Feds and CA-DOJ trigger locks.

[taloft]

Okay, so I go to pickup my new CZ-75B in .40 cal. today. While doing the safety check and the final paperwork I notice that CZ has included a cable lock with the firearm.

I asked the clerk helping me why I was charged for a Cal-DOJ approved lock when I have a safe at home. He said that the Feds require a cable lock on all hand gun purchases. I said I knew that and there is a cable lock included with the gun. He said that the included lock isn't Cal-DOJ approved. I explained that I have a Safe that meets the state's requirement, and that there is nothing in the Federal law that requires the lock be state approved.

Now, the clerks are all scratching their heads and the owner is approaching. He informs me it is against state law to sell or hand over any type of gun lock that isn't on the approved list from the state, therefore I have to purchase a state approved gun lock in order to meet the Federal requirement. Even though I have a safe that would meet the state requirement. I don't doubt the sincerity of this statement. These guys have always done right by me. I told him that if my $9.00 would keep everyone in the good graces of the state and the feds then he was welcome to it. Just wondering if any of the FFL holders on the forum could confirm this? I guess there is no point in filling out a safe affidavit for a handgun.

[boogak]

never happened to me. i thought if it included a cable lock or if you have a cadoj approved safe with proof then itll be legit

[SemiAutoSam]

SO the safe affidavit works ok for long guns but not handguns ?

sounds like a conflitction between lame California law and lame federal law.

[donger]

They just wanted the nine bucks.

Plus now they have less paperwork by not allowing you to sign the safe affadavit.

[yoteassasin]

sorry but you got duped you are right but some times its eaier to let them think they are right and buy the lock anyways there is absolutely no fedral law and the ca law states that if you sign the safe affidavid you do not have to buy a ca doj-lock there are alot of locks supplied by oem with the new gun that are not ca-doj aproved and the thing with the safe affidavid you do not need to prove you own it you just have to swear you do,

[WokMaster1]

didn't we go thru this not that long ago? It doesn't matter if you have a safe. Safes are to satisfy California DOJ requirements. Gun locks are to satisfy ATF (federal agency) Yes we got double penetrated!!!!!!!!!

Yes, the gun locks have to be bought within the last 30 days when you picked the handgun up. How do I know? I got beat up pretty good by those in the know for saying that we can use any locks from our inventory.......

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=43137&highlight=trigger+locks

Here's EBWhite's research:
Originally Posted by EBWhite
This has nothing to do with CA law. It has to do with the new federal law req. new handguns be sold with locks. All handguns sold must come with a lock. However, instead of just throwing in a cheapo .99 cent lock, turners is making you buy a lock. This is only to follow the new federal law that was passed with the arms protection in commerce act.

With that mentioned, i did a ppt with saki302 last week and turners pasadena did not require a lock to be purchased.

Pulled from the Federal law:
SEC. 5. CHILD SAFETY LOCKS.

(c) FIREARMS SAFETY-

(1) MANDATORY TRANSFER OF SECURE GUN STORAGE OR SAFETY DEVICE- Section 922 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting at the end the following:

`(z) SECURE GUN STORAGE OR SAFETY DEVICE-

`(1) IN GENERAL- Except as provided under paragraph (2), it shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer to sell, deliver, or transfer any handgun to any person other than any person licensed under this chapter, unless the transferee is provided with a secure gun storage or safety device (as defined in section 921(a)(34)) for that handgun.


And 921 (a) 34 is this:
Quote:
(34) The term “secure gun storage or safety device” means—
(A) a device that, when installed on a firearm, is designed to prevent the firearm from being operated without first deactivating the device;
(B) a device incorporated into the design of the firearm that is designed to prevent the operation of the firearm by anyone not having access to the device; or
(C) a safe, gun safe, gun case, lock box, or other device that is designed to be or can be used to store a firearm and that is designed to be unlocked only by means of a key, a combination, or other similar means

In other words, it looks like
having a safe qualifies, and Turner's ought to let the safe affidavit satisfy the federal requirement, too.
you don't have to buy a lock, just bringing one in to attach to it should also qualify - you have to have one. A safe qualifies, and they can't make you buy a new safe for every gun, therefore a lock qualifies, and they shouldn't make you buy a lock for every gun.
CA law, however, says you MUST buy a new lock with every gun, unless you have a safe and sign the affidavit. So in both laws, a safe is satisfactory.

Added: the CA law

Quote:
12088.1. (a) All firearms sold or transferred in this state by a
licensed firearms dealer, including private transfers through a
dealer, and all firearms manufactured in this state, shall include or
be accompanied by a firearms safety device that is listed on the
Department of Justice's roster of approved firearms safety devices
and that is identified as appropriate for that firearm by reference
to either the manufacturer and model of the firearm, or to the
physical characteristics of the firearm that match those listed on
the roster for use with the device.
(b) All firearms sold or transferred in this state by a licensed
firearms dealer, including private transfers through a dealer, and
all firearms manufactured in this state shall be accompanied with
warning language or labels as described in Section 12088.3.
(c) [snipped]
(d) The sale or transfer of a firearm shall be exempt from
subdivision (a) if both of the following apply:
(1) The purchaser or transferee owns a gun safe that meets the
standards set forth in Section 12088.2. Gun safes shall not be
required to be tested, and therefore may meet the standards without
appearing on the Department of Justice roster.
(2) The purchaser or transferee presents an original receipt for
purchase of the gun safe, or other proof of purchase or ownership of
the gun safe as authorized by the Attorney General, to the firearms
dealer. The dealer shall maintain a copy of this receipt or proof of
purchase with the dealers' record of sales of firearms.
(e) The sale or transfer of a firearm shall be exempt from
subdivision (a) if all of the following apply:
(1) The purchaser or transferee purchases an approved safety
device no more than 30 days prior to the day the purchaser or
transferee takes possession of the firearm.
(2) The purchaser or transferee presents the approved safety
device to the firearms dealer when picking up the firearm.
(3) The purchaser or transferee presents an original receipt to
the firearms dealer which shows the date of purchase, the name, and
the model number of the safety device.
(4) The firearms dealer verifies that the requirements in (1) to
(3), inclusive, have been satisfied.
(5) The firearms dealer maintains a copy of the receipt along with
the dealers' record of sales of firearms.

[SemiAutoSam]

Good point and does the law state you must buy it from the FFL that does the DROS ? If not I would buy it from somewhere else and make sure you can take it back The same day if possible. Or has this been done enough that those that sell the approved locks are wise to this angle ?

I always end up buying a lock, too. I have like 7+ locks that I don't need, but forced to buy. When I buy guns that come with locks, I haven't had to buy one, but the CZ lock might not be "approved." What you do is buy the lock, then return it in a day for a refund.

[Tzvia]

When I bought my SIG last month, it came with a lock and that was just fine. Same for the Colt I bought last year, it came with a cable lock. The store would not take my State approved safe and the clerk stated that is no good for handguns even though they would fit in there just as well as a rifle . Conclusion? Gun laws are stupid. Cheezy cable locks are better at protecting your guns than big heavy safes. Gun laws make our streets safer, just look at DC, a shining example of gunlaws. Gunlaws are wonderful, easy to understand, and criminals cower at the words and the paper that they are written on. I feel better because I have about 10 of those stupid things. I am thinking about taking all my rifles out of the safes and putting cable locks on them instead. THEN I WILL BE SAFE.

[stealthmode]

what about the integral locks like the S&W revolvers or SA 1911 with the ILS. those guns did not have gun locks that came with them only the built in locks. when I bought my last two revolvers I did not have to buy a seperate lock just filled out the safe form.

[AW-FANATIC]

If all else fails just go and pick up a bunch of locks from the local police department. Most have free gun locks avaliable. You just have to ask.

[kilword]

buy it then take it back later

[jmlivingston]

If all else fails just go and pick up a bunch of locks from the local police department. Most have free gun locks avaliable. You just have to ask.

But do you get a receipt to demonstrate that you aquired it in the last 30 days to meet the state law when you pick up your handgun?

John

[Librarian]

WokMaster seems to have it right (I'd better think so, I posted in that same thread as EBWhite did...)

Anybody know how to approach BATFE to ask them to get off the dime and issue regs that include all of 921(a)34 as qualifying for the Child Safety thing? That would be a big help.

Just to summarize, I think it goes like this -
California requires that you EITHER have a lock, provably purchased in the last 30 days, OR sign the safe affidavit.
Feds require "SECURE GUN STORAGE OR SAFETY DEVICE", which can either be a lock or a safe. If you go the lock route, it has to be on the California approved list, or CA dealers can't deliver to you. BATFE's letter from April last year conveniently forgot to list 'safe' as satisfying the requirement.

[Johnny Diablo]

Yeppers

I bought a 10 rifle sentry locker from turners and dont know the model so had to buy the locks. I was thinking about just giving them back to the gunshop so they can sell them to the next guy.

They have that safe guns program printed on them. They hand them out free at gunshows.

[dfletcher]

Having recently bought more than 1 handgun in 30 days - a PPT and a new one - all I did for the new one is bring in the less than 30 day old receipt from the PPT with the lock and I did not have to buy a new CA approved gun lock with the 2nd gun.

I have to say I've got no idea as to what the law is & suspect some gun store owners are in the same boat. All I know is I've got well over 100 locks sitting in plastic bags. Maybe I should set up a table at the Cow Palace & sell them for $3.00 each, receipt included of course.