What gives.

[all5x]

I recently went to a local dealer for a PPT of a handgun. It came with the orginial box, papers, mags and lock. The dealer would not accept the lock as it was not purchased in the last 30 days and he would not let me sign an affivdavit to owing a Calif approved safe, which I have. So that added another $10 to his pocket for the lock.

In addition I was in line to be served when he asked what I was there for and I told him a PPT. He said then you go to the back of the line. I had been there almost 2 hours already waiting. I complained so he started the paperwork that I had filled out which I was given by another clerk.

Plus I noticed a sign that they only did PPT transactions at certian times of the day. And only for the first two hours they were open on the weekends. So I guess that is like a store not selling certian items except during posted hours when they are open. I would think that if they have a state license to operate they would have to perform all the services of that license when the doors were open.

Am I way off base by complaining about this. I understand that "no one" is allowed to sign saying they have a safe to comply with state law. This sounds like a Fraud case to me. Wonder how many $10 Chinese locks they have sold over the years? all5x

[big fancy]

from my experience they hate doing ppt. its more time consuming i suppose. i went to target masters for a ppt and it took forever and they try and help everyone else and their mother while helping you so it takes even longer. i wish they would just finish one person up asap then move to the next. seems like when they try and help multiple people at the same time it just makes everyones service get delayed even more. sorry im no help just adding to your rant.

[Renaissance Redneck]

I would think that if they have a state license to operate they would have to perform all the services of that license when the doors were open.

Nope. They are still a private business and can set any policies they want, as long as they abide by the laws required by their license. Your choice, of course, is to go to a different shop that has policies more to your liking.

[Mr. Beretta]

Your 1st mistake was waiting 2 hours to do a PPT.

Your 2nd mistake was not leaving immediately after they told you to get to the back of the line.

The "Lock" issue has been discussed here many, many times. As a buyer, it' s no win. You should have left and not wasted any more of your time.

Some (Not All), FFL's could less about you or PPT's.

That's the way it is, like it or not.

Sorry to be blunt!

[Lead Waster]

Yeah, I bought a rifle from a fellow calguns member. We went to Target Masters in Milpitas. The counter guy (manager?) told us "OK, well we have two sales ahead of you so you have to wait". OK, that's fair, they are selling guns, that's where the money is.
Over the next hour and a half, we keep asking them to help us. The two gun sales was mostly the buyers filling out paperwork. A lot of times they were showing other people (ie; looky-loos) guns. Eventaully I say "OK, I get it, PPT is low priority, but we can't just wait here all night being shoved to the back all the time!!". Every once in a while an employee would advance our paperwork by a few lines.

Finally an employee starts to help us, and the manager said "No no, other customers first" and the employee says "Yes, I know, but we can't keep these guys here forever, they've been here for over an hour". So the manager agreed. Then the employee hands me the paperwork and says "here, fill this out".

WTF, really? I'm standing there for an hour and a half and I could have filled that form out while I was waiting around! Now you hand it to me? So it takes a few minutes to fill out the paperwork. During that time, this employee gets pulled away, but thankfully another guy came over and finished us up.

Bottom line, gun stores make like $10 for maybe 10 minutes of work, but it's still so low priority that you will get screwed for time.

A kitchen table FFL will also just get $10, but they don't have to cater to retail customers.

I would even suggest going to a less popular store, maybe it's unpopular because gun prices are ridiculously high, that's OK because PPT costs $25 + $10 no matter where you go.

Oh, often it's not practical to leave and find another FFL, because the buyer and seller have agreed to a particular place.


Anyway, speaking of all this, I have to go pick up that rifle today, hopefully I won't get hassled because it's a bit of a drive over there... so I hope they are not too busy to hand me the rifle!

[drkphibr]

Yeah, I bought a rifle from a fellow calguns member. We went to Target Masters in Milpitas. The counter guy (manager?) told us "OK, well we have two sales ahead of you so you have to wait". OK, that's fair, they are selling guns, that's where the money is.
Over the next hour and a half, we keep asking them to help us. The two gun sales was mostly the buyers filling out paperwork. A lot of times they were showing other people (ie; looky-loos) guns. Eventaully I say "OK, I get it, PPT is low priority, but we can't just wait here all night being shoved to the back all the time!!". Every once in a while an employee would advance our paperwork by a few lines.

Finally an employee starts to help us, and the manager said "No no, other customers first" and the employee says "Yes, I know, but we can't keep these guys here forever, they've been here for over an hour". So the manager agreed. Then the employee hands me the paperwork and says "here, fill this out".

WTF, really? I'm standing there for an hour and a half and I could have filled that form out while I was waiting around! Now you hand it to me? So it takes a few minutes to fill out the paperwork. During that time, this employee gets pulled away, but thankfully another guy came over and finished us up.

Bottom line, gun stores make like $10 for maybe 10 minutes of work, but it's still so low priority that you will get screwed for time.

A kitchen table FFL will also just get $10, but they don't have to cater to retail customers.

I would even suggest going to a less popular store, maybe it's unpopular because gun prices are ridiculously high, that's OK because PPT costs $25 + $10 no matter where you go.

Oh, often it's not practical to leave and find another FFL, because the buyer and seller have agreed to a particular place.


Anyway, speaking of all this, I have to go pick up that rifle today, hopefully I won't get hassled because it's a bit of a drive over there... so I hope they are not too busy to hand me the rifle!

TM is notorious for extensive and very time consuming paperwork. It's their thing. They average (if the clerk is good/seasoned) about 45 min per PPT (and TM's PPT is IDENTICAL to a purchase in terms of paperwork and process) where other FFLs/LGS take ~10-15 min. TM is bad enough time wise if you're first in line for a PPT, but if you come in to do a PPT and you're "in line"...you'll be there FOREVER.

[uhlan1]

A poor attitude towards PPT's is just bad business. The first and greatest priority of any professional retailer is to get people in the door. PPT's do that. I buy some guns new, I buy some used. I buy ammo, accessories, cleaning supplies - all sorts of gear - new. I was treated poorly at a gun store in Sunnyvale on a PPT and I'm really a pretty patient and nice guy. I will never go there again. I tell everyone I know of my poor experience. Gun Vault in Mountain View treats PPT's well. After my 3rd one there, I bought a brand spanking new carbine from them for 900 bucks.
It's business 101, get people in the door. When a PPT picks up the firearm, there's another basic retail premise many miss - suggestive selling. "need ammo for that?" "hey have you ever tried a bore snake, let me show you one".
Many also just plain don't plan for the future. This rush they are experiencing will end.
Treating ANYONE poorly will not serve one well when business sours. Those that have will continue to flourish, those that haven't will flounder and perish.
My 2 cents.

[CK_32]

Ok so you bought a rifle with and the gun came wih box mags and lock...

And they told you the lock had to be purchased in 30 days...

Being the lock came with rifle upon purchase that is then a purchase of a lock.. So them no accepting the lock is BS.. If you want a screw you to them wright down a make/model of the safe you own "wink wink" and then they can suck it for the most part... But I wouldn't support that shop and go to the next best thing..

Even a hand writes receipt with date and stating the lock was purchased on said date with in 30 days with both you and the sellers name is a sufficient recipes by DOJ or who ever polices that bs... So they are just being a holes to be a holes again do not support that business

[whipkiller]

While I understand they don't make much off of the PPT, they are foolish not to understand that people who buy guns through PPT will probably be buying ammo, magazines, holster, etc., etc., etc. for said gun.

I try to buy any gear for the new PPT gun from the ones who do the transfer unless they're rediculously overpriced so they actually make some money on the deal.

I also make sure to voice my satisfaction when I receive good service in a timely fashion and friendly attitudes from a gun store, even though they're not making a lot of money doing a PPT, for example the one I did recently @

Iron Sights in Oceanside, CA

We not only got good service and freindly attitude from the attractive young lady helping us, she told me a few good stories and gave us each a nice cold bottle of water while we were waiting.

These are the type of gun stores I will make a point to give my business to in the future, and might even pay a little more.