.243 vs .308 vs 6.5 Creedmore.

[Tahoeshooter]

RE barrel life- I've heard this about 243s, but it has not been my experience. Plain old Xbolt in 243. $700 (Big C gun room sale). 1800+ rounds, MVs of 2900 - 3200. SGKs, Interloks, TSX. No barrel life problem so far. .25 MOA still common. 1" @ 300 in the mountains & breeze.

I love this gun and this round, but can't shoot the 115s because of standard twist. Bummer, or I'd be going to 1K with it. Not competitive, just a frequent range visitor.

So with all this money flying around ($2k ARs abundant, $1K scopes non uncommon at casual gun ranges), is there really any care about replacing a barrel for $300 - $600??

[Tahoeshooter]

how much do you actually shoot?


the 6.5 IMHO is much better than the 308 and you have to look at barrels as consumables.

+1 Barrels are the least of our expenses. Big difference between the 6.5 and 308 ballistics.

[Rickmcu]

Do not get a .308. It's and old tired cartridge that you really can't hit any thing with. It was good 50 years ago but not today.

[NorCalFocus]

Do not get a .308. It's and old tired cartridge that you really can't hit any thing with. It was good 50 years ago but not today.

Really can't hit anything with it? Wow.

So how do all those guys shooting Palma hit the target? .308, iron sights, at a 1000 yards. They just must love throwing their lead down range and don't worry about hitting the target.

[russ69]

Of the three and for the described purpose, I'd go with the .308. There is a reason while the military uses the .308.

The reason is so they don't have to add a new logistic problem with a different cartridge.

Do not get a .308. It's and old tired cartridge that you really can't hit any thing with. It was good 50 years ago but not today.

Not sure if kidding. It's a fine target cartridge within it's limitations.

[Rickmcu]

Really can't hit anything with it? Wow.

So how do all those guys shooting Palma hit the target? .308, iron sights, at a 1000 yards. They just must love throwing their lead down range and don't worry about hitting the target.

Palma shooting? Exactly my point. They probably invented that Palma stuff like what, about 50 years ago? Yeah that's what I thought. And the people at winchester probably invented the old slow 308 for shooting palma. And did You say iron sights at 1000? That's rediculious. I've never heard of that. And just look at prs they all shoot 6mm. So that tells you all you need to know. No good shooter shots a 308 anymore. Might need to read that twice to digest all that knowledge I just dropped on you.

[NorCalFocus]

Palma shooting? Exactly my point. They probably invented that Palma stuff like what, about 50 years ago? Yeah that's what I thought. And the people at winchester probably invented the old slow 308 for shooting palma. And did You say iron sights at 1000? That's rediculious. I've never heard of that. And just look at prs they all shoot 6mm. So that tells you all you need to know. No good shooter shots a 308 anymore. Might need to read that twice to digest all that knowledge I just dropped on you.

The only thing you drop here was a load of crap.

[HK Dave]

With Prime making amazing 6.5cm factory ammo at affordable prices, and Norma and Lapua making brass for 6.5cm, I can't see myself ever barreling another bolt action in 308.

My gas guns will continue running 308 (minus one that is 6.5cm) but for the advantages of 6.5cm are enough to make it worth it to me.

People talk about barrel life, if you take 6.5cm and say it has 3K barrel life, that's $2000 to $4000 depending on whether you reload or shoot factory ammo. So thats a new barrel, installed for say $850 every 3K rounds. (When i talk ammo, i'm talking all premium components, match level stuff)

With 308, lets say it has a 5k barrel life, that's $3300 to $6500 for ammo. So that's a new barrel installed for $850 every 5k rounds.

While the cost is not inconsequential, I reload half of what i shoot, and use factory for the other half. So my total cost thinking of the barrel as an expendable item is $1.28 cents a round for 6.5cm. For 308, if my math is correct, the cost per shot is $1.15.

So overall, the difference to me is $0.13 cents a round for better ballistics, reduced recoil, better against wind.

If you do the math, it can be surprising.

Just for fun... lets say 243 or something like 6cm... 1500 round barrel life, lets say $1 a round, so $1500 in ammo, plus $850 per barrel. Now we're at $1.57 each time you fire it. If it's worth it to you, why the heck not?

Of course, keeping in mind, that outside of using Randal to rebarrel, or running one of the newer AI rifles or a DTA, you're now waiting 3-6 months per rebarrel, which can be a PITA.

Wow... i need some sleep... or maybe less caffeine. Ok that is all.

[russ69]

... And did You say iron sights at 1000? That's rediculious. I've never heard of that...

Only the best shooters in the world. Maybe you should look it up?

[Rickmcu]

Only the best shooters in the world. Maybe you should look it up?

Best shooters in the world?? That made me LOL. Do prs shooters shoot with irons? I think not.

[Rickmcu]

Only the best shooters in the world. Maybe you should look it up?

Best shooters in the world?? That made me LOL. Do prs shooters shoot with irons? I think not

[russ69]

Best shooters in the world?? That made me LOL. Do prs shooters shoot with irons? I think not.

Only in the Olympics, all world championships and the National matches. These are the reference standard shooters not the PRS guys.

[NorCalFocus]

.308 open sights shoots a milk jug at 1000 yards. Watch the whole video and they even explain palma. Guy says in a typical match he puts 10 of 20 rounds inside a 10" bullseye.

[killshot44]

At first I thought Rick had the gift of sarcasm. Sadly not so. But this should be fun......

[longrange1]

Rick....i shoot local PRS matches...we have one today as a matter of fact...i also shoot long range varmint matches,600 & 1000yd F-class matches and short range tactical matches that were designed for gas guns that i shoot a bolt gun in as well. i dont clam to be the best shot but i do pretty well and while i agree the 308 is ballistic-ly challenged when compared to some of the other cartridges i can tell you ive had my *** handed to me more than once by a 308.

this was the last 1000yd F-class match i shot when i first switched over to the 6CM...shooting 105g berger hybrids at 3050fps. i shoot off a bean bag and a bipod no fancy equipment and i only shot 10 rounds per relay as i was just seeing how the 6CM was shooting at 1000yds.

the 18 to 22mph wind was a bonus....my dope through most of the match...



my score...



and the point of all this...dont under estimate the 308....the kid next to me shooting a 308 palma with irons for NRA scoring shot a 595 25 or 30X if i remember correctly.