9mm Luger grain count

[bruss01]

For actual defense I'm sold on the 124-127 grain JHP projectile at +P or +P+ velocities. If we're going to talk 9mm that is.

That's not far off from the .357 mag range, and that bullet weight was shown to be very effective in .357 mag if you can give it reasonably high velocity.

There is a reason NATO settled on that weight range, and they had the bux to do a lot of testing that none of us will ever get to do. Yeah, they had to settle for ball ammo, with an HP your results can only get better.

[gemini1]

I think we're going OT. OP is asking about recoil difference when using different bullet weights.
However, is'nt it true that expansion/performance of bullet weight depends on barrel lenght? I think I've read a long time ago (Guns&Ammo'96) that for 3.5" barrel 115 gr is the best/recommended load. Not sure about longer barrel since I only have a compact pistol.

[Hollow Grind]

gemini1, it's all good, I'm learning a lot from all the good folks who've chimed in, thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences.

I'm thinking about hitting the show in Ontario this weekend and getting an assortment of different grains and brands to experiment with. I'd give a report, but I'm so green that my skill level would most likely negate any conclusions I draw.

[ALSystems]

For actual defense I'm sold on the 124-127 grain JHP projectile at +P or +P+ velocities. If we're going to talk 9mm that is.

A little history:
The 147grain 9mm overpentrate for defense purposes in my view unless you feel you need to shoot through an obstacle. The reason they became popular was that the FBI blamed 115 grain Silvertips for the failure of a 1986 Miami shootout. So the FBI sacrificed a lot of bullet performance for more penetration when they originally switched to 147 grain subsonic loads. Then a lot of police agencies blindly followed the FBI's lead. Later the FBI switched to other bullets such as 10mm and 40cal. Bullet designs have evolved and improved over the years.

Anyone who has a variety of bullet weights can test recoil and penetration for themself. For penetration tests glue some pieces of wood to a 6"-8" thickness for comparison. 10% Balistic Gel is more realistic but you'll need several pieces that are a lot thicker. Just mark each shot. FMJ penetrates more than HP. Also test the point of aim. Different bullet weights tend to aim differently.

For target practice the bullet selection criteria is different. Naturally accuracy is the most important consideration.

[J-cat]

A little history:
The 147grain 9mm overpentrate for defense purposes in my view unless you feel you need to shoot through an obstacle...

like an arm. Some dudes have arms as big as my thigh. I'd like to have that extra little bit of penetration co cover all shooting angles.

[ALSystems]

like an arm. Some dudes have arms as big as my thigh. I'd like to have that extra little bit of penetration co cover all shooting angles.

I did say this was my view. Personally I find 147 grain too heavy for optimal performance in 9mm (except maybe 147grain +P+).
If you really want to cover all shooting angles, I suggest you use something bigger like 40 cal, 45 cal, 10mm, 357 or 44mag.

[Jonathan Doe]

The way I look at it, and from what I see almost everyday in real shootings, Winchester 147 grains SXT subsonic ammo is hard to beat. Many people may have a difference in opinions, but I am talking from my experience and what I see on almost daily basis.

[J-cat]

I did say this was my view. Personally I find 147 grain too heavy for optimal performance in 9mm (except maybe 147grain +P+).
If you really want to cover all shooting angles, I suggest you use something bigger like 40 cal, 45 cal, 10mm, 357 or 44mag.

Those don't penetrate any deeper in the available self-defense loadings.

[Jonathan Doe]

Delete for duplicated post.

[Jonathan Doe]

You can believe whatever you want and all you want. I see it on a daily bases what it does to the bodies from my work. How much penetration do you need on human body? Body is about 12" thick, maybe couple more inches depend on build. Most body organs are 6" - 9" deep, maybe.

Use whatever you can get and hit the target. It is more important than bullet types. I see so many 1 shot kills with 22LR or 38 SPL LRN bullets.

[J-cat]

It's not about killing. It's about changing behavior.