When is ammo to old?

[MrMarz408]

I picked up some .223 ammo yesterday from an old timer than he had laying around. I would say an easy 12yrs. 580rds. of soft tip in an ammo box for $90. Looks in pritty good condition. How cn I tell if primers are bad? Some rounds have a little build up on the brass caseings that I'm wiping off.

Ammo is labeled TW 72, anyone recognize this brand?
What do ou guys think?

[chino]

http://www.igman.com/ammunition/codes/T/TW-USA.html

Twin city produced ammunition for the military, I'm not certain if it ever made soft tip

While this is an odd 30-06 does the headstamp looks like this one?


Ammo if kept under reasonable conditions have a long shelf life.

[MrMarz408]

Looks exactly like that except for the numbers. On the picture it says TW 54 and what I got it says TW 72.
Also found some rounds in there stamped TC 72 and that seems to be from turkey. But both were in the same packaging

[Flying Sig]

Take it to the range, load it up and pull the trigger. If it doesn't go BOOM, it's too old.

[bjl333]

I've shot 30yrs+ ammo. Modern smokeless powder have a long shelflife in the package. Its just as long in the cartrige if no moisture got in it.

^ Just like Flying Sig said just pull the trigger and see if it goes bang, I'm betting all of it will !!!

[Plisk]

I've shot WWI surplus ammo. Ammo is too old when it hasn't been stored properly. Think of ammo like crackers, keep them air tight and dry and they'll stay crispy for a long long time.

[Quiet]

Modern ammunition stored in non-humid/wet enviroments will last for over a 100 years.

DCM/CMP ammo from the 1940s is still good to go.

[Librarian]

A few years ago, I found some Winchester .22LR at my dad's house, from when I got my first rifle (still have it!); that shot fine. I've used WW2 surplus .45 with no problem.

It seems that simple age isn't much of an influence; moisture would be, and I'm not sure that would be obvious just by looking. I have heard that oil and solvents can contaminate primers and deactivate them.

And one other I've heard, and cannot confirm - vibration may have an influence; some powders are manufactured with a certain shape of the grains. Long exposure to vibration may break those down, and the powder would have different burning characteristics.

(Note the 'may' and 'would' - don't know for sure if this is true, nor what kind of change might occur if true.)

[MrMarz408]

I did wipe off a liitle moisture and what seemed to be like a guee gun powder from only about 8 rds. most off it looks really good. its been stored in an ammo box that looks in extremelly good condition. Weather here in Los Angeles is Humide at times but seal on box has no signs of damage.

So at worst all that will happen is no BOOM and it won't explode in my gun?
gonna shoot it tomorrow.

[CSACANNONEER]

I try not to shoot ammo much older than 100 years old. Much of the old stuff is worth more as a collectable than as ammo. But, to answe your question, if it was stored properly, it'll be good until your great, great, great grandchildern decide to use it.

[MrMarz408]

If this ammo was stampped with TW which is a U.S military stamp how old do you think it could be?

[smle-man]

They sound like reloads to me. I wouldn't shoot them.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

If this ammo was stampped with TW which is a U.S military stamp how old do you think it could be?

The brass was made in 1972. But I'm pretty sure the Twin Cities Army Ammunition Plant wasn't making any soft tip ammo. Like smle-man says, they sound like reloads. There is no way to tell when they were reloaded, who reloaded them, or the skill level of the reloader.

[BillCA]

Your odds are good. It's only 38 years old. Hell, I've fired reloads that old with no issues. Chances are, it'll go boom. If all you get is a *click* then wait at least 10 seconds before ejecting the round in case it's a hangfire. Duds are best put into a hard container (ammo can) so if they do cook off after 30 seconds there is little damage done to people.

Moisture effects will usually show up as discoloration or the creeping green crud (copper corrosion in the brass). Most of the green verdigris can be removed with a cloth. Some use a drop of brasso or similar brass polish. After cleaning inspect the area cleaned - it may be discolored but pressing it should show no signs of flexing or cracking.

Oils/Solvents - yes, these can seep in around the primer pockets to render the primer mix inert. Especially penetrating oils or vaporized oils - such as even gun oil spilled inside a closed ammo box and left to evaporate. If the boxes are oily and/or the cartridges themselves have oil residues around the case head or bullet neck, expect a higher rate of failure (10% or more).

Vibration -

[MrMarz408]

Your odds are good. It's only 38 years old. Hell, I've fired reloads that old with no issues. Chances are, it'll go boom. If all you get is a *click* then wait at least 10 seconds before ejecting the round in case it's a hangfire. Duds are best put into a hard container (ammo can) so if they do cook off after 30 seconds there is little damage done to people.

Moisture effects will usually show up as discoloration or the creeping green crud (copper corrosion in the brass). Most of the green verdigris can be removed with a cloth. Some use a drop of brasso or similar brass polish. After cleaning inspect the area cleaned - it may be discolored but pressing it should show no signs of flexing or cracking.

Oils/Solvents - yes, these can seep in around the primer pockets to render the primer mix inert. Especially penetrating oils or vaporized oils - such as even gun oil spilled inside a closed ammo box and left to evaporate. If the boxes are oily and/or the cartridges themselves have oil residues around the case head or bullet neck, expect a higher rate of failure (10% or more).

Vibration -

Thanks for the info. Very helpful. I'll send a handful off to a friend that does his own reloading to inspect them for me.
There are only about 8 rds that had mildew on them that I wouldn't try. they have a nasty black stain on the brass.
The rest cleaned up fine with a micro-fiber cloth. We'll see what happens tomorrow and I'll post the verdict when I get back from the range.
I'll be at " A Place To Shoot " in north L.A. County with a couple friends if anyone body wants to just show up, shoot, and BS. I drive a black 02 silverado.
Thanks to all for your input.