What is MOA?

[Garandimal]

OK, I have to ask, shouldn't a Lance Corporal in the Marine Corp. know what MOA is?
I am seriously not trying to be a smart a**, but isn't this covered in a Marines basic rifle training?

The 'new' Corps...

(Snipers use 'mils')

...We just learn sight alignment...

W/o MOA? How do you explain wind correction or 'clicks'?




GR

[6mmintl]

64physhy 64physhy Senior Member and LCpl Kutches LCpl Kutches

We (both of you and I ) are riflemen, non U. S M. C. people lack basic skills in shooting accurately no matter what the distance.

[JMP]

It's not. I'm sure Snipers learn about it in Sniper school, but it isn't covered in boot camp.

I thought the military used MRADs. Here's the MRAD measurements:

100 yards Tan(1/1000) x 3600" = 3.600"
200 yards Tan(1/1000) x 7200" = 7.200"
300 yards Tan(1/1000) x 10800" = 10.800"
400 yards Tan(1/1000) x 14400" = 14.400"
500 yards Tan(1/1000) x 18000" = 18.000"
600 yards Tan(1/1000) x 21600" = 21.600"
700 yards Tan(1/1000) x 25200" = 25.200"
800 yards Tan(1/1000) x 28800" = 28.800"
900 yards Tan(1/1000) x 32400" = 32.400"
1000 yards Tan(1/1000) x 36000" = 36.000"
1100 yards Tan(1/1000) x 39600" = 39.600"
1200 yards Tan(1/1000) x 43200" = 43.200"
1300 yards Tan(1/1000) x 46800" = 46.800"
1400 yards Tan(1/1000) x 50400" = 50.400"
1500 yards Tan(1/1000) x 54000" = 54.000"
1600 yards Tan(1/1000) x 57600" = 57.600"
1700 yards Tan(1/1000) x 61200" = 61.200"
1800 yards Tan(1/1000) x 64800" = 64.800"
1900 yards Tan(1/1000) x 68400" = 68.400"
2000 yards Tan(1/1000) x 72000" = 72.000"
2100 yards Tan(1/1000) x 75600" = 75.600"
2200 yards Tan(1/1000) x 79200" = 79.200"
2300 yards Tan(1/1000) x 82800" = 82.800"
2400 yards Tan(1/1000) x 86400" = 86.400"
2500 yards Tan(1/1000) x 90000" = 90.000"
2600 yards Tan(1/1000) x 93600" = 93.600"
2700 yards Tan(1/1000) x 97200" = 97.200"
2800 yards Tan(1/1000) x 100800" = 100.800"
2900 yards Tan(1/1000) x 104400" = 104.400"
3000 yards Tan(1/1000) x 108000" = 108.000"

[Phaedrus2129]

A moa is an extinct flightless bird from New Zealand.

[gwgn02]

hey Moa! knyuk knyuk

[kalimus]

Minute of Arc

[someoneeasy]

It's not. I'm sure Snipers learn about it in Sniper school, but it isn't covered in boot camp. We just learn sight alignment, sight picture, safety, trigger control, breathing, etc and how to make windage/elevation adjustments to get the rounds center mass. I don't remember learning anything about MOA when I was a recruit 23 years ago, and I know it wasn't taught when I was a D.I.

It wasn't covered when I was in either. We never used any form of optics, just iron sights. It was clicks to adjust for our elevation and windage. First time I ever heard of MOA was after being on calguns, haha

I'm not sure what they have recruits qualify with now, but I know you qualify with what you're issued so I think they started having Marines qualify with the ACOG.

I remember when qualifying, I was shooting next to a recon Marine who was issued the M4 so he had to qualify with the M4. He was good out to 300 yards, but was having issues at 500 yards.

[chomomo]

Marines dont need scopes.

[QUOTE=someoneeasy;12588032]It wasn't covered when I was in either. We never used any form of optics, just iron sights. It was clicks to adjust for our elevation and windage. First time I ever heard of MOA was after being on calguns,


Pretty much this devil dick. Windage, elevation, trigger control, and breathing were the key points emphasized back in the 90's when I went through MCRD in San Diego. The range coaches would hit up the same key points for yearly 2 week qualification. Also remember when you fire some else's, that weapon and scope is zeroed into to that individual.

[rm1911]

[QUOTE=chomomo;12589521]

It wasn't covered when I was in either. We never used any form of optics, just iron sights. It was clicks to adjust for our elevation and windage. First time I ever heard of MOA was after being on calguns,


Pretty much this devil dick. Windage, elevation, trigger control, and breathing were the key points emphasized back in the 90's when I went through MCRD in San Diego. The range coaches would hit up the same key points for yearly 2 week qualification. Also remember when you fire some else's, that weapon and scope is zeroed into to that individual.

maybe off topic, but that kinda raises an interesting question for me. if I sight in a scoped rifle, let's say at 100yds, if someone else shoots that rifle, theoretically the crosshair on the target at 100 should be the same, depending of course on shooter skill, etc.

why wouldn't the same hold true for irons? I imagine a six oclock hold versus center target hold, but theoretically, wouldn't the same sight picture (which is supposed to be the same) with an aperture/mil post set up, like on my garand, be the same POI regardless the shooter?

I get mechanical zero versus sighting in. I've done that. but once set, the sight picture is done right is the sight picture either way. what would be different regarding irons? and I'm asking out of lack of knowledge and out of curiosity.

[chomomo]

The reason being is that everyone is unique. Eyesight, stance, shooting positions(s), training, body size, weight, and height. This is crucial when viewing down iron sights and or a scope.

[DaveInOroValley]

I was told MOA is an acronym for GOD.

Mother Of All

[LCpl Kutches]

In the Marine Corps I learned clicks. Adjusting clicks up or down and right or left.

My shots were measured by what I could hit black with iron sites at 100 yrds, 300 yards, 500 yards and then the walk in at 100 yrds. Muscle usage, dry firing, parade sling adjustment, sitting, standing, prone, bone structure usage, unsupported shooting and supported shooting.

Keeping my distance shots relaxed, and always saying "breath in, breath out, slow steady squeeze, slow and Release.

Terms like Moa I have never heard of before, I at least don't remember it.

But its a good idea to learn new things and understand better how to understand how to shoot.

[RuggedJay]

In the Marine Corps I learned clicks. Adjusting clicks up or down and right or left.

My shots were measured by what I could hit black with iron sites at 100 yrds, 300 yards, 500 yards and then the walk in at 100 yrds. Muscle usage, dry firing, parade sling adjustment, sitting, standing, prone, bone structure usage, unsupported shooting and supported shooting.

Keeping my distance shots relaxed, and always saying "breath in, breath out, slow steady squeeze, slow and Release.

Terms like Moa I have never heard of before, I at least don't remember it.

But its a good idea to learn new things and understand better how to understand how to shoot.

This is the key part here. MOAs and MILS are ways to understand how well a rifle or a person shoots. But the actual act of shooting has less to do with understanding MOA or MILS than it does with knowing how to carry out fundamentals of sight picture, breath control, trigger control, etc. As evidenced by the OPs story you can be an excellent shooter without knowledge of MILS or MOA.

Knowing MILS or MOA comes more into play if you are adjusting the elevation/windage adjustments on your scope to compensate for bullet drop and wind at further distances.

MOAs and Milliradians are simply different measurement scales of how precisely our shots are grouping.

The MOA is based on the 360 degrees of a circle subdivided into its smallest part. Each degree of the circle is further divided into 60 minutes of angle which roughly corresponds to an inch at 100yards. 1 MOA is 1.035"

Milliradians or "mils" is based on taking a complete circle then subdividing it into 1000 equally sized pie pieces. 1 Mil is about 3.5 MOAs or 3.5"

[ducky_0811]

In the Marine Corps I learned clicks. Adjusting clicks up or down and right or left.

My shots were measured by what I could hit black with iron sites at 100 yrds, 300 yards, 500 yards and then the walk in at 100 yrds. Muscle usage, dry firing, parade sling adjustment, sitting, standing, prone, bone structure usage, unsupported shooting and supported shooting.

Keeping my distance shots relaxed, and always saying "breath in, breath out, slow steady squeeze, slow and Release.

Terms like Moa I have never heard of before, I at least don't remember it.

But its a good idea to learn new things and understand better how to understand how to shoot.

normally I would let it fly...but I cant, I'm SURE you mean 200/300/500, bc the only 100 yd firing done during quals in the movers at 100 during table 2 fires. you also didnt learn the same "click" adjustments the others are talking about, you are referring to the RCO, unless you are a reservists (which I suspect bc you're located in SF) and dont have RCO's on your rifles. in which case you only shoot the table 1 qual KD course every other year. regardless of that, sounds like you remembered what your PMI taught you just fine, keep em in the black!

oh, and dont worry about trying to shoot MOA with ANY standard service rifle (m16A4,M4A1), esp with issued m855 ammo, these rifles are only required to hold 4" at 100 from the factory. thats why our Able targets are 12", you only need to be a 3MOA shooter to hit black

[LCpl Kutches]

I wasn't reserve. I have 62% lung capacity and was involuntarily separated from active duty service, Honorably Medically.

I learned on iron sites, but went through SOI/MCT with Rco's.

Forgive my memory, I had a cerebral brain hemmorage and have a bit of trouble being exact on specifics anymore.

Just left 29 palms a few months back.

Thank you all for helping to explain this better. It makes more sense.
MOA, just meant to shoot smaller groupings.