S&W 686+ Indexing Failure

[target_shot]

Hello Everybody-

I recently aquired a 686+ as an early X-Mas present. However, much to my dismay, I have noticed that it does not lockup/carryup correctly.

It is a brand new firearm, never shot, however I did polish the frame/cylinder. The only "functional" parts polished, would be the indexing notches on the cylinder itself - I did not polish any internal surface that would affect the cylinder berm lockup nor did I polish the cylinder faces.

How would I go about fixing this?

[gawker]

Brand new, send it back to the factory or see if the gun store you bought it from will do the warranty work for you.

[PMACA_MFG]

Polished how? By hand with a rag or with a 5hp 8"dia scotchbrite wheel?

[nikki#2]

The only "functional" parts polished, would be the indexing notches on the cylinder itself - I did not polish the cylinder faces...

You polished the indexing notches themselves? Of course, it depends on how much metal you removed. That's a judgement call that only S&W service can answer.
Only one way to find out. Free shipping both ways..... I have found their service to be excellent.

Good Luck!

[nikki#2]

Polished how? By hand with a rag or with a 5hp 8"dia scotchbrite wheel?

[JTROKS]

Did you touch the arm at all? How many of the cylinder chambers does it lock up on? Inquiry minds want to know how this polishing was acoomplished?

[target_shot]

Yes - so sorry, I should have mentioned. Polished ONLY by hand and elbow grease, with Fitz.

Polished how? By hand with a rag or with a 5hp 8"dia scotchbrite wheel?

Rag. No power tools involved

Heh....yeah, I did want to risk ugly tooling marks everywhere...

Did you touch the arm at all? How many of the cylinder chambers does it lock up on? Inquiry minds want to know how this polishing was acoomplished?

I did touch the arm, but only the one exterior surface. I did not polish any internal surface, nor any external surface that joins (read - seam line) with any internal surface. . Just the outer barrel(?), the cylinder, backstrap, & face plates. Ill post pictures when possible

[Ant45]

Not wanting to ask a dumb question but did it work ok before you polished it?

[target_shot]

Not wanting to ask a dumb question but did it work ok before you polished it?

To be totally honest, I do not remember. I noticed it after I polished, and not before, BUT in polishing I didn't touch any critical components other than the indexing notches.

Do you have any other S&W revolvers to compare it to? How long have you been owning/shooting revolvers?

No, I do not have any other revolvers in general, let alone S&W.

I spoke to a trusted individual who has significant experience (+35 years) with revolvers, and he did confirm that it is a timing issue. It happened consistently, which now makes me doubt that it was my polishing - if it were my polishing, I would of had to over-polish each notch exactly the same.

He said it was a non issue, and too little of a deviation to create shaved bullets. I can't decide if I want to ship it back to S&W or not.....

[shakyshoot]

Let's go back to the beginning. What were your observations that lead you to say "It does not lock up correctly." And did your trusted revolver friend actually look at it, or give an opinion based on your description?

[target_shot]

Let's go back to the beginning. What were your observations that lead you to say "It does not lock up correctly." And did your trusted revolver friend actually look at it, or give an opinion based on your description?

He looked at it. As I said, 35+ years in the firearms industry with significant smithing experience (though not a fully-trained gunsmith).

As for my decision process....que me fingering the gun while admiring my own reflection. While pulling the hammer back, I, for some reason, placed my hand on the cylinder, which (due to failure to lock), rotated into position with an audible click.

Since, due to the hammer being cocked, I believed the cylinder should be locked and was naturally curious. I attempted, successfully, to recreate the timing issue several times. When cocking fast, inertia obviously makes the cylinder lock, but when cocking slow no such inertia exists so the cylinder does not totally lock.

[Your ad here]

If I really slowly pull the trigger in double action or hammer in single action while creating a drag (finger on cylinder) I can get my 686 to do what you are describing. I did send 2 revolvers back because the bolt wouldnt engage without the drag. They came back with a noticable difference for the better but still can create that no bolt engagement if I try. I would send it in.

[shakyshoot]

While pulling the hammer back

So you're saying the hammer has been pulled partially back, but not all the way cocked? If I'm understanding you correctly, this sounds perfectly normal to me. You will be able to rotate the cylinder by hand until it reaches the next index. If you are only pulling the hammer back very slightly, you'll be able to rotate the cylinder 360 degrees, because there's a spot where the cylinder latch has left the notch but before it falls back.

[target_shot]

If I really slowly pull the trigger in double action or hammer in single action while creating a drag (finger on cylinder) I can get my 686 to do what you are describing. I did send 2 revolvers back because the bolt wouldnt engage without the drag. They came back with a noticable difference for the better but still can create that no bolt engagement if I try. I would send it in.

I should have been more clear - I did not touch the cylinder until the hammer was totally cocked.

So you're saying the hammer has been pulled partially back, but not all the way cocked? If I'm understanding you correctly, this sounds perfectly normal to me. You will be able to rotate the cylinder by hand until it reaches the next index. If you are only pulling the hammer back very slightly, you'll be able to rotate the cylinder 360 degrees, because there's a spot where the cylinder latch has left the notch but before it falls back.

No, sorry, I misspoke (or mistyped)...

Read as follows

He looked at it. As I said, 35+ years in the firearms industry with significant smithing experience (though not a fully-trained gunsmith).

As for my decision process....que me fingering the gun while admiring my own reflection. Once the hammer was pulled back & locked, I, for some reason, placed my hand on the cylinder, which (due to failure to lock), rotated into position with an audible click.

Since, due to the hammer being cocked, I believed the cylinder should be locked and was naturally curious. I attempted, successfully, to recreate the timing issue several times. When cocking fast, inertia obviously makes the cylinder lock, but when cocking slow no such inertia exists so the cylinder does not totally lock.

[shakyshoot]

I should have been more clear - I did not touch the cylinder until the hammer was totally cocked.

Well that doesn't sound right. Kind of sounds like your cylinder latch isn't moving freely. (maybe a lube problem?) I'm referring to the piece that clicks into the index notches, between the frame and the cylinder. Look at the right side at the bottom of the cylinder and see what happens to that piece during a slow DA pull. It should leave the notch, drop back to the cylinder pretty quickly, the ride along the cylinder til it finds the next notch.