Just got a big certified letter from Torrance

[CCWFacts]

Some people here are no doubt aware of a recent Federal lawsuit against the city of Torrance for denying a CCW to a Torrance resident.

According to a January 5th 2009 post, the case was resolved with a confidential settlement.

Out of curiosity, I sent a PRAR to the City of Torrance to find out what's going on.

I asked for all CCW-related correspondence with Mr. Spears, including denial and issuance letters, and his app. I also asked for a list of all CCWs issued in 2008.

The result was, I found his denial letter. I also saw his app, with a blank Page 13 (good cause page). And they made a statement that they issued no CCWs at all in 2008.

That all seems to indicate that, whatever the settlement was, Mr. Spears didn't end up getting a CCW.

However...

We've seen some other cases of deceptive responses to CCW PRARs, like LA Sheriff claiming that Sly Stallone didn't have a CCW, when he certainly did (revealed by follow-up correspondence).

In this case, already the fact that the GC statement (Page 13) was blank shows that their response was incomplete. The GC statement presumably was on a separate page, which they omitted to send me. It's possible that a CCW was issued in '09, not in '08, and I had requested records for '08.

My next letter will be to request all the CCWs issued in '09. It was a mistake for me to limit my initial inquiry to '08. If Mr. Spears did get a permit, and it wasn't issued in '08, it would have been issued in '09.

Note that "did he get a permit" isn't the end of the issue. Even if he didn't get one, it doesn't mean he "lost". It might mean that he got legal fees back, agreed he could apply again later, all kinds of things. In a confidential settlement, there are many outcomes that can't be seen in public records. All we can know is if he has a permit or not, and that's not the full story.

To sum it up:

1. I got a copy (but missing a GC statement page, and perhaps other attachments) of Mr. Spears' app.
2. They also sent copies of a denial, an appeal of the denial, and then a final denial of the app.
3. Mr. Spears didn't get a permit in '08
4. I need to request issuance information for '09; if he got a permit it might have been issued this year.
5. I don't believe that their response was 100% inclusive of what I was asking for.

[problemchild]

If only we had a pro-gun candidate in office. Thanks for the informative post. Do you have to apply in the city you live in?

[glockman19]

In a confidential settlement, there are many outcomes that can't be seen in public records.

That in itself seems wrong...Confidential settlements & Public Records?

[CCWFacts]

That in itself seems wrong...Confidential settlements & Public Records?

The CCW aspect is public records, as always, but other terms, like payment of legal fees and so on, can be made confidential. It's very common for settlements to be confidential. It's often desirable to both parties, and it's perfectly reasonable and legitimate, including in lawsuits against a city or other government entity.

[nicki]

CCW applications and PRA's.

The good cause statements were designed to be put under investigator notes so that when you do a PRA, they don't send you the good cause statement.

The CCW application was made uniform statewide by AB2022 and when the new form was crafted by then AG Lockyer, they deliberately put the good cause in a section of the application so as to make a attempt to hide the good cause from a PRA request.

This of course is a end run around the Cal Supreme court ruling CBS vs Block which specifically said that the "good cause statements" were critical to establishing patterns of equal rights violations and that those were specifically what a PRA request would need.

Most people don't know this, including the sheriffs.

Things of course are going to get interesting. You would probably need a court order to force this info out.

Hopefully we can get lawyers up and down the state who would be interested in just showing up in court and collecting a paycheck.



Nicki