunting rifle and not a target/precision rifle then other more affordable and lighter options will do the trick just as well.Last edited by tacticalcity; 09-15-2014, 3:46 PM.Comment
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Either is a good cartridge to learn on. It depends on how much space you have. .223 can be good to learn on since it's very cheap and you can practice dealing with wind since the bullet is not very resistant to wind. Both are very common and have long barrel lives. For budget, I'd lean to .223 since ammo is cheap and you would need less money into upgrades. The .223 has a very soft recoil, so you can generally get away with a lot less in chassis and a muzzle brake really won't be necessary.Comment
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JMP, I will agree the .223 is cheaper. So price wise it is great. One could (and many do) make that argument of 22lr. You can buy a bucket full of that stuff for the cost of 223.
I tend to buy what I like, and let the cost of keeping them fed be damned. I'd personally rather have a few really nice guns in my collection, and spend the money on ammo than have a ton of guns I outgrow quickly or just end up never shooting. In my case, a bolt action 223 would collect more dust than spent gunpowder. I'd reach for the AR over it more often than not. But the .308 bolt action would see use (when I could afford the ammo) for me over 223 version when I was in the mood for just punching holes in paper rather than working on my running and gunning. Again, this is all my personal preferences. Nothing wrong with feeling differently about it.
My argument in favor of the .308, even for a beginner, is that it is a joy to shoot. It is really hard to shoot poorly with a .308 once you get it sighted-in - especially at the relatively close distances most shooting ranges offer. It is something of a can't miss rifle cartridge at distances you are likely to find at your local range. Which also happen to be distances where the .223 starts to become something of a challenge for a beginner. Others seem to be arguing in favor of the 223 because it will be more difficult to shoot, and thus force you to learn more complicated concepts of precision shooting even at the shorter distances offered by most ranges. And that's true...but sometimes you just want something that is a pure joy to shoot. For me, a good bolt action .308 fits that bill nicely. Much like a 1911 does in the handgun world. Something that is so easy to shoot, you have to try to screw it up.
When I think bolt action, I think precision...shooting at the farthest target that particular range has available. Which in my case, the local ranges don't go out very far. But the .308 round makes it a breeze.
For running and gunning, I am a big fan of the 223. But for target shooting, I much prefer the .308 simply because it is a flat round that is very user friendly.
But you are correct, ammo is far from cheap!Last edited by tacticalcity; 09-15-2014, 4:10 PM.Comment
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If I were to rebarrel my 308 vamint weight R700, I would seriously consider 7mm-08. That is a nice round, low recoil, flat shooter with good down range energy/velocity.Comment
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I am leaning towards the .308 due to one i don't have that caliber yet
i have 2 ar-15 already on an impulse buy 
a marlin 795 for future appleseed. And a few handguns in different caliber. I shot my neighbors ar-10 a few weeks past and i enjoyed the kick versus my ar-15 ��
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You know what's even better than the 308? A 6.5 creedmoor. Or even the 260 remington, but you need to reload probably for the 260. Hornady makes good factory match ammo for the 6.5 creedmoor.
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Remington 700 or a Savage 10/12 and an SWFA 10x42 scope. 223/260/6.5CM/260/308.
Seems like we all just did this a couple days ago, and a few days before that. Too bad we dont have a way to search through previously posted insight from the large pool of great shooters we have available to us......Comment
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I plan reload in later time due to time and expense. Plus kinda scared of reloading lol.Comment
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to give you a little more help on you decision:
Mfg
* Savage makes rifles in the 308, 6.5 and I think the 260 as well (dont quote me on the 260 though). Less choices for aftermarket stuff like triggers, stocks, etc. You could customize it, but again, the limitations on aftermarkets parts can become an issue.
* Remington I dont think does the 6.5 or the 260, or if they do, its very limited, so youre probably limited to the .223 or .308. I dont really recommend any other caliber than these at this point because you dont reload. A lot of gunsmiths work on 700 type actions and are easy to blueprint so if you wanted to upgrade, there is no need to get another rifle...just customize the one you have.
Distance
if you plan on shooting 800+ yards, go with something like a 6.5 creedmoor, 260rem, 6.5x47 lapua, or something similar. again, my advice is probably the 6.5 creedmoor since you dont reload yet and you can accumulate brass (SAVE THE BRASS!). The 308 in the heavier weight bullets like 175+ grain can/will go to a grand and beyond, but factors like wind and bullet drop are killer for the 308 and make it a challenge to get on target at times. If you stay under 800, then maybe the 308 is good enough, but like many people I know...once they get a taste of long range, they typically want to go farther and the 308 has its limitations.
Longevity
308 barrel life is MUCH better than the 6.5 or 260, with round counts between 4-10K. The 260 or 6.5 will go 2-4K depending on a lot of various factors (how hot the loads are, rate of fire, etc).
Recoil
The 308 without the brake, although manageable, is still a little taxing on the shoulder, especially if you like to put a lot of rounds downrange. Put a brake on it, and its not so bad at all, but your colleagues will despise you . The 260 and 6.5 will probably not need a brake, but you could put one on to make it feel almost like a .223. Most stock rifles will not have a brake. I think Remington makes a 308 with a threaded muzzle though. Not sure which model it is though. I try to minimize the recoil as I like to shoot a lot and a bruised/sore shoulder sucks and could cause bad shooting habits like flinching.
Ammo
308 will have the best choices since its a popular round by far. The 6.5 creedmoor is picking up steam, but there is only a couple/few places to get good factory match ammo, hornady being one of them. The 260 remington has a few more choices, but you will pay for it. the 6.5 and 260 are most beneficial when/if you can reload. I can load match 308 ammo for about $0.42/round, FYI. My 6.5 creedmoor is around $0.48-$0.62 depending on the components I choose, but it is match quality ammo. Not sure on the 260 rem, but it will be similar to the 6.5 creedmoor.
Accuracy, Bullet Drop & Wind
All these can be tack drivers as far as accuracy goes. Each will have match ammo offerings to attain good accuracy, but the only way to really optimize it is to reload and work a load up for you rifle. All are capable of shooting sub-MOA, and even sub- 1/2" MOA or better.
Wind is a different story. The 6.5 and 260 will have the edge with its higher BC bullet offerings. The 308, although typically heavier, suffers a bit in the wind, especially at distance. It simply doesnt have the bullet BC that the 6.5mm caliber bullets have.
Bullet drop is also a problem when going out to longer distances with the 308. The 6.5 and 260 beat it hands down out to distance. Up close, the 308 is fine though for government work
You know my choice, which is the 6.5 creedmoor.
Now...to throw a monkey wrench in the picture, maybe consider 300 Win Mag! Lots of factory rifles in this cartridge. It will be a little more expensive to shoot, but performance wise with the right bullet, you can get EXCELLENT performance with this. Recoil will be more, but nothing a brake cant help alleviate a bit, you can go out to LONG distances. If you're just target shooting though, one would argue why you need the 300 win mag when you have the 6.5mm calibers that can perform out to 1000+ yards, which is what most people max out at as far as distance goes or accessibility. The 300 Win Mag will probably take most game we have on the North American continent.
Now, if this still scares, you...go with a 308 remington 700, shoot the hell out of it, then when/if you want to upgrade, you can with relative ease.
okay, im done typing.
Last edited by bsumoba; 09-15-2014, 7:35 PM.Comment
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