Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > POLITICS, LITIGATION AND ACTIVISM > California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-02-2006, 12:42 PM
slowjonn's Avatar
slowjonn slowjonn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Corona
Posts: 946
iTrader: 41 / 100%
Default Still confused on Dad/ Son transfer

I continue to read various answers to this question and continue to be a little confused.

My dad lives in Arizona. I am obviously here in Cali. If he wants to give me his pistols, what is the best way to do it? I have read at least three different answers to questions like this but am still looking for some more info.

1) Can I go to AZ and bring the pistols back, then fill out the intra-family form with my $19 for DOJ? I've heard both yes and no to this one.

2) Do the pistols have to be on the list? I have heard both yes and no.

3) If the pistols do not have to be on the list, how long would my dad need to own the pistol before giving it to me to avoid a straw purchase issue? If he were to go buy a Kimber Warrior and decide a day later he didn't want it any more, what would prohibite him from giving it to me?

4) On the intra-family form, it asks how possession was obtained. The examples listed (death and taxes) do not meet my situation. What should be put in there if he is just down-sizing his collection due to age, etc?

Anything else I need to know?

Thanks in advance.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-02-2006, 12:57 PM
Mssr. Eleganté's Avatar
Mssr. Eleganté Mssr. Eleganté is offline
Blue Blaze Irregular
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 10,365
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

If your father is still alive, the answers are...

1) No you can't. Federal law requires firearms transfers between unlicensed residents of different states to be done through an FFL.

2) Yes, it must be on the list. (because he will have to ship it to a Dealer in California)

3) N/A

4) N/A

However, Federal law has an exemption to the unlicensed interstate transfer law if the firearm is coming from an estate, that is, if it is willed to you or you inherit it from somebody who has died. If you combine this with California's intra-familial transfer exemption, that makes it legal for you to go out of state to pick up a firearm or have it shipped to you here if both of the following apply...

A) a dead person left it to you (Federal exemption)
B) the dead person is a parent, grandparent, child or spouse (California exemption)

So if an out of state "family" member were to leave you a handgun when they die, then the answers to your four questions would be...

1) Yes
2) No
3) There is no set time for determining if something is a staw purchase, only the original intent of the purchaser matters. But in this case they would have to charge a dead person.
4) This one is easy now
__________________
__________________

"Knowledge is power... For REAL!" - Jack Austin

Last edited by Mssr. Eleganté; 09-02-2006 at 6:27 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-02-2006, 1:34 PM
slowjonn's Avatar
slowjonn slowjonn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Corona
Posts: 946
iTrader: 41 / 100%
Default

Cool...Thanks for the info.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09-02-2006, 5:27 PM
kantstudien's Avatar
kantstudien kantstudien is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: so cal
Posts: 1,753
iTrader: 39 / 100%
Default

You can pick up the pistols from your mother or father if they are out of state. That way, they do not need to be on the list.

If you have them shipped to an FFL because you don't want to drive out there, then they must be on the CA approved list, and they can only be DROSed one per 30 days, and you will be responsible for transfer fees that the FFL will charge you.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-02-2006, 5:45 PM
Mssr. Eleganté's Avatar
Mssr. Eleganté Mssr. Eleganté is offline
Blue Blaze Irregular
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 10,365
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kantstudien
You can pick up the pistols from your mother or father if they are out of state.
But that would be a violation of Federal law. Firearms transfers between unlicensed residents of two different states are requiered to go through an FFL. There is no "family" exemption to this Federal law.
__________________
__________________

"Knowledge is power... For REAL!" - Jack Austin
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-04-2006, 1:02 AM
kantstudien's Avatar
kantstudien kantstudien is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: so cal
Posts: 1,753
iTrader: 39 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amendment II
But that would be a violation of Federal law. Firearms transfers between unlicensed residents of two different states are requiered to go through an FFL. There is no "family" exemption to this Federal law.
Are you sure about this? I am pretty sure a father or mother can "gift" a firearm to their child, even if they are residents of another state, so long as they are not ineligible to own firearms.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-04-2006, 2:16 AM
Mssr. Eleganté's Avatar
Mssr. Eleganté Mssr. Eleganté is offline
Blue Blaze Irregular
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 10,365
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Section 922(a)(5) of the U.S. Code makes it illegal for an unlicensed person to transfer a firearm to another unlicensed person from different state...

Quote:
§ 922. Unlawful acts

a) It shall be unlawful --

(5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes
And Section 922(a)(3) makes it illegal for an unlicensed person to bring in or receive a firearm from out of state if it was acquired from an unlicensed person in another state...

Quote:
922(a) It shall be unlawful --

(3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;
Nowhere in the Federal law is there an exemption for family transfers.
__________________
__________________

"Knowledge is power... For REAL!" - Jack Austin
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-04-2006, 3:04 AM
Drifter721 Drifter721 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 33
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kantstudien
Are you sure about this? I am pretty sure a father or mother can "gift" a firearm to their child, even if they are residents of another state, so long as they are not ineligible to own firearms.

Pretty sure this is the correct answer when receiving from a mother or father as a gift (exemption). Just to be certain, I would call the DOJ and ask.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-04-2006, 7:05 AM
EOD Guy's Avatar
EOD Guy EOD Guy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Concord
Posts: 1,229
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drifter721
Pretty sure this is the correct answer when receiving from a mother or father as a gift (exemption). Just to be certain, I would call the DOJ and ask.
Legal under California law, illegal under Federal law when the parties are residents of different states.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 5:41 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2018, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
Calguns.net and The Calguns Foundation have no affiliation and are in no way related to each other.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.