45acp & win231/hp38 Recipe Discrepancy ?

[affiliated714]

Thought about trying some 45 loads with win231/hp38 and started doing the basic homework...
I have only gone as far as checking my two manuals so far, hornady & lee, but will obviously be consulting many other sources, however this stumped me and thought I'd ask here first(hope I'm not over looking something basic here...):
I know they also test with different firearms/conditions/etc, however, this seems to be a fairly large discrepancy (in my limited experience)...

Both are for 230 fmj-rn, col are slightly different too, but didn't think it created that large a difference?

Hornady Manual:
5.0gr, 1.230 col = 700fps
**5.4gr, 1.230 col = 750fps
5.7gr, 1.230 col = 800fps (max)

Lee Manual:
**4.2gr, 1.200 (min) col = 750fps
Never to exceed 5.3gr = 832fps

Other powders however seemed similar/comparable, such as titegroup...

Thoughts???

[razgriz183]

Hodgonreloading.com looks like they use the same numbers as lee's manual. My Lyman manual gives different numbers as well

[jwest]

Doesn't appear to be in the errata either:

http://www.hornady.com/support/handbook-updates-errata

[MrElectric03]

Many factors that could change velocity but that is a big difference. Could be a typo or mixed up bullet weights. If you are just loading for plinking it may not matter much. Otherwise maybe pick up a chrono and get your own results and see what suits your needs.

[bazineta]

Practically speaking, best of luck on getting a COL of 1.200 to feed. I think those must have been shot in a test fixture rather than a firearm.

[affiliated714]

I'm still a little puzzled by this...
Spoke with hornady this morning, they assured me their data was accurate and that I was one of many who have inquired about that data over the years...

Still don't understand how there is practically a +/-1.0gr difference compared to other similar data, seems like too much right?

Don't own a chrono yet, so any successful/proven loads out there I could get first hand? If not, guess I'll just start with the lowest data I find and go from there...

[bruce381]

start at low end and go up a .2 grs till you get relable function

[BigBronco]

A lot of research goes in to creating a reloading manual. Well that is for most companies. Not so much for the Bo Lee manual. The Lee manual is a compilation of other companies data. Should one read the information on the page prior to the actual data in a good manual it will inform the reader of just what the test firearm used to achieve that data. variations of data from one manual to another can be from the different firearm used. sometimes it could even be a test receiver and barrel (laboratory). Fat chance finding out what the test firearm as in the Lee manual.

I refer to the bullet manufacturers manual first when using their bullet. Second the powder manufacturers data and last on my list is the Lee data.

[affiliated714]

^^^Good info, thank you

[pdoggeth]

My guess for the discrepancy is the different OAL used by the two references. The first one uses 1.230 and the second is 1.200 . having a shorter OAL increases the pressure for any given charge, so it would make more sense why the 2nd set of numbers uses slightly lower charges. I'd go with the first set of numbers though, as that is what I've been using too for win231/hp38

[mycrstuff]

The Lee manual is low for the minimum and maximum load on all calibers. I got rid of my Lee manual and use an average load based on three other manuals combined. The other manuals have loads that were close to each other but the Lee was way off compared to the other manuals.

[BEE]

For 230grn RN bullets I like to load them at 1.260" OAL with 5.5grns HP-38.

[noylj]

Did they use the same gun? Did they use the same lot of powder? Did they use the same bullet (and bullets do have slight differences lot-to-lot and from swage die to swage die)? Same cases and primers? Same COL?
If these "discrepancies" did not exist, there would be ONE manual and everyone would just select the velocity they wanted and load it and there would be no need for load work-up.
So, I prefer to check two sources at least and start at the lowest start load and work up.
EVERY manual should admit up front that the data contained in it is only for that particular gun, bullet, and lot of powder at that particular COL and they the reloader's results will differ so START AT THE START LOAD AND WORK UP.
Next, Lee's data is a compilation and he has edited the data to reference the lowest max loads. You will find many time that the start and max loads are the same in Richard Lee's manual. Lee always shows data that leans very hard to the low pressure/safe region.