Wheel gun legality question

[eggfriedrice]

I am still getting acclimated with actually purchasing guns in this lovely state and recently fell in love with the Smith and Wesson Performance Center 586 L comp 3". Of course looking at the DOJ roster I don't see it. Is it illegal to attempt to purchase that particular firearm or have sent here via FFL for purchasing?

Thanks...

[SLO1911Fan]

Its not illegal, but your FFL can't let you pick it up...

[Cyc Wid It]

Unless you are exempt from the roster, you will not be able to order it online/buy from an FFL. Your only options are to have it transferred to you by an out of state parent or purchase it through a PPT.

[eggfriedrice]

ok, figured as much... I'm going to in a corner and cry myself to sleep now.

[shooting4life]

I'll meet you there

[JohnFLand]

Of course, in this Internet era, one can conceive of a brokering site that matches willing buyers in CA with willing sellers just about to move into CA. The new residents can bring in most handguns and sell in FTF transactions. If they knew that willing buyers were available for particular models, they might decide to invest in specific purchase. A little incentive to them to buy something they can resell might make the risk quite worthwhile.

[bellwilliam]

noob question, and my first post. my buddy is moving from Texas to California. I want to ask him to buy a few off-list guns

1. is changing license to CA license all that's needed to prove he is moving here ?

2. so he buys the gun, and just bring it with him ? then he and I will go to a FFL dealer for transaction ? or he needs to register first (through FFL ?) and do a FTF transaction with me there ?

3. I am thinking of a 229 E2 (for my small hand, and I have a bunch of old hi-cap mags for it), anything else you guys can think of, that's a little special ?

anything wrong with my line of thinking here ? thanks

[Cyc Wid It]

noob question, and my first post. my buddy is moving from Texas to California. I want to ask him to buy a few off-list guns

1. is changing license to CA license all that's needed to prove he is moving here ?

2. so he buys the gun, and just bring it with him ? then he and I will go to a FFL dealer for transaction ? or he needs to register first (through FFL ?) and do a FTF transaction with me there ?

3. I am thinking of a 229 E2 (for my small hand, and I have a bunch of old hi-cap mags for it), anything else you guys can think of, that's a little special ?

anything wrong with my line of thinking here ? thanks

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=325592

[OmutaX]

This is why I love Calguns. We can all rage collectively. Cheer as one, suffer as one.

[JohnFLand]

...anything else you guys can think of, that's a little special ?

There are a lot of candidates; the Kahr P380 comes to mind (there will be a CA version, apparently around Nov., but it has a mag safety lock and loaded chamber indicator, not generally desireable features) and any SIG *not* on the roster.

[Ed_Hazard]

Of course, in this Internet era, one can conceive of a brokering site that matches willing buyers in CA with willing sellers just about to move into CA. The new residents can bring in most handguns and sell in FTF transactions. If they knew that willing buyers were available for particular models, they might decide to invest in specific purchase. A little incentive to them to buy something they can resell might make the risk quite worthwhile.

Sounds real interesting, the CADOJ and the BATFE would really be interested as this would throw up all the straw purchase flags.

[JohnFLand]

It's quite unclear that these would qualify as straw purchases, so long as the buyer in CA can legally buy in the first place. The out-of-state buyer acquires complete and full title, and actually takes possession (and is at risk if the 2nd buyer backs out). Only after the OOS buyer becomes a CA resident does the 2nd transaction take place -- to, by hypothesis, a valid CA buyer. While the CADOJ & BATFE may nose around, I believe this falls squarely within the bounds of current law.

[Ed_Hazard]

Yes but by establishing a website you are admitting as the purchaser that you do not intend to be the end user of the gun, that your intention is to resell the gun to someone who cannot poses it due to the roster. I know it is a gray area and open to interpretation. I personally would not want to be the one to blaze that trail.

[littlejake]

The scenario is by no means a Staw Purchase as the end owner would be put through DROS, waiting period, 4473, and NICS.

The Catch 22 is the creation of a conspiracy to get around the roster. That, in and of itself, may be a crime -- and if it isn't, you can bet that the legislature would soon plug that hole.

Let's let Heller and McDonald filter down the legal pipeline -- there is hope the roster can be declared unconstitutional under those recent decisions; and that would be the best outcome of all of us.

BTW -- the roster does not outlaw possession of a non-roster gun. It only makes it illegal for a dealer to transfer an off-roster gun to a non-LEO (aka: common subject) -- except in a PPT.

[J-cat]

The Catch 22 is the creation of a conspiracy to get around the roster. That, in and of itself, may be a crime -- and if it isn't, you can bet that the legislature would soon plug that hole.

Utilization of a legal loophole is not a crime, hence when two people get together to utilize a legal loophole there can never be a conspiracy.