A few basic questions on the 40 S&W round

[tipoc]

I picked up a Glock 23 a couple of months back and have been kinda casually working the round some. The gun is accurate (given the gun) with 180 gr. loads but less so with 165 and 155 gr. loads.

This may be because of the gun, which is fine with the 180 gr. loads but gets quite jumpy in the hand with 155 and 165 gr. loads. I figure that there is a reason that many folks stipple their Glocks to make the stock easier to keep a hold on.

I tried one of those open end condom like things they sell for Glock stocks to reduce the slipperiness. Helped some, but not that much and made the grip thicker which the gun does not need.

So question one: Do others see any noticeable accuracy difference between loads? Mostly what I get is stringing which means the gun is jumping in my hand. As well as a wider dispersion of shots.

Could be just me and the gun of course. Most likely it is.

I noticed that the 40 S&W and the 10mm have the same rate of twist.

Question two:I also note that the range of bullet weights varies for the 40 from 135 gr. to 200 gr. and it strikes me that the rate of twist was set for the 180 gr. I wonder if this makes a difference.

Question 3: Have others noted improved accuracy with any other guns in 40S&W? If so with what loads?

tipoc

[stormvet]

I own two 23's a gen 3 and a 4, the recoil will become more noticeable the lighter you go with bullet weight. But I have not exsperianced it to the degree you seem to be.
I usually reload with 165g plated flat points, either X-trem, Berry's or Powerbond. With 5 to 5.4 grans of W231, I find this load very accurate and can do a mag dump at seven with all rounds scoreable. So don't find the gun too jumpy. I also use this load with a G27 and get the same results.
As far as other .40 handguns, I also own a M&P 5" Pro and a V-Tac. But my most accurate and softest shooting 40 as well as my favorite is my two G-35 they are tack drivers.

[mej16489]

I've noticed that all of my Glocks chambered in .40 absolutely hate Winchester White box with bullet weights less then 180. Especially 165s they fly all over the place - something like 10" groups at 10 yards when I can easily shoot 100 rounds in a 1-inch hole at that distance.

[Citadelgrad87]

Same. My g27 keyholes wwb at 165gr.

[himurax13]

So question one: Do others see any noticeable accuracy difference between loads? Mostly what I get is stringing which means the gun is jumping in my hand. As well as a wider dispersion of shots.

Question two:I also note that the range of bullet weights varies for the 40 from 135 gr. to 200 gr. and it strikes me that the rate of twist was set for the 180 gr. I wonder if this makes a difference.

Question 3: Have others noted improved accuracy with any other guns in 40S&W? If so with what loads?

tipoc

This rambling can be used for almost any caliber/gun.

1. There are several factors at play here. The width of your bore, the width of the bullet, what bullet was used (profile, material, etc.), what powder was used, what was used to make the bullet etc. Some loads are more accurate than others and this can vary from gun to gun.

2. I have not noticed a difference as far as twist rate goes. I believe pistol barrels are too short for this to make any measurable difference.

3. Again, Accuracy/Precision depends on many different factors. The only way to find out is to use several different loads and use the same methods for testing (i.e. ransom rest).


If you want a more accurate load, get a proper set of after market sights that work with your specific load.

If you want a more precise load, you basically need to learn how to reload and make your own customized ammo. People who have reloaded for years can typically crank out ammo that is cheaper and far more consistent than anything you can buy in a store.

Lighter bullets use more powder so felt recoil is greater. Heavier bullets use less powder so felt recoil is lower.

I can tell you this, most shooters (95%+) cannot fully utilize the mechanical accuracy of their gun.

I hope this helps and good luck on your search.

[sofbak]

I have a Hi-Power and an SP-01 Tactical in .40 S&W. I ran a ton of ladder loads in both using 165,180, and 200 gr bullets, with fmj bullets from Delta, and plated hollow points from X-treme. On top of all that, I also used three different powders-231, Titegroup, and Bullseye.

Far and away, in both guns, with all the powders, the 185 gr bullets from both companies did significantly better than either the 165 or the 200.

[crufflers]

This may be because of the gun, which is fine with the 180 gr. loads but gets quite jumpy in the hand with 155 and 165 gr. loads. I figure that there is a reason that many folks stipple their Glocks to make the stock easier to keep a hold on.

I tried one of those open end condom like things they sell for Glock stocks to reduce the slipperiness. Helped some, but not that much and made the grip thicker which the gun does not need.

I have TALON granulate grips on one of my G22's and they are great for grip and don't look that bad. Plus you can just pull them off cleanly if you ever need to re-apply a new one or just want them off. They do not go anywhere once applied and you actually heat-shrink them onto the grip so they mold into the texture and are as slim as you can get.

[Beendare]

I too have glock 23 and of all of my pistols its the one i shoot the least accurate.

Its small and light....and it doesn't point especially well for me...that explains it

[himurax13]

I too have glock 23 and of all of my pistols its the one i shoot the least accurate.

Its small and light....and it doesn't point especially well for me...that explains it

I added a KKM barrel, Grip Force adapter, and skateboard tape to my 23c, and now that thing is a nail driver.

[rdfact]

I have a Glock 23. My best load so far is 165gr plated bullet using 4.7gr Titegroup. Last range trip this load produced better groups than my 45ACP load. Tells me (1) this is a good load for my Glock and (2) I need to work on my 45ACP load.

[Gryff]

I tried one of those open end condom like things they sell for Glock stocks to reduce the slipperiness. Helped some, but not that much and made the grip thicker which the gun does not need.

Try Decal Grip. It is available in skateboard tape style (more traction and thinner, but hard on clothing/skin if you carry concealed) and rubber texture (easier on clothing but increases grip width noticeably).

http://www.decalgrip.com/

Last time I looked, it was about $10.

[SB1964]

I bought a G23 tried a lot of ammo, functions really well but it was snappy. Wasn't accurate for my use. I bought a Stormlake 9mm barrel for it & have not looked back. Super accurate, less snappy & a lot more enjoyable. I can't get anyone to stand in front of it, lol!

[Port Authority]

I picked up a Glock 23 a couple of months back and have been kinda casually working the round some. The gun is accurate (given the gun) with 180 gr. loads but less so with 165 and 155 gr. loads.

This may be because of the gun, which is fine with the 180 gr. loads but gets quite jumpy in the hand with 155 and 165 gr. loads. I figure that there is a reason that many folks stipple their Glocks to make the stock easier to keep a hold on.

I tried one of those open end condom like things they sell for Glock stocks to reduce the slipperiness. Helped some, but not that much and made the grip thicker which the gun does not need.

So question one: Do others see any noticeable accuracy difference between loads? Mostly what I get is stringing which means the gun is jumping in my hand. As well as a wider dispersion of shots.

Could be just me and the gun of course. Most likely it is.

I noticed that the 40 S&W and the 10mm have the same rate of twist.

Question two:I also note that the range of bullet weights varies for the 40 from 135 gr. to 200 gr. and it strikes me that the rate of twist was set for the 180 gr. I wonder if this makes a difference.

Question 3: Have others noted improved accuracy with any other guns in 40S&W? If so with what loads?

tipoc

I find that when I take my pinkie out of my grip, it helps me concentrate on the thumb to third finger clamp which holds the pistol in place ... first.

Then the fourth finger, the strong one, can control the recoil flip consistantly ... w/o the pinkie pulling my aim around.

It took me years to figure this out, and then I saw Hickok45 show that he doesn't use it either.

It is sometimes a major cause of stringing.

Port

[RR.44]

My Sig SP2022 in .40 with 155gr. Hornady XTPs over 5.5grs of 231 will cut one hole at 10 yds.

[IVC]

Same. My g27 keyholes wwb at 165gr.

Keyholing (tumbling) will destroy accuracy. Short of that, chances are it's the shooter, not the bullet. The best way to evaluate it is to shoot fully supported off of a bench rest.

When thinking about "inherent accuracy" think about shooting rifles, where the difference between a "tack driver" and a "POS" is about 3" at 100 yards, which is only about 0.5" at 15 yards. Handguns are inherently less accurate due to the shorter barrel and off-hand shooting, but it's still that most of the inconsistency comes from the shooter.