Question about problems extracting

[kds857]

Has anyone heard of any generation of HOWAs where the chamber was not cut to the proper specs? Mine is a 223 HB Varminter bought around 2007.

Once out of every 3 or 4 trips to the range, my Howa 1500 fails to extract a fired round and the case remains stuck in the chamber. When this happnens, I open and close the bolt hoping the extractor will catch the rim, but no luck. After I pop the stuck case out with a brass rod, I have usually have no problems with the remaining rounds (meaning the stuck case thing usually only happens with 1 round, and everything before and after are ok).

When I compared the stuck case to a case that extracted properly, to my eye they looked the same, meaning same length, no dents, etc. Perhaps it was a couple thousandths of an inch shorter or something that I could not see with a casual glance?

If you place a fired case in the chamber and close the bolt, should the extractor always catch the rim and extract it without any problems? Does the depth a case goes into the chamber differ between a fired case and an unfired cartridge? Are the tolerances of a case that will/won't extract that small?

The ammo I was using was brass -- either Fed American Eagle 223 55gn FMJ or Fiocchi Shooting Dynamics 55gn FMJ or just maybe PMC bronze 55gn.

Thanks

[ar15barrels]

I would pull the extractor off and clean the pocket in the bolt where it sits.
Make sure it is pivoting freely and has good spring tension.
Look for chips or damage to the claw on the extractor.

[LynnJr]

When you pull the problem case out does it pop right out or do you need to push on it with a cleaning rod?
I ask as it will point you in the direction of the extractor or towards another fix.

[JohnCCW]

Good feedback above^^^
Most likely extractor parts. Using 3 brands of factory ammo makes diagnosis more difficult. Any fired case from that rifle should be able to extract again after you place it back in the chamber.
If you reload, and neck size only, the loaded cartridge would be an exact fit to your chamber, and the problem would be more obvious.

[kds857]

thank you for the feedback.

I'll do what Randall says, and I'll try and snap a pic of the extractor tonight.

LynnJr - the few times it happened, i had to push it out with a very slight amount of force with a brass rod. It certainty did not take a hammer to the rod or anything.

JohnCCW- Thanks for letting me know a fired case should be able to be placed in the chamber and extracted again. I think I kept a couple fired cases from all three brands I fired, so I'll try that tonight too.

Will post a pic when I get home and maybe you guys can tell me if my Howa extractor looks normal.

[kendog4570]

I would pull the extractor off and clean the pocket in the bolt where it sits.
Make sure it is pivoting freely and has good spring tension.
Look for chips or damage to the claw on the extractor.

This.
Check for crap under the extractor, or damage to the claw. Maybe also rust or crud in the extractor spring or its recess, limiting it's movement. The Howa has a Mini 16 type extractor that is about the most positive of its kind.

[LynnJr]

Sometimes you will get a case that needs a good deal of pushing to remove the brass.
If the chamber was cut in a hurry and not polished your brass will hang up in the chamber.
A wooden dowel and some crocus cloth to help polish out the chamber will usually correct it.
In your case it sounds like the extractor is slipping off of the rim.

[klokepyo]

A wooden dowel and some crocus cloth to help polish out the chamber will usually correct it.

[LynnJr]

Yes.
By polishing the chamber you enlarge it a very small amount and it makes extraction much easier.

[wpage]

All of the above...

[kds857]

question about rod/dowel

Ok, before I screw up my barrel even more can you guys give me a metalworks 101 lesson:

I use a brass rod I bought at Lowes to pop my stuck cases out of the chamber. My thoughts were that brass is very soft compared to the barrel material so its fine. Was I supposed to get a polymer or wooden one instead?

Am I damaging the grooves and or the crown by sliding the brass rod up and down the barrel once in a while?

[LynnJr]

Use a cleaning rod with the jag or brush removed and lightly tap the case out
If you forget your brass rod in the barrel nothing but bad news becomes of it.

[killshot44]

KDS, what Lynn means is that while both a cleaning rod and your brass rod will work (the latter shouldn't harm your barrel just knocking out a stick case) you won't forget a cleaning rod is in there.

People HAVE forgotten a drop-rod is there and blown up their gun.

The wooden dowel he mentioned would not fit in the barrel, it would be about the diameter of the chamber/your case.

[kds857]

Killshot, thx for the clarification, i was actually wondering what Lynn meant

Didn't get a chance yet, but I'll snap a pic later of the extractor after I take it off and clean the area. I hope its as easy as popping a pin out.

[kds857]

Here is what the extractor looks like. Let me know if not normal. Used a brass brush to get any gunk out from under the claw, and tested it to pivot freely with good spring tension.
BTW, I measured the diameter of the rim of the empty cases (I measured a couple from each):

Federal AE 223 bulk .374
Fiocchi Shooting Dynamics 223 bulk .372

Dunno if that .002 difference means much.... aaaand I tried inserting and extracting those two spent cases... worked fine at home. Maybe it was just a random cartridge that was out of spec when my problem happened at the range. Next time I'll keep the stuck cases and compare them carefully.