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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 12-02-2007, 5:21 PM
BobbyQuickdraw BobbyQuickdraw is offline
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Default Fingerprinting for Gun Purchase

Hi, pretty new here, hope this is the right thread.

I just recently moved to CA and have yet to buy a firearm here. At a local gun store (Southern California) I noticed that people buying firearms were required to provide a thumbprint. I think I saw both rifle and pistol buyers provide this.

Is this a requirement by law in the State of California? Does anyone know what section of Law it is required in? Or is this just something that store was doing?

I have no criminal record and am completely a legal gun owner, but I do not want my finger print being filed away in some government database. I'm not a criminal and don't need to be treated like one.

So is this law or just this local place? Anyway around it other than face to face transfers?
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  #2  
Old 12-02-2007, 5:25 PM
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It is part of the DROS requirements. Welcome and I hope you brought the guns you like with you.

Jerry
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  #3  
Old 12-02-2007, 5:39 PM
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FYI: Your thumbprint will be linked to your California drivers licence as well.

I know what you mean though... I hate being treated like a criminal, it's the main reason why I no longer fly.
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  #4  
Old 12-02-2007, 5:54 PM
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Is this a new law for the DROS or is this new... Earlier this year I purchased a rifle in SOCAL and no thumbprint. Last month I purchased another rifle (same store) and I was required to give my thumbprint...
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  #5  
Old 12-02-2007, 7:42 PM
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Welcome to Kalifornia where, according to the people in charge, if you buy a gun, you are a criminal. Pretty damn sad.
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  #6  
Old 12-02-2007, 8:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyQuickdraw View Post
Hi, pretty new here, hope this is the right thread.

I just recently moved to CA and have yet to buy a firearm here. At a local gun store (Southern California) I noticed that people buying firearms were required to provide a thumbprint. I think I saw both rifle and pistol buyers provide this.

Is this a requirement by law in the State of California? Does anyone know what section of Law it is required in? Or is this just something that store was doing?

I have no criminal record and am completely a legal gun owner, but I do not want my finger print being filed away in some government database. I'm not a criminal and don't need to be treated like one.

So is this law or just this local place? Anyway around it other than face to face transfers?
Penal Code Section 12077 requires all FFLs to capture the right thumbprint of the purchaser of ANY firearms sold through that FFL. The only way to avoid it (and the only legal way to conduct a face-to-face paperless gun transaction) is to sell someone a long gun that is over 50 years old. A long gun over 50 years old is considered a Curio & Relic and requires no paperwork for a Private Party Transfer. Every other firearm transaction MUST go through an 01 FFL.
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  #7  
Old 12-02-2007, 9:08 PM
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Thanks for the timely answers. Unfortunately its not what I wanted to hear but it is what I expected.

On the bright side I don't plan on committing any crimes, though I guess the real purpose is just to make confiscation easier some years down the line. = (
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  #8  
Old 12-02-2007, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Salty View Post
FYI: Your thumbprint will be linked to your California drivers licence as well.

I know what you mean though... I hate being treated like a criminal, it's the main reason why I no longer fly.
And here I thought i was the only one who stopped flying because of this.
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  #9  
Old 12-03-2007, 11:23 AM
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So have I, much to the displeasure of my family.
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  #10  
Old 12-03-2007, 11:39 AM
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just burn the prints off with acid later!!
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  #11  
Old 12-03-2007, 7:00 PM
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Instead of burning off your prints, what if you pressed your thumb into something really hard right before doing the print? This would alter your thumb print.

Although this would probably be illegal for some reason or other, maybe perjury?

Thoughts?
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  #12  
Old 12-03-2007, 10:37 PM
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the thumbprint is for definitive positive identification purposes if you are denied for an offense that you said no to on the dros form they are kept in the ffls records and not scanned and databased by the doj

the dealer has to retain them for 3 years

of course who knows what may come

Last edited by bohoki; 12-03-2007 at 10:41 PM..
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  #13  
Old 12-05-2007, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyQuickdraw View Post
I just recently moved to CA and have yet to buy a firearm here. ...

I have no criminal record and am completely a legal gun owner, but I do not want my finger print being filed away in some government database. I'm not a criminal and don't need to be treated like one.
Welcome to California. Now bend over and get used to it.

Forget about buying guns, it sounds like you haven't gotten a CA Driver's license yet:
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/dl/dl_info.htm
That'll take your thumbprint (and SSN).
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  #14  
Old 12-06-2007, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyQuickdraw View Post
Hi, pretty new here, hope this is the right thread.

I just recently moved to CA and have yet to buy a firearm here. At a local gun store (Southern California) I noticed that people buying firearms were required to provide a thumbprint. I think I saw both rifle and pistol buyers provide this.

Is this a requirement by law in the State of California? Does anyone know what section of Law it is required in? Or is this just something that store was doing?

I have no criminal record and am completely a legal gun owner, but I do not want my finger print being filed away in some government database. I'm not a criminal and don't need to be treated like one.

So is this law or just this local place? Anyway around it other than face to face transfers?

Only redneck, white supremacist, murdering psychos own guns, didn't you know that?

Be careful what you post here - it is very well known that agents of the California Bureau of Firearms closely monitor these forums and several post here regularly as well.

Welcome to California.


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  #15  
Old 12-06-2007, 7:26 PM
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The thumbprint stays on the back of the DROS form and doesn't go anywhere. I wouldn't count on it ever getting into a database. It isn't like they are always the best prints anyway. As long as there is some print on there, that is all I care about. They never trained me to take prints.
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  #16  
Old 12-06-2007, 8:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cartman View Post
And here I thought i was the only one who stopped flying because of this.
+1

Nope you aren't.

As I told my representative more than once: "I would rather be killed by a terrorist than be repressed by my own Un-Constitutional government."

Oh, they know me.

Witness the repression inherent in the system! Help! Help! I'm being repressed.

Don't forget to vote for me for President.

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  #17  
Old 12-07-2007, 7:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FortCourageArmory View Post
[...] The only way to avoid it (and the only legal way to conduct a face-to-face paperless gun transaction) is to sell someone a long gun that is over 50 years old. A long gun over 50 years old is considered a Curio & Relic and requires no paperwork for a Private Party Transfer. Every other firearm transaction MUST go through an 01 FFL.
According to the gun guy at Big 5, the law changed in the last couple months and they have to ask all these silly questions about mental illness, violent histories, etc. Instead of being happy after I bought my new rifle I just went home feeling frustrated, annoyed and rectally violated. That's not right...

Last edited by oldrifle; 12-07-2007 at 9:11 PM..
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  #18  
Old 12-07-2007, 9:36 PM
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i always thought the finger print was there to protect the FFL to prove they physically gave the gun to the person...
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  #19  
Old 12-07-2007, 9:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldrifle View Post
According to the gun guy at Big 5, the law changed in the last couple months and they have to ask all these silly questions about mental illness, violent histories, etc. Instead of being happy after I bought my new rifle I just went home feeling frustrated, annoyed and rectally violated. That's not right...
Big 5, being one of those 01 FFLs, has to run all gun transactions....except guns classified as antiques.....through the standard registration process. That means forms, questions, signatures, and even a thumbprint. DOJ and the ATF don't like 01 FFLs doing business any other way. An 01 FFL is someone in the business of making a living as a firearms dealer. That's the big difference between an 03 FFL and an 01 FFL. The 03 is considered a collector and the 01 is in business.

The rules for C&R long guns is still in effect. If you have a long gun over 50 years old and your buddy wants it, all you two have to do is swap the cash, shake hands and part company. No harm, no foul.
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Last edited by FortCourageArmory; 12-07-2007 at 9:57 PM..
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Old 12-07-2007, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by TheDM View Post
Witness the repression inherent in the system! Help! Help! I'm being repressed.


Where is the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch when you need it?
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  #21  
Old 12-09-2007, 12:05 PM
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Where is the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch when you need it?

Right here...
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  #22  
Old 12-09-2007, 5:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyQuickdraw View Post
I guess the real purpose is just to make confiscation easier some years down the line. = (
Bingo.

And, maybe sooner than years.
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