Koppel v Bonta: 2023 denial of CCW, Orange Co

[guntrust]

Will watch this with interest, close to filing my own case.

[marcusrn]

"California fireaem licensing regime is so vague and ambiguous it subjects applicants to arbitrary and capricious treatment and therefore violates due process". This was Peruta in 2010 and a dozen other national cases. People will not peacefully protest and sue forever.

[19K]

But that refusal was after he had been asked to take the psych eval. I read CGZ's question to be what triggered the request for a psych eval in the first place. It sounds like that is not a routine request in OC.

Im taking a wild guess and say probably when he spoke to them about the GMC denial they said to clear it up he needs one.

[darkwater34]

Cali really blows on this crap the only way to legal carry a firearm is to possess a CCW. Yet criminals allowed to do whatever they want to those that abide by the law. Arizona among other states have Constitutional Carry Laws in place. Also because any whom can legally possess and purchase a firearm can carry concealed or open CCW's are easy to obtain, having a CCW in Arizona you no longer have to pay for background checks when purchasing firearms. A right denied is a right lost I read that somewhere and I agea. All these lawsuits wasting taxpayer monies to take rights away is sad.

[19K]

Cali really blows on this crap the only way to legal carry a firearm is to possess a CCW. Yet criminals allowed to do whatever they want to those that abide by the law. Arizona among other states have Constitutional Carry Laws in place. Also because any whom can legally possess and purchase a firearm can carry concealed or open CCW's are easy to obtain, having a CCW in Arizona you no longer have to pay for background checks when purchasing firearms. A right denied is a right lost I read that somewhere and I agea. All these lawsuits wasting taxpayer monies to take rights away is sad.

As far as I am aware background checks are free and pay by your taxes in most states. I never paid a separate fee when I lived in Georgia and purchased a firearm from an FFL.

If I recall you don?t have to fill out the 4473 (they will with their info). They take a copy of your permit.

[Drivedabizness]

As far as I am aware background checks are free and pay by your taxes in most states. I never paid a separate fee when I lived in Georgia and purchased a firearm from an FFL.

If I recall you don?t have to fill out the 4473 (they will with their info). They take a copy of your permit.

Umm no. Most Counties charge an exhorbitant fee (well in excess of $100) just to process the application. Then there is a Livescan fee.

And we ALWAYS have to fill out a 4473 for every firearm - even if you have a CCW.

Welcome to California. You checked your freedom at the door.

[Sgt Raven]

As far as I am aware background checks are free and pay by your taxes in most states. I never paid a separate fee when I lived in Georgia and purchased a firearm from an FFL.

If I recall you don?t have to fill out the 4473 (they will with their info). They take a copy of your permit.

IIRC, an FFL has to have a signed & completed 4473 for every firearm transferred to a non-FFL..

[AlmostHeaven]

In Virginia, we have a background check fee for every transfer.

Buy a gun for $X, and you have to tack on 6% sales tax and a modest Virginia State Police background check fee.

It ought to be unconstitutional, but one step at a time, since we unfortunately have much bigger issues to worry about than background check fees.

[darkwater34]

I recently purchased 5 firearms here in Arizona and only had to fill out one
4473 and did not have to pay the $25.00 fee. Just show my CCV and D.L.
Now before I had my CCW I bought an AR-15 complete lower had to show my Arizon D.L. fill out the 4473 and pay the $25,00 for the background check and by the way walked out of the gunshop with my firearms the same day. I love Arizona constitutional carry and
No waiting periods and now that I have my CCW NO background check fees.

[CGZ]

I recently purchased 5 firearms here in Arizona and only had to fill out one
4473 and did not have to pay the $25.00 fee. Just show my CCV and D.L.
Now before I had my CCW I bought an AR-15 complete lower had to show my Arizon D.L. fill out the 4473 and pay the $25,00 for the background check and by the way walked out of the gunshop with my firearms the same day. I love Arizona constitutional carry and
No waiting periods and now that I have my CCW NO background check fees.

Many states have it where if you have a CCW, it is used as your background check when filling out a 4473. In California, it only serves as a proof of residency and waver for the safe handling demonstration. In California, you need a C&R and COE to bypass the 1 in 30 restrictions and the 10 day wait for eligible C&R firearms.

[AlmostHeaven]

No waiting periods and now that I have my CCW NO background check fees.

That's the way it ought to be everywhere.

There aren't any waiting periods in Virginia, but our concealed handgun permit doesn't exempt us from the mandatory "universal" background check for some stupid reason, considering the same authority that issues the permit also conducts the background checks.

[flyer898]

After Bruen held that the 2nd Amendment protects the right to be armed outside the home, a person is presumptively entitled to a permit. If the state disagrees, then it is their burden to rebut that presumption. However, the process in place turns that on its head. Getting a permit should be no more complicated, time consuming, or costly than getting a driver's license. Carrying a firearm for defense outside the home is a constitutional right - driving is a privelege.

[19K]

Umm no. Most Counties charge an exhorbitant fee (well in excess of $100) just to process the application. Then there is a Livescan fee.

And we ALWAYS have to fill out a 4473 for every firearm - even if you have a CCW.

Welcome to California. You checked your freedom at the door.

My quote was in reference to the post I quoted relating to AZ law.


There is no livescan fee for a DROS. There is a fee for dros. Are you referring to a live scan for getting a CCW in California? There is always a live scan fee. In every state for getting a live scan for anything.

There isn?t a charge in most states for a NICS check, which is done in AZ.

I read up in AZ law and misunderstood. A 4473 is required to be completed but a background check isn?t ran if the buyer has an AZ CCW.

[19K]

IIRC, an FFL has to have a signed & completed 4473 for every firearm transferred to a non-FFL..

Yes I misunderstood what I read. A 4473 is filled out but a background check isn?t run if the buyer has a CCW, in AZ.

[SpudmanWP]

Getting a permit should be no more complicated, time consuming, or costly than getting a driver's license. Carrying a firearm for defense outside the home is a constitutional right - driving is a privelege.

Agree.

It should be as simple as:
1. Take your training/qualificaiton.
2. Do your picture, background check, and livescan on the same day.
3. Pickup your CCW a week later.