Holy crap, the Shield is a pain to field strip...

[pitbull30]

Wait. Some of you guys bought the shield with the safety?



Im just poking fun. I cant believe this thread is 100+ posts.

[ifilef]

Oh, duh, I thought following the four basic safety rules were already assumed. The problem is that people 'think' they may have...there is no other way to explain why NDs occur.

Good day and goodbye!

I don't need to be 'schooled' over and over again in the basic safety rules. I thought we were beyond that.

Whatever...

[JDW67]

I get it... Ifielf doesn't mean he loads a round into the chamber before field striping but that's what he wrote.

He means you can load a round into the chamber with the safety on you can also field strip with it on but his sentence structure is confusing.

Regardless safteys suck and I pull the trigger on my Glock shield and now my PPQ before field stripping.

The manual safety is always ON (engaged) when I chamber the first round (from magazine), clear the weapon, and field strip it. What is not understandable about that?

It is safer than not using it for those functions because it eliminates entirely the possibility of inadvertent trigger pull resulting in a ND, whether human error or not.

Period.

Ok, I get it. Was wondering why the hell would you chamber a round before you field strip...

Ifielf, is english your first language?

[tacticalcity]

Ifielf, if I am misreading what you meant, I do apologize. I do not mean to jump all over your case.

The way I read your comments, it sounded like you were saying it is OK to clean a loaded gun and that you do so as a matter of routine.

I simply meant to point out that you should always make sure the gun is completely unloaded before cleaning your firearm. The mechanical safety is not meant to let you do that.

I am sorry if I was rude about it.

[ifilef]

Yeah, I guess I don't know how to write English and compose sentences.

Take care!

[ifilef]

Ifielf, if I am misreading what you meant, I do apologize. I do not mean to jump all over your case.

The way I read your comments, it sounded like you were saying it is OK to clean a loaded gun and that you do so as a matter of routine.

I simply meant to point out that you should always make sure the gun is completely unloaded before cleaning your firearm. The mechanical safety is not meant to let you do that.

I am sorry if I was rude about it.

In bold, above-What 'moron' would do such a thing knowingly, and I emphasize the word 'knowingly'. But some people do it because they believe the gun may be empty- inadvertence, distractions, all that good stuff, along with complacency.

[JDW67]

In bold, above-What 'moron' would do such a thing knowingly?

Beretta 92FS, and safer than any Sig.

Does one have to pull the trigger to strip a Sig? If so, bad, and outdated technology.

92FS- I can safely field strip the slide from the frame with a live round in chamber! Gun is all but foolproof!

And gun has a safety to chamber round, clear and field-strip.

You did...

[tacticalcity]

I am pretty sure the Glock was designed and released after the Beretta 92 (might be wrong but I doubt it). So I would not call it outdated technology by comparison. Just a different take on things. The Beretta is trying to be as idiot proof as possible and chalked full of all kinds of mechanical safety features. And in the process ease of use and speed get compromised. While the Glock is trying to be as fast as possible, and relies on your safe gun handling skills to do the job all those mechanical safety features on your Beretta do.

I will admit, when I first switched from the Beretta 96 to the Glock 19 I found the fact that you had to pull the trigger to break the gun down very off putting. It did however, force me to take gun safety much more seriously. If you thought I was being hard on you for your comments then you should see how hard I am on my self when I find myself breaking a safety rule. Vigilance keeps us safe.

There are a ton of benefits to NOT having the manual safety and de-cocker, and in not have a DA/SA action. It is OK if you like those things. I liked them when I first got into shooting. As my skill level improved, and I started taking Defensive Handgun courses, I found both those things were getting in my way of excelling to the next level in ability. So I switched to a Glock. The S&W M&P and Springfield XD were not out yet, but if they were I would have taken a look at them as well. The Beretta was/is a really nice gun, it just wasn't the gun for me anymore.

The Glock, and Glock like guns such as the M&P line from Smith & Wesson are not an outdated design. They are guns for people who want to strip off all those cumbersome safety features because their gun handling skill-level allows for it, and they want to take things to the next level. They want as much speed from the holster to putting rounds down range as possible. Not having to flip off a safety, and having a consistent and relatively light trigger pull help out with that. At least, that is how I view these guns.

I would include the shield in that category, even though the CA version comes with a manual safety. The rest of the design is more like the Glock than the Beretta. Besides, there are more than one version of the S&W Shield on the market. One comes without a safety. If I were to buy one, that would be the one I would prefer. But that is because I would not be pocket carrying, I would be carrying in a solid holster on my hip. But that's just me. If I were to use it as a pocket carry gun...then I would want that manual safety.

[ifilef]

Sure, go ahead and prepare for that gunfight that will 99.9% not happen to you.

We use these things every day for recreation and potential SD.

It's all a personal choice. Just choose wisely for you- and for the rest of us, as you have a duty not to shoot me due to your negligence in
using an 'unsafe' handgun- it's the law whether we agree with it or not.

Glock will either conform or eventually lose California. That is their business choice, too.

[tacticalcity]

Well, the military didn't teach me to prepare for the BEST case scenario, they instilled the importance of preparing for the WORST case scenario.

Besides, preparing for that gun fight is CONSIDERABLY more fun and exciting than just plinking on a flat range. If you have never taken a Defensive Handgun course, I recommend taking one to see how you like it. I promise it is the most fun you'll have with your close on - that involves a gun.

As for being a personal choice, I could not agree more. I am not the one calling other people's choices outdated. I am simply explaining why I and many others like the guns you clearly don't.

As for forcing Glock to conform, that's not true. For one thing, they can continue to pay the renewal fees on existing designs and stay on the roster provided they wish to continue manufacturing them. However, since 99.9999999% of all guns manufactured today cannot get onto the roster due to the new rules it is much more likely that a higher court will throw out the roster. As more and more guns drop off the list because they are no longer manufactured, and fewer and fewer guns make it onto the list because the industry refuses to let politicians in one state dictate how they design their guns, the roster starts to become a defacto ban. Higher courts aren't going to like that. So I would put my money on the gun companies holding out and out lasting the roster.

This is especially true since the micro-stamping requirement is a physical and technological impossibility. Once that rule takes effect, no new gun will ever make it onto the list at all. Not even those made by Beretta. The courts are not going to like that one bit. California is not going to get away with banning all guns produced after that requirement goes into effect. Not without a major change in the makeup of the Supreme Court.

[ifilef]

Agree with much of what you have to say, but LCI and mag disconnect safety will withstand scrutiny IMO. Companies resist change, that is the history, until forced to change via the will of the people through laws. There was a lot of resistance to mandatory seat belts, and/or helmet laws, if I recall correctly.

Anyway, from what I know about micro-stamping, I think it ridiculous and bad law, too. Maybe that will be tossed. We shall see.

[CuddlesTheSheep]

Agree with much of what you have to say, but LCI and mag disconnect safety will withstand scrutiny IMO. Companies resist change, that is the history, until forced to change via the will of the people through laws. There was a lot of resistance to mandatory seat belts, and/or helmet laws, if I recall correctly.

Anyway, from what I know about micro-stamping, I think it ridiculous and bad law, too. Maybe that will be tossed. We shall see.

Agree with you 100&

[ifilef]

Ifielf, if I am misreading what you meant, I do apologize. I do not mean to jump all over your case.

The way I read your comments, it sounded like you were saying it is OK to clean a loaded gun and that you do so as a matter of routine.

I simply meant to point out that you should always make sure the gun is completely unloaded before cleaning your firearm. The mechanical safety is not meant to let you do that.

I am sorry if I was rude about it.

All apologies accepted.

Cheers,