Question about scenario, "As Seen On TV!"

[SharedShots]

You have one job, the safety of yourself and family. Thats it. There is no getting into other people's business, you could have been sitting there all day along with the guy who got clocked, not knowing HE was actually the one out there doing **** and someone happened to recognize him and decided enough was enough. While that's being a vigilante it still doesn't make it your job or duty to get involved and thus expose yourself to more danger than already exists.

For all you know, it was 2 gang members and there you are contemplating anything but your #1 job. The hitters buddies could have been waiting around the corner and there you are, involved in some BS you had no business getting into.

This I gotta do something or prepare in case something comes up isn't worth it. First, no two situations are going to be the same. If you remember your only job then all the rest becomes much easier instead of mulling the multitude of scenarios you spend your time tossing around in your head.

Don't they teach that you want to avoid if at all possible, physical combat/fight/altercation with someone while you are carrying a gun? If they stop teaching that, shame on them. That is how guns are taken away from people and yeah, it happens to CCW holders who get careless or can't avoid the fight.

There are people, some right on this forum who, were they within arm's reach of you could disable you and take your gun from you. It wouldn't matter if you train 7 days a week, they are that good and that fast. While you are processing some scenario in your head, they've taken your gun and then it's time to meet your maker.

Thumb this, twiddle that, go through the hitter and slide past the hitee. It's BS pure and simple, make believe and fantasy.

Its simple, something happens you get away. If you can't get away you protect and defend yourself. You aren't there to defend everyone else. Your job is to get home safely protecting yourself and family if they are with. Thats it. Visit a cemetery - plenty of people there who got into other people's business. They are also known as hero, wannabe, BMOC and by a few other terms.

And that pepper spray? Yeah, you pull your spray and the other guy pulls a gun. Now what? You are the third wheel in a physical fight and now YOU are the escalation. All because you have a CCW and think for some reason you need to act. Think you can outdraw someone pointing a gun at you? Or, are you now going to also draw your gun when you pull your spray too?

Some of you need to get into some inner city and see what goes on there. Then you'll realize that if you just pay attention to your #1 job then everything works out. Start with the scenarios about when you do more than your #1 job and watch just how fast you end up looking down the barrel of your own gun.



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[mej16489]

https://nypost.com/2022/08/17/wendys-employee-charged-with-murder-after-customer-he-sucker-punched-dies/

Wendy's employee in Prescott Valley, AZ 'sucker punch murderer'

[mk2dave]

Absolutely disgusting.

[OCEquestrian]

CCW's do not come with a badge.

[OCEquestrian]

https://nypost.com/2022/08/17/wendys...-punched-dies/

Wendy's employee in Prescott Valley, AZ 'sucker punch murderer'

There seems to be "one group of people" who resort to violence FIRST, at the slightest provocation, be it a police officer doing his job or an ordinary citizen. When will society demand responsible behavior and lock up those who cant comply with the request?

[mk2dave]

CCW's do not come with a badge.

Are you lamenting this fact? I don't think anyone is arguing to the contrary.

Regarding people who act out violently, I think it's because they are convinced there aren't any ramifications for their actions. The news is filled with criminals who have dozens of arrests but are still walking the streets to commit more crimes. Some DA's are finding ways to reduce felonies to misdemeanors so cash bails are avoided. Gascon is one of the biggest proponents of letting criminals go in the name of "equity". Until voters change their vote, there is no reason for anyone to change their behavior.

This part is only my theory: no matter what is on the news from LA or NY, that isn't most of America's reality. I think this Wendy's employee is in for a rude awakening.

[TrailerparkTrash]

[U]
And that pepper spray? Yeah, you pull your spray and the other guy pulls a gun. Now what? You are the third wheel in a physical fight and now YOU are the escalation. All because you have a CCW and think for some reason you need to act. Think you can outdraw someone pointing a gun at you? Or, are you now going to also draw your gun when you pull your spray too?

Some of you need to get into some inner city and see what goes on there. Then you'll realize that if you just pay attention to your #1 job then everything works out. Start with the scenarios about when you do more than your #1 job and watch just how fast you end up looking down the barrel of your own gun.

[Brother_Hesekiel]

I have to concur with what's been said here. I personally would take a step away from the action and call 9-1-1. It's possible, just possible, that I would follow the guy and report his position to the dispatcher, but I wouldn't get so close to him that this would put my own safety in jeopardy. Under no circumstances would I engage him nor would I even think that me carrying a gun has anything to do with this.

[Dano3467]

The world we used to know is fruked now, & is rank with these types.

Criminals like this will skate. But if you intervene (say with firearm), it will likely not go well.

In Ca, you'll likely do prison time for being a good samaritan in this case.

There is something very flawed with the justice system. Ca x10

[BC9696]

Me? I'm capturing what i can on my camera and rendering first aid to the victim. If the asshat comes at me then all bets are off...I am defending myself.

[TrailerparkTrash]

I have to concur with what's been said here. I personally would take a step away from the action and call 9-1-1. It's possible, just possible, that I would follow the guy and report his position to the dispatcher, but I wouldn't get so close to him that this would put my own safety in jeopardy. Under no circumstances would I engage him nor would I even think that me carrying a gun has anything to do with this.

Not trying to back you into a corner but since you mentioned it… I would hope that somebody that has a means to legally carry (CCW or LE etc…), would not have a 100% “under no circumstance“ policy within their soul to step in and help somebody in dire need from a murdering psychopath. I don’t believe you yourself were conveying that message, but it brings up a sad fact, that there are many people who wouldn’t do anything to help save a life.

Does anybody remember actress Theresa Saldana (Raging Bull, The Commish) back in 1982 getting stabbed multiple times right out in front of her condo in West Hollywood, and nearly dying right there? Out of about a half dozen people or more who were just standing around and gawking literally, one loan Sparkletts water delivery man heard the call for help and ran to her aid UNARMED mind you, ultimately saving her life.

Imagine if anyone of us finding out the same or similar incident happening to any of our own mothers, daughters, wife, sister and somebody close by that was legally carrying a firearm (CCW holder off-duty L/E) refused to get involved and take some type of action to save a life. All because they just “didn’t want to get involved.” Or they were too concerned about losing their own CCW privilege and or worried about the publicity and witness courtroom testimony drama that would arise in the future.

Or picture a school shooting and somebody having a CCW just outside of the stupid “1,000 yard school zone” rule, but seeing a psychopath in the school parking lot firing a gun randomly. I can’t imagine any descent CCW holder refusing to get involved to at least try to stop that monster. (Let alone the cops at Uvalde didn’t do anything, but that’s for a different thread).

I don’t know how anybody could live with themselves by having a “under NO circumstance” policy to help save a life when legally carrying and could have stopped a murder right in front of them. But sadly, there are indeed gawkers and people in this world that would in fact refuse to take meaningful action in using their CCW privileges and instead, would just pull out their dammn iPhones.

[SharedShots]

But that isn't what is thread was about, the life or death saving a life thing, it was about one guy sucker punching another.

There are infinite what ifs.

If everyone was able to carry instead of having the "privilege" then many of those what if this and that wouldn't happen in the first place. Far scarier than some BG punching someone is the thought processes of some CCW holders who see themselves as some police auxiliary force walking around just hoping for the chance to be a hero.





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[TrailerparkTrash]

But that isn't what is thread was about, the life or death saving a life thing, it was about one guy sucker punching another.
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Not entirely correct. You’re right that the thread was NOT about this…

…until it turned in that direction with the “UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES” comment. That sounded like an unequivocal, 100% “I won’t get involved at all, no matter what, period” comment to me.

I was just pointing out clarification that there are indeed “some” circumstances in which I hope some of us legally armed people here would in fact render aid with deadly force if need be. Like I said previously, I also don’t think that Brother_Hesekiel meant his comment to sound as if he himself wouldn’t use deadly force to help someone if someone was being attacked right in front of him with a potential for deadly force. But he brings a good question to the conversation.

We all know that sadly, there are indeed some people even here in CG that even though legally armed, they would just stand around a do nothing when someone is viciously attacked. Since the discussion kinda turned that way, I just brought up the point that we all would hope that situation never comes to fruition. That’s all.


…And lots of people have died from brutal “sucker punches” and even kicks to the head. Deadly force doesn’t mean a weapon must be used to acccomplish the killing of someone. Bare hands and feet can become deadly weapons as well, especially when someone is already down for the count, yet the attacker continues on with his beating frenzy.

[SharedShots]

Not entirely correct. You’re right that the thread was NOT about this…

…until it turned in that direction with the “UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES” comment. That sounded like an unequivocal, 100% “I won’t get involved at all, no matter what, period” comment to me.

I was just pointing out clarification that there are indeed “some” circumstances in which I hope some of us legally armed people here would in fact render aid with deadly force if need be. Like I said previously, I also don’t think that Brother_Hesekiel meant his comment to sound as if he himself wouldn’t use deadly force to help someone if someone was being attacked right in front of him with a potential for deadly force. But he brings a good question to the conversation.

We all know that sadly, there are indeed some people even here in CG that even though legally armed, they would just stand around a do nothing when someone is viciously attacked. Since the discussion kinda turned that way, I just brought up the point that we all would hope that situation never comes to fruition. That’s all.


…And lots of people have died from brutal “sucker punches” and even kicks to the head. Deadly force doesn’t mean a weapon must be used to acccomplish the killing of someone. Bare hands and feet can become deadly weapons as well, especially when someone is already down for the count, yet the attacker continues on with his beating frenzy.

This became an emotion issue when it starts to go down the road of daughter, sister, mother and so on. Everybody is someone else's relative. When someone, anyone, shoots someone else they are shooting the father/mother, daughter, sister etc of someone. It works both ways.

Here is the point though and no one wants to go there, for obvious reasons:

No matter what you see you have no idea what happened before that. You are there in the moment. There is a reason why you mind your own business:

One guy walks up and sucker punches another guy. Punched guy falls down. Lets even say the other guy then continues to pummel him. That is what you see. What you didn't see is that a block away the guy that got punched had just finished raping the punchers daughter. Ah, now it changes because it's more than one ahole sucker punching someone appearing to be innocent right?

So you get involved because you have the means. You start with the pepper spray. You are srpaying the guy who just a short time ago raped someone's daughter. But what they hey, it ain't your daughter right?

You do your good deed, you spray the puncher and the punchee aka as rapist takes out his knife and slits the throat of puncher aka Father of raped daughter.

Some of you aren't getting it. That CCW does not make you judge, jury and executioner nor part of some greater good walking around to help and get involved in things you don't know about.

You aren't the police who got a dispatch with a description and with some authority to arrest or use deadly force during the apprehension if it comes to that, you just happen to have a license to carry and that is the end of that. You can talk about humanity and how if it's your (fill in the blank) that you'd want someone to do something. Well, that is all good and fine except your don't have the right or obligation to decide to shoot someone unless they present a direct threat to your well being and life or those with you (a stretch unless family or friends but not just people who happen to be around you).

Think past your gun.

So now, who thinks there is some justification because somewhere someone killed someone else with a sucker punch and that gives you some right to get involved, not knowing anything else and become the police because that is just what is going on here, just danced around and explained in every way but the reality of what is being said?

And yeah, the father of said rapist doesn't have the right to be a vigilante but that still doesn't give you the right to be Mr. Law Enforcement either. You do not get to decide. You are no one special, you have a gun and that is it. That gun doesn't come with law enforcement attached to it.



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[TrailerparkTrash]

This became an emotion issue when it starts to go down the road of daughter, sister, mother and so on. Everybody is someone else's relative. When someone, anyone, shoots someone else they are shooting the father/mother, daughter, sister etc of someone. It works both ways.

Here is the point though and no one wants to go there, for obvious reasons:

No matter what you see you have no idea what happened before that. You are there in the moment. There is a reason why you mind your own business:

One guy walks up and sucker punches another guy. Punched guy falls down. Lets even say the other guy then continues to pummel him. That is what you see. What you didn't see is that a block away the guy that got punched had just finished raping the punchers daughter. Ah, now it changes because it's more than one ahole sucker punching someone appearing to be innocent right?

So you get involved because you have the means. You start with the pepper spray. You are srpaying the guy who just a short time ago raped someone's daughter. But what they hey, it ain't your daughter right?

You do your good deed, you spray the puncher and the punchee aka as rapist takes out his knife and slits the throat of puncher aka Father of raped daughter.

Some of you aren't getting it. That CCW does not make you judge, jury and executioner nor part of some greater good walking around to help and get involved in things you don't know about.

You aren't the police who got a dispatch with a description and with some authority to arrest or use deadly force during the apprehension if it comes to that, you just happen to have a license to carry and that is the end of that. You can talk about humanity and how if it's your (fill in the blank) that you'd want someone to do something. Well, that is all good and fine except your don't have the right or obligation to decide to shoot someone unless they present a direct threat to your well being and life or those with you (a stretch unless family or friends but not just people who happen to be around you).

Think past your gun.

So now, who thinks there is some justification because somewhere someone killed someone else with a sucker punch and that gives you some right to get involved, not knowing anything else and become the police because that is just what is going on here, just danced around and explained in every way but the reality of what is being said?

And yeah, the father of said rapist doesn't have the right to be a vigilante but that still doesn't give you the right to be Mr. Law Enforcement either. You do not get to decide. You are no one special, you have a gun and that is it. That gun doesn't come with law enforcement attached to it.
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