Open Carry - Schools Everywhere!

[Nanook]

Wow. Since this has been a hot topic, I decided to fire up Google Earth and see exactly where the schools were in my neighborhood. Looks like I can't even walk out my front door without being within 1000' of a school. Not only that, I can't drive down any major street for more than a couple blocks without passing through any school zones.

The green house is my place, the orange icons are schools (for some reason, 24 Hour Fitness is listed as a school, but there is only 1 on this map) and the yellow line is just over 1000' to be safe.

If you want to check for yourselves, in the lower left pane of Google Earth look under "Places of Interest" and check off "Schools." To measure distance, click on the ruler icon in the top toolbar, select "feet" in the window that pops up, click on the place you want to measure from and move the mouse pointer to measure distance. Mind you, Google Earth's data is probably not 100% current, so CYA in other ways as well.

I support everyone doing this, and I'm not saying I will never, but if you're in a sizable city that you don't know literally like the back of your hand, do your homework!

[Liberty1]

Or don't do your homework as knowing is an element of the crime. Don't ever provide evidence for your own conviction. Also the law deals with "school zone" as a legal definition. I bet that not every thing that comes up on Goggle is a legal "school zone". This is one of those laws, albeit a felony, where ignorance of the law is a good defense.

Read 626.9 if you want to knowing know.

[Stormfeather]

The green house is my place, the orange icons are schools (for some reason, 24 Hour Fitness is listed as a school, but there is only 1 on this map) and the yellow line is just over 1000' to be safe.

It may be listed because some 24 hr fitness's have day care available. Im not sure if this is a factor or not in regards to schools in your reigon.

[Decoligny]

Or don't do your homework as knowing is an element of the crime. Don't ever provide evidence for your own conviction. Also the law deals with "school zone" as a legal definition. I bet that not every thing that comes up on Goggle is a legal "school zone". This is one of those laws, albeit a felony, where ignorance of the law is a good defense.

Read 626.9 if you want to knowing know.

It's knowing or "should reasonably know" or something to that effect. If it's your own neighboorhood, then you should probably know where the schools are. If you are from out of town and see the "SCHOOL ZONE" sign, lock it up, or turn around quick.

[GuyW]

Or don't do your homework as knowing is an element of the crime. Don't ever provide evidence for your own conviction. Also the law deals with "school zone" as a legal definition. I bet that not every thing that comes up on Goggle is a legal "school zone". This is one of those laws, albeit a felony, where ignorance of the law is a good defense.

Read 626.9 if you want to knowing know.

Knowledge is power....just don't admit you have knowledge...

[retired]

I don't mean to rub dirt in anyone's eye and I'm certainly not lording it over anyone, but boy, I'm sure glad that I fall under the following exception and don't have the worries that most do.

(o) This section does not apply to an honorably retired peace officer authorized to carry a concealed or loaded firearm pursuant to subdivision (a) or (i) of Section 12027 or paragraph (1) or (8)

I have to renew mine next month, along with the HR218 one.

And I don't care what anyone says, it was honorable......really, it was.

[virulosity]

...If you want to check for yourselves, in the lower left pane of Google Earth look under "Places of Interest" and check off "Schools."

google earth is trying to appeal more to pedophiles?

[Nanook]

Thanks for the replies, folks!

So, forgive my ignorance, but whatever happened to "ignorance of the law is no excuse?" lol Reading that back, it seems a little redundant. I used to work for the Department of Redundancy Department.

And I did look up 626.9, and it states "(B) Within 1,000 feet of a school, as designated by the school district." So does that mean the school district designates what a "school" is, or what 1000' is?

And just in case there are any prying eyes here, I'd like you all to refer to me as "Hank" while we're discussing this.

And virulosity, I find the Megan's Law web site more helpful when I'm looking for a date.

j/k

[Decoligny]

Thanks for the replies, folks!

So, forgive my ignorance, but whatever happened to "ignorance of the law is no excuse?" lol Reading that back, it seems a little redundant. I used to work for the Department of Redundancy Department.

And I did look up 626.9, and it states "(B) Within 1,000 feet of a school, as designated by the school district." So does that mean the school district designates what a "school" is, or what 1000' is?

And just in case there are any prying eyes here, I'd like you all to refer to me as "Hank" while we're discussing this.

And virulosity, I find the Megan's Law web site more helpful when I'm looking for a date.

j/k

626.9 does not deal with whether or not you knew about the law, it deals with whether you knew, or reasonable should know that you were within 1000 feet of school property.

Case One: You live down the street from a school. You drive past that school every day. You should reasonably know when you are within 1000 feet of that school. You drive by with an unloaded gun on your hip. 626.9 Violated.

Case Two: You are on the freeway, there is a school 500 feet from the freeway in a town 20 miles away that you only drive through on your way to work, but never get off the freeway in that town. Since you don't live there, and can't see that there is a school because of other buildings in the way, you could not be reasonably expected to know that you were within 1000 feet of a school. You drive by with an unloaded gun on your hip. 626.9 NOT Violated.

[Liberty1]

626.9 does not deal with whether or not you knew about the law, it deals with whether you knew, or reasonable should know that you were within 1000 feet of school property.

Case One: You live down the street from a school. You drive past that school every day. You should reasonably know when you are within 1000 feet of that school. You drive by with an unloaded gun on your hip. 626.9 Violated.

Case Two: You are on the freeway, there is a school 500 feet from the freeway in a town 20 miles away that you only drive through on your way to work, but never get off the freeway in that town. Since you don't live there, and can't see that there is a school because of other buildings in the way, you could not be reasonably expected to know that you were within 1000 feet of a school. You drive by with an unloaded gun on your hip. 626.9 NOT Violated.

12026 (b) Any person who possesses a firearm in a place that the person
knows, or reasonably should know, is a school zone, as defined in
paragraph (1) of subdivision (e),...

I disagree, one can know where a school is, even live across from one and not know they are in a 626.9 firearm prohibited "school zone". One has to know the definition of a school zone. And that could only happen if they were told about this or read the law.

This is a statute that should be very hard to prosecute absent an admission by the arrestee. Always exercise your right to remain silent in any such situation.

[guimus]

I disagree, one can know where a school is, even live across from one and not know they are in a 626.9 firearm prohibited "school zone". One has to know the definition of a school zone. And that could only happen if they were told about this or read the law.

This is a statute that should be very hard to prosecute absent an admission by the arrestee. Always exercise your right to remain silent in any such situation.

Pretty sure you'd still be on the hook here. It's a mistake of fact/mistake of law issue, and a poorly-worded statute. They'd still get you for it, even with lenity. (Reasonably) not knowing there is a school nearby would exonerate you. But all schools are "school zones" per the law. Not knowing that law won't help you, mistake of law is far more limited. If you try the defense, they'd probably get you with willful ignorance.

[mymonkeyman]

Pretty sure you'd still be on the hook here. It's a mistake of fact/mistake of law issue, and a poorly-worded statute. They'd still get you for it, even with lenity. (Reasonably) not knowing there is a school nearby would exonerate you. But all schools are "school zones" per the law. Not knowing that law won't help you, mistake of law is far more limited. If you try the defense, they'd probably get you with willful ignorance.

I agree that not knowing the definition of a school zone is not a defense to this statute (ignorance of the law is no excuse and such). I think the more important issue the statute is getting at is not knowing the borders of any particular school zone. How many people get out the measuring tape and map the school zones in their area? Unless it's a street directly abutting the school, it's difficult to imagine that it would be easy for the DA to prove the person knew or should have known it was within 1000 feet. However, the OP just provided public evidence to satisfy that element of the crime as to him.

[E Pluribus Unum]

If heller goes our way I see laws like this going away. If I have a constitutional right to a public roadway, and I have a constitutional right to transport my firearms, and I have a constitutional right to BEAR ARMS then I have a constitutional right to bear arms on any public roadway.

Put it in the context of another right; say they passed a law that says "No citizen shall have the right to freedom of speech within 1000 feet of a school". This is where "shall not be infringed" will help us.

[packnrat]

what about home schools?


.

[Decoligny]

what about home schools?


.

You show me a cop that can identify where the homeschools are in any neighboorhood. The standard is that you know you are within 1,000 feet of a school, or that you should "reasonably" know that you are within 1,000 feet of a school.

It is impossible for someone to know if there is a homeschool in a particular house unless you actually know the residents.