Muzzle devices

[BucDan]

Any reason to having a flash hider on a bolt gun?

I was considering a 16" 308 setup. I feel that a brake would be too obnoxious as a 16" is loud already as is.

Maybe to help control concussion? Or just run it with a crown or thread protector and call it a day? Hunting rifle setup.

[1savage99]

If you really like short and loud, it maybe helpful for your second shot in low light conditions. I find a 16 bolt action doesn’t point well, myself I’d go longer to 20inches in a hunting rifle.

[BucDan]

16" not pointing well is an interesting observation. My thought was just going as light as possible for shots inside 500 yards.

[newbutold]

Info on brush guns: https://www.fieldandstream.com/how-t...ns-from-field/

Good luck.

[Trapper]

16" not pointing well is an interesting observation. My thought was just going as light as possible for shots inside 500 yards.

A 308 with a 16” barrel wouldn’t generate enough velocity for reliable expansion with CA approved, lead free hunting bullets past 300yds. Even if you were able to get 2650 FPS with a 150gr TTSX you’d be down to 2,000 by 300 yards and wouldn’t get the performance needed for hunting at longer distances. It’s a great cartridge but it won’t get you to 500yds.

[sigstroker]

Why would you get a bolt action with a threaded muzzle?

Some come that way for other states where you can screw on a silencer, but most do not. The ones that do just about always come with a thread protector.

[JackEllis]

16" not pointing well is an interesting observation. My thought was just going as light as possible for shots inside 500 yards.

If you really need light, get a carbon barrel that's 20" or longer.

I agree with Trapper. Velocity is your friend with copper ammunition, although if you're going for deer, a 120 grain copper .308 bullet is about as effective as a 150 grain lead pill.

[BucDan]

I'll keep that in mind. If I have to keep the shots under 300, that's fine as well.

Why would you get a bolt action with a threaded muzzle?

Some come that way for other states where you can screw on a silencer, but most do not. The ones that do just about always come with a thread protector.

I already bought the gun long ago, and it came that way. Figured if I were to lighten the gun a bit, I'd layout my options between cutting it, selling it, rebarreling it, to make it less unwieldy.

If you really need light, get a carbon barrel that's 20" or longer.

I agree with Trapper. Velocity is your friend with copper ammunition, although if you're going for deer, a 120 grain copper .308 bullet is about as effective as a 150 grain lead pill.

I'm just hoping to keep it around 10 lbs or less. Not trying to sound like a wimp, but not going to make myself struggle for no reason either.

[ar15barrels]

If I have to keep the shots under 300, that's fine as well.

Go with a 130gr or 110gr TTSX in a 16" 308.
Most people want 2200fps or better impact velocity with Barnes bullets for reliable expansion.
Barnes says you need 2000 but if you look at the tests of the bullets at various impact velocities, you can pick where you want to be.

At 2745fps muzzle velocity with a 130ttsx, you have 2200fps at 220yds and are down to 2000fps at 310yds.
At 2963fps muzzle velocity with a 110ttsx, you have 2200fps at 250yds and are down to 2000fps at 330yds.
These ballistics are at standard atmosphere.
It gets a little better as you gain altitude.

 Tabular trajectory data at Std.ICAO Atmosphere
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Gun / Ammunition : .308 Win. (SAAMI)
 Bullet Type      : .308, 110, Barnes TTSX 30362
 Bullet Weight    : 110 grains or 7.13 Grams
 Muzzle Velocity  : 2963 fps
 Twist Length     : 11.0 in.  (RH)
 Gyro.  Stability : 2.1
 Crosswind Speed  : 10.0 Mph 
 Ballistic Coefficient(s) (G1) :
 C1_1=0.295@V>0 fps;


 Optimum trajectory information : 
 Optimum sight-in range (X) = 214 Yds. 
 with max. ordinate above LOS at range (M)= 129 Yds.
 and max. point blank range (P)= 246 Yds.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Sight-in clicks, 1 click = 4.0 cm/100 m or 1.575 in/100 m
 Height of sight above bore axis = 5.0 cm or 1.969 inch
 Gun is zeroed-in at 100 yds,
 by sighting-in at level firing
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Range  Velo Time of  Energy   Path   Spin / Wind-  Total  Sight correction  Target
        city  flight            to     dage, Wind    drop   for setting new   lead
                                LOS    of 10.0 Mph             zero range     33 fps
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
·Yards   fps     s    ft.lbs.   in.    in.     MOA     in.   Clicks     MOA     yds ·
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|    0  2963  0.0000   2145    -2.0    0.0   -----     0.0   ------    -----    0.00
|   10  2930  0.0101   2098    -1.6    0.0   -0.03     0.0    +10.9   +15.06    0.11
|   20  2898  0.0204   2052    -1.2    0.0   -0.14     0.1     +4.3    +5.85    0.22
|   30  2866  0.0309   2006    -0.9   -0.1   -0.25     0.2     +2.1    +2.91    0.34
|   40  2834  0.0414   1962    -0.6   -0.1   -0.36     0.3     +1.1    +1.55    0.45
|   50  2802  0.0521   1918    -0.4   -0.2   -0.46     0.5     +0.6    +0.81    0.57
|   60  2771  0.0629   1876    -0.2   -0.4   -0.57     0.7     +0.3    +0.39    0.69
|   70  2740  0.0739   1834    -0.1   -0.5   -0.67     1.0     +0.1    +0.16    0.81
|   80  2709  0.0850   1792     0.0   -0.6   -0.78     1.4      0.0    +0.03    0.93
|   90  2678  0.0961   1752     0.0   -0.8   -0.88     1.7      0.0    -0.01    1.05
M   93  2669  0.0995   1740     0.0   -0.9   -0.91     1.8      0.0    -0.01    1.09
X  100  2647  0.1074   1712     0.0   -1.0   -0.98     2.1      0.0     0.00    1.18
|  110  2617  0.1189   1673     0.0   -1.2   -1.07     2.6      0.0    +0.05    1.30
|  120  2587  0.1304   1635    -0.1   -1.5   -1.17     3.1     +0.1    +0.13    1.43
|  130  2557  0.1421   1597    -0.3   -1.7   -1.26     3.7     +0.2    +0.24    1.55
|  140  2527  0.1538   1560    -0.5   -2.0   -1.36     4.3     +0.3    +0.37    1.68
|  150  2498  0.1657   1524    -0.8   -2.3   -1.45     5.0     +0.4    +0.51    1.81
|  160  2468  0.1776   1488    -1.1   -2.6   -1.53     5.7     +0.5    +0.67    1.94
|  170  2439  0.1897   1453    -1.5   -2.9   -1.63     6.5     +0.6    +0.84    2.07
|  180  2410  0.2020   1419    -1.9   -3.3   -1.73     7.4     +0.7    +1.02    2.21
P  182  2404  0.2045   1412    -2.0   -3.3   -1.75     7.5     +0.8    +1.06    2.24
|  190  2381  0.2145   1385    -2.4   -3.7   -1.83     8.3     +0.9    +1.22    2.35
|  200  2353  0.2272   1352    -2.9   -4.1   -1.94     9.2     +1.0    +1.42    2.48
|  210  2324  0.2401   1320    -3.6   -4.5   -2.06    10.3     +1.2    +1.64    2.63
|  220  2296  0.2531   1288    -4.2   -5.0   -2.17    11.4     +1.4    +1.86    2.77
|  230  2268  0.2663   1257    -5.0   -5.5   -2.29    12.5     +1.5    +2.10    2.91
|  240  2241  0.2797   1226    -5.8   -6.1   -2.41    13.8     +1.7    +2.34    3.06
|  250  2213  0.2932   1196    -6.7   -6.6   -2.53    15.1     +1.9    +2.59    3.21
|  260  2186  0.3069   1167    -7.7   -7.2   -2.65    16.5     +2.1    +2.84    3.36
|  270  2158  0.3208   1138    -8.7   -7.8   -2.77    17.9     +2.3    +3.10    3.51
|  280  2131  0.3348   1110    -9.8   -8.5   -2.89    19.4     +2.5    +3.37    3.66
|  290  2104  0.3490   1082   -11.0   -9.1   -3.01    21.0     +2.7    +3.65    3.82
|  300  2078  0.3633   1055   -12.3   -9.8   -3.13    22.7     +2.9    +3.93    3.97
|  310  2051  0.3777   1028   -13.6  -10.5   -3.25    24.5     +3.1    +4.21    4.13
|  320  2025  0.3924   1002   -15.0  -11.3   -3.37    26.3     +3.3    +4.50    4.29
|  330  1999  0.4071    976   -16.5  -12.0   -3.49    28.2     +3.5    +4.79    4.45
|  340  1973  0.4218    951   -18.0  -12.8   -3.60    30.1     +3.7    +5.09    4.61
|  350  1947  0.4369    926   -19.7  -13.6   -3.72    32.2     +3.9    +5.39    4.78
|  360  1921  0.4523    902   -21.4  -14.5   -3.84    34.4     +4.1    +5.71    4.95
|  370  1896  0.4679    878   -23.3  -15.4   -3.97    36.6     +4.4    +6.03    5.12
|  380  1871  0.4839    855   -25.3  -16.4   -4.11    39.0     +4.6    +6.37    5.29
|  390  1846  0.5001    832   -27.3  -17.4   -4.25    41.5     +4.9    +6.71    5.47
|  400  1821  0.5166    811   -29.5  -18.4   -4.40    44.1     +5.1    +7.07    5.65
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
M = Peak vs. L.O.S, X = Set Zero, P = Max. Point Blank Range
Elevation above Angle of Site (0.0 deg.)  = 0.0655 deg.

[BucDan]

Thank you for the insight, Randall. Is that something you figured out? Or you have a cool app to help with that?

I was considering dumping and going to 6.5CM instead with an 18" barrel.

[yacko]

Thats an app called quickload.

[Donnovin]

Hammer Bullets has a line of copper solids called Hammer Hunter that are specifically designed to reliably expand down to 1800fps. Nice range of weights in .308.

https://hammerbullets.com/product-tag/308/

[ar15barrels]

Thank you for the insight, Randall. Is that something you figured out? Or you have a cool app to help with that?

I use quickload to estimate velocity at barrel length and quicktarget for the external ballistics.

[ar15barrels]

Hammer Bullets has a line of copper solids called Hammer Hunter that are specifically designed to reliably expand down to 1800fps.

Barnes still expand at 1800 too, but the expansion gets geometrically better as the impact velocity gets higher.
That's why people want to be over 2000 or 2200fps.

[AlexRod85]

Well yea i agree to you..