Please Help Me Decide First Bolt Action

[Tehjosheh]

I've been researching, searching, reading, and watching and I've decided I would appreciate some input on selecting my first bolt action.

Purpose: entry to hunting,target bench shooting @ distance

Caliber: .308win

Goals:
-Under 7.5 lbs without scope
-Hit silhouettes at ~750 yrds
-Ability to shoot in relatively quick sucession while maintaining decent, silhouette level accuracy (5 shots in 10min or quicker)

Nice to haves:
-Detachable magazine
-Under $750
-ideally all of the above out of the box. I don't mind swapping my own parts buy don't want to take a dremel to things

Prospects:
-I'm thinking a 22 - 26 inch barrel
-considering the Tikka T3x series. The lite seems great for walking around but not great for multiple shots. The varmint is the opposite. They seem to have what I want mostly out of the box
-I'm also considering the Rem 700 series. Thought about an adl or sps. Would these meet my distance goal out of the box? I hear many start with adl and swap out stocks and other mods. I wonder if at this price after mods I could have just gotten an out of the box that meets my goals

I'm open to other suggestions, any advice is appreciated!

[JackEllis]

You typically don't want to lug a bench rifle out in the field and using a field rifle for bench shooting limits you to maybe a handful of shots before you need to let the rifle cool.

The T3X is a good field rifle - reasonably priced, light, smooth action, good shooter. Tikka fixed some of the shortcomings in the T3 line, including a quieter stock. I have two T3 Lites and they're good for maybe 3 or 4 shots in warm weather before I have to set them down.

I also have a Howa 1500 in .223 that outshoots my Tikka in .223. It's a heavy barrel model with a bench-style stock and it is not something you want to lug around in the field.

My suggestion: get yourself one rifle for hunting and a second rifle for bench shooting. If you want a rifle that does it all, be prepared to accept compromises. These days you don't have to spend a king's ransom to get a good shooter (unless you want to).

Having said all that, consider either a .243 or a 6.5 Creedmoor for bench shooting. A .308 is adequate and suitable for anything you'd want to hunt in California smaller than an elk.

[Preston-CLB]

I very recently went through this. After looking at various rifles and price points I just DROS'd a Savage Model 10 Hunter XP in .223. The same model line lists 22-250, .243, and .308 as available calibers, along with .223. it has a 22" barrel, adjustable trigger, wood stock, and comes with a Nikon 3x9 40 scope attached.

It's a very nice rifle for the price. More in this CG thread.
-P

[rm1911]

[vintagearms]

Tikka Varmint with aftermarket stock so you can run AICS mags.

https://forum.snipershide.com/threads/aftermarket-stock-options-for-tikka-t3.6534558/

[sigstroker]

I sort of went through this same decision making process lately but my budget was more flexible. What I didn't like about the ordinary T3x Lite was the comb was very low. It felt like using a scope would make it difficult to get any kind of decent cheek weld. I ended up with a T3x SuperLite, which has a different stock, and also a price tag of $900+ for the stainless one. I've never seen a Varmint version, so they might have a better stock.

I'm going to suggest... a Savage. New Savage models from the last couple of years are very smooth. Older ones are certainly not. If you're going to consider a Savage, you should play with one to make sure it handles the way you want. This model:

https://savagearms.com/content?p=firearms&a=product_summary&s=57006

has an msrp of 799 but you'll certainly be able to find one under your price cap. It has a stock with adaptable pieces to make the stock fit you, a barrel that's thick enough to handle some bench sessions (you can tell because it has a threaded muzzle), a tacticool bolt handle, a 20 moa scope rail, and takes AICS magazines, all in 7.38 pounds. It's ready to go out of the box - no stock replacement needed, a rail already mounted, and a fairly decent trigger. Add scope and rings and go.

edit: forgot that Savage has a 10% rebate going now also.

[ar15barrels]

I've been researching, searching, reading, and watching and I've decided I would appreciate some input on selecting my first bolt action.

Purpose: entry to hunting,target bench shooting @ distance

Caliber: .308win

Goals:
-Under 7.5 lbs without scope
-Hit silhouettes at ~750 yrds
-Ability to shoot in relatively quick sucession while maintaining decent, silhouette level accuracy (5 shots in 10min or quicker)

Your goals are unrealistic at your desired rifle weight.
Either reduce the round count to 2 shots per 10 minutes or dramatically increase the target size or increase the weight to 10 lbs before scope.
Any of those changes would make it more viable set of requirements that could actually be filled.

[Whiterabbit]

I imagine shortening the barrel to 20" would help alot. Get closer to 8 lb.

skipping the DBM would also help "enforce" slower rates of fire, and make more sense for a hunting rifle anyways.

Add a leupold with CDS or similar that encourages more hunting like use and less target like use will also make the rifle make more sense, so you don;t set yourself up for disappointment.

Ultimately you are buying yourself a compromise rifle, and that's OK. Just be realistic about what you are getting and what you are giving up.

[Featureless]

Look at Savage. Underrated accurate, quality rifles at affordable prices.

[ar15barrels]

I imagine shortening the barrel to 20" would help alot. Get closer to 8 lb.

It would, but at the detriment to 750yd windage call and being able to consistently stay on a 20" wide B27 Silhouette with a 308.

[Novak77]

I own several Tikka's and all of them are shooters. As someone suggested above, maybe check out 6.5CM

[Tehjosheh]

All, thank you for the input; very much appreciated. I very much see the compromise in my goals. I see two paths: 1) relax all of them (up to 8.5 lbs and maybe out to say, 500 yrds, slow down fire) or 2) get two separate rifles (one for bench, one for hunting).

Option 1) The requirement i am least willing to sacrifice is fire rate. This leads me to selecting a rifle with a heavy barrel. Here is a summary I made on heavy barreled, .308" rifles. All prices were obtained by grabagun.com for consistency.

Make Model Barrel Weight Price
Howa 1500 20" 8.5 lb $512
Remington SPS Varmint 26" 8.5 lb $550
Remington SPS Tactical 20" 7.5 lb $512
Ruger Predator 18" 6.2 lb $365
Savage 110 Tactical 20" 7.38 lb $635
Savage 110 Tactical 24" 8.4 lb $635
Tikka T3x Varmint 20" 7.7 lb NA (could not find in .308)
Tikka T3x CTR 20" 7.5 lb $1,000

Talking price, the Ruger Predator seems like a bargain but I am hesitant to go that low on barrel length (I think 20" is the lowest I am comfortable with), this article helps explain velocity and drop vs length for .308:

https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-barrel-length-versus-velocity-28-to-16-5/

Talking features that i am interested in and price, I am leaning towards the Savage 110 Tactical. Would have to decide if the extra 4" is worth the extra pound.


Option 2) This would enable me to get two completely different setups and even different calibers (I am thinking 6.5 creedmoor for bench and .308 for hunting). I am not a fan of expanding the different types of calibers I own unless there is a very good reason which this may prove to be one (hunting and target are two different applications).That being said, this option is double the cost: two rifles and two optics.

I plan to check out some of the rifles at my LGS and report back.

Thank you again Calguns, you guys are awesome!

[ar15barrels]

All, thank you for the input; very much appreciated. I very much see the compromise in my goals. I see two paths: 1) relax all of them (up to 8.5 lbs and maybe out to say, 500 yrds, slow fire) or 2) get two separate rifles (one for bench, one for hunting).

Option 1) This leads me to selecting a rifle with a heavy barrel. Here is a summary I made on heavy barreled, .308" rifles. All prices were obtained by grabagun.com for consistency.

Make Model Barrel Weight Price
Howa 1500 20" 8.5 lb $512
Remington SPS Varmint 26" 8.5 lb $550
Remington SPS Tactical 20" 7.5 lb $512
Ruger Predator 18" 6.2 lb $365
Savage 110 Tactical 20" 7.38 lb $635
Savage 110 Tactical 24" 8.4 lb $635
Tikka T3x Varmint 20" 7.7 lb NA (could not find in .308)
Tikka T3x CTR 20" 7.5 lb $1,000

Talking price, the Ruger Predator seems like a bargain but I am hesitant to go that low on barrel length (I think 20" is the lowest I am comfortable with), this article helps explain velocity and drop vs length for .308:

https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-barrel-length-versus-velocity-28-to-16-5/

Talking features that i am interested in and price, I am leaning towards the Savage 110 Tactical. Would have to decide if the extra 4" is worth the extra pound.


Option 2) This would enable me to get two completely different setups and even different calibers (I am thinking 6.5 creedmoor for bench and .308 for hunting). I am not a fan of expanding the different types of calibers I own unless there is a very good reason which this may prove to be one (hunting and target are two different applications).That being said, this option is double the cost: two rifles and two optics.

I plan to check out some of the rifles at my LGS and report back.

Thank you again Calguns, you guys are awesome!

18" is fine for a hunting rifle as you usualy don't shoot beyond 200yds in most CA big game hunting.
Varmints are a different thing and use a different type of rifle that's more like a longrange target rifle.

On a longrange varmint of target rifle, you want it heavy for multiple reasons.
You don't carry a target rifle much so weight is not a concern.
The extra weight makes it heat up slower and the thicker barrel is stiffer so you don't see as much barrel drift with heat.
The extra weight absorbs recoil, making it easier to spot your impacts.
The extra length gives more velocity for the same chamber pressure so the bullet has less drop and less wind drift at extended ranges.

An 18" lightweight 308 is a fine big game hunting rifle in CA.
A 24" heavy barreled 6.5 Creedmoor is an excellent longrange target rifle.

trying to compromise and get both functions in one rifle means you end up with a package that is not great for EITHER use.
Start out with a rifle that's perfect for your MAIN use.
After that, get a 2nd rifle that's perfect for your secondary use.

[sigstroker]

All, thank you for the input; very much appreciated. I very much see the compromise in my goals. I see two paths: 1) relax all of them (up to 8.5 lbs and maybe out to say, 500 yrds, slow fire) or 2) get two separate rifles (one for bench, one for hunting).

Option 1) This leads me to selecting a rifle with a heavy barrel. Here is a summary I made on heavy barreled, .308" rifles. All prices were obtained by grabagun.com for consistency.

Make Model Barrel Weight Price
Howa 1500 20" 8.5 lb $512
Remington SPS Varmint 26" 8.5 lb $550
Remington SPS Tactical 20" 7.5 lb $512
Ruger Predator 18" 6.2 lb $365
Savage 110 Tactical 20" 7.38 lb $635
Savage 110 Tactical 24" 8.4 lb $635
Tikka T3x Varmint 20" 7.7 lb NA (could not find in .308)
Tikka T3x CTR 20" 7.5 lb $1,000

Talking price, the Ruger Predator seems like a bargain but I am hesitant to go that low on barrel length (I think 20" is the lowest I am comfortable with), this article helps explain velocity and drop vs length for .308:

https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-barrel-length-versus-velocity-28-to-16-5/

Talking features that i am interested in and price, I am leaning towards the Savage 110 Tactical. Would have to decide if the extra 4" is worth the extra pound.


Option 2) This would enable me to get two completely different setups and even different calibers (I am thinking 6.5 creedmoor for bench and .308 for hunting). I am not a fan of expanding the different types of calibers I own unless there is a very good reason which this may prove to be one (hunting and target are two different applications).That being said, this option is double the cost: two rifles and two optics.

I plan to check out some of the rifles at my LGS and report back.

Thank you again Calguns, you guys are awesome!

There's nothing wrong with a 20" barrel for 750 yards. I have a friend that used to shoot 1000 yard high power with his 20 incher. His bullets sometimes went subsonic, but at 750 you shouldn't have any trouble. You shouldn't worry about it until you've tried it and found it lacking.

edit: Even if it turns out to be too slow to make 750 comfortably, you can always get a custom hand-lapped barrel. Not all barrels are created equal and a high quality barrel is often "faster" than one on a factory mass-produced barrel. It would be a lot cheaper than buying a second rifle.

[FishnHunt]

I’m hunter first so 20-22 is perfect. but if I were to go target/long range. I’d be looking at 24”
Have you looked at the browning hells canyon? Or Bergara rifles?Been hearing good things about it.
Me personally never cared for 308. I think I’d be looking at 6.5 or 7-08