LEO have to do with it?

[bandogg]

Hi first off im new to Calguns, So hello to everyone. I have read through some posts and notice lots of people wanting new guns that are not on Ca list. (My self Hk 45 n P30L) So my question is what does making friends with LEO have to do with getting the guns we want? I understand LE can buy guns that normal people can not, but is it not illegal to buy a gun just to sell it to someone else.

[Doheny]

I understand LE can buy guns that normal people can not, but is it not illegal to buy a gun just to sell it to someone else.

There is some debate about that, but if the definition of a 'straw purchase" is buying a gun for someone who can't buy it themselves, then the short answer would be no, they can't do so.

[redcliff]

It's not illegal at all for a LEO to buy an off-list handgun and then turn around and sell it to someone with a PPT. It may however be against their agency's policies. Just as some agencies don't want law-abiding citizens to have ccw's other's don't want to share their perk of being able to utilize off-list handguns.

There is no straw purchase, assuming that it is properly PPT'd at an FFL.

[Brooke]

There is no straw purchase, assuming that it is properly PPT'd at an FFL.

That's my understanding of what the law *should* be, if it isn't. A "straw purchase" should be defined as buying a gun to transfer it to someone who cannot legally *possess* it (rather than the "person who can't buy it", as indicated above).

I have no support for that position other than common sense. If I can legally PPT (through an FFL) an off-list gun to you, why should my intention when purchasing it make any difference?

[Greg-Dawg]

Don't.

[ilbob]

its not a straw-man purchase because that is an issue the BATF made up.

[Doheny]

As I said, it's open to interpretation. Read the first question in section 12 of form 4473. If someone else is buying the gun for you, it's not permitted. It's really a matter of proving intent; who's to say the LEO didn't change his mind and then decide to PPT you the day after he bought it?

http://www.atf.gov/forms/4473/index.htm

[J-cat]

The purpose of the LEO exemption is to allow LEOs to carry what they are comfortable with, not to allow you to circumvent the law.

My agency went to S&W 6906s in the late '90s. They are running out of guns. S&W does not make the S&W 6906 anymore. On top of that, we have to turn in our issued guns for "maintenance" once a year. We do not get the same gun back. We can, however, purchase a 6906 privately and carry it on duty if we so choose. Guess what? It's not on the list. Hence the exemption.

Do you understand now?

[Slayer]

It is not illegal for an LEO to sell a civilain a non rostered pistol. This is, of course, assuming the civilian is not other wise barred from owning a firearm, has a valid HSC and the transfer is done via PPT at a FFL.

[hawk1]

As I said, it's open to interpretation. Read the first question in section 12 of form 4473. If someone else is buying the gun for you, it's not permitted. It's really a matter of proving intent; who's to say the LEO didn't change his mind and then decide to PPT you the day after he bought it?

http://www.atf.gov/forms/4473/index.htm

Pure FUD.
You are trying to infer ther is only one transaction. Not true.
One transaction is the LEO buying the handgun. The second transaction is the LEO selling said handgun to another person. Both transactions go through an FFL and are both registered with DOJ.

Now, if you were to buy the firearm with the intent to give or sell the firearm to the second buyer without going through a FFL then that is a straw purchase. The person aquiring the handgun from you must not be in a prohibited class. Going through the FFL assures this and registers the handgun to the buyer.

[Rivers]

The purpose of the LEO exemption is to allow LEOs to carry what they are comfortable with, not to allow you to circumvent the law.

With all due respect, not true regarding the purpose of SB15.

The LE exemption came about because legislators did not have enough support from LE to get SB15 passed. When they wrote in the LE exemption, the chiefs came on board and said that SB15 would be a great law for CA. Without the LE exemption, SB15, "the Saturday Night Special" law, would have never become law.

SB15 was marketed as intending to remove the cheap handguns coming from South America, etc. from our streets. It was perverted into an extortion tool that required annual payments from manufacturers to permit CA sales of the same handgun in different cosmetic finishes, with different sights, etc. Things that have nothing to do with the inherent safety of a handgun.

[Vin496]

Pure FUD.
You are trying to infer ther is only one transaction. Not true.
One transaction is the LEO buying the handgun. The second transaction is the LEO selling said handgun to another person. Both transactions go through an FFL and are both registered with DOJ.

Now, if you were to buy the firearm with the intent to give or sell the firearm to the second buyer without going through a FFL then that is a straw purchase. The person aquiring the handgun from you must not be in a prohibited class. Going through the FFL assures this and registers the handgun to the buyer.

+1,

Both transactions are legal. LEO purchase from FFL, LEO PPT transfer through FFL.

I see nothing illegal.

[360PA]

Well, not all guns are available for rent at ranges. So how would one know if the gun is comfortable? Buy it and use it, if it doesn't work for you sell it. What is the issue here? BTW anyone looking for an HK45C NIB?

[The SoCal Gunner]

Well, not all guns are available for rent at ranges. So how would one know if the gun is comfortable? Buy it and use it, if it doesn't work for you sell it. What is the issue here? BTW anyone looking for an HK45C NIB?

I'm more interested in a Para P14 limited than an HK45C .

[JBird33]

The purpose of the LEO exemption is to allow LEOs to carry what they are comfortable with, not to allow you to circumvent the law.

My agency went to S&W 6906s in the late '90s. They are running out of guns. S&W does not make the S&W 6906 anymore. On top of that, we have to turn in our issued guns for "maintenance" once a year. We do not get the same gun back. We can, however, purchase a 6906 privately and carry it on duty if we so choose. Guess what? It's not on the list. Hence the exemption.

Do you understand now?

So you as a cop deserve what you are comfortable with, but me, a simple California citizen, can only use what a government body tells me to use? I don't think so pal. You aren't as above the rest of us as you might think, and the law was only made to gather more money from gun manufacturers and to make Brady people happy. I know you have a firearm as a part of your job, and that is important. So is keeping my loved ones safe before you get there.