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Shotgun discussions Trap, Hunting, Defense and more. A place for enthusiasts to discuss the shotgun.

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  #81  
Old 09-23-2020, 9:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Bobby Ricigliano View Post
Good to see this thread still going. I just picked this Ithaca DS from another Calguns member a few weeks ago. I gave it a good cleaning and the action is as slick as snot. I planned on putting wood furniture on it, but the old school Choate stock set is quite sturdy and I may leave it be. The only modification I made was a new Wolff magazine spring.
Nice to see.


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Originally Posted by Killer Bee View Post
very nice! that's one model on my long term list to add to my collection..

I like that synthetic stock that's on there but an OG oiled wood stock would be nice

I seem to recall you having 870 police model(s)? any comments on the comparison?
For wood furniture, get on the wanted section at hoosiergunworks.com.

Just checked and they've got both early and late corncob front wood. $30 for either.
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  #82  
Old 09-23-2020, 9:32 PM
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Originally Posted by dragon7 View Post
No love for the Kel-Tec KSG. I wouldn’t duck hunt with it but as a purely tactical shotgun against upright two legged cretins it is hard to ignore.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAPIfuKdzUE
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  #83  
Old 09-23-2020, 9:34 PM
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Yeah.. that daily star doesn’t pass the sniff test with me. It sounds like something an ad writer would put together. Haha
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  #84  
Old 09-23-2020, 10:45 PM
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It really is personal.

I have many shotguns, but there is this one 'cheapie old 870 Express' that I used for all the classes and qualifications. I ran countless shells on it, and I made a few modifications to fit my needs.

It is like my body's reflex system is hardwired to this 870 Express, I could run it better than any other shotguns I have.

With that being said, it couldn't go too wrong to start with a Remington or Mossberg pump, take some shotgun classes, make a few personal modifications, and go from there.

(My newest shotgun is the TS-12, boy oh boy it is a game changer.... but that is another story.)
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  #85  
Old 09-24-2020, 6:14 AM
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I'd go with what Corporal Hicks uses...
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  #86  
Old 09-24-2020, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Killer Bee View Post
1941 model 11R - making friends in WWII

If only it had had the Two piece Lifter and Speed Feed feature like this one.



The earlier A5's and Rem 11's, Savages, etc all had to be turned upside down and the bolt release held so the lifter was released, which allowed he lifter to be depressed so that you could load the gun.

In 1963 that all changed with the introduction of the "Two Piece Lifter," which made the gun think that if there was a round in the magazine and the bolt was open that it should immediately feed that round into the chamber and make ready to fire. So stuffing a round into an empty magazine resulted in a ready to fire weapon.

This made the A5 the fastest single loading shotgun there is, which translates to being able to keep the gun running in a fight. Mine is 7+1 and it just as easily could have been 9+1 as Briley makes many Mag Extensions for this gun.

Now Competition guns have loading ports Modified to allow multi round insertions which the A5 will do, but not as well. However these guns will probably not see the Battlefield unless it is a "Local Battlefield" and thus not enter into this conversation.

Probably the most overlooked SA Shotgun out there and "Arguably" the best ever made. New guns are not really an improvement over this one, they are just different. JMB figured this out 120+ years ago. It is a Mechanical Marvel as were most of his designs, and the proof of that is how many of his designs are still in use. There are literally dozens!

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  #87  
Old 09-24-2020, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by naz View Post
Scotts, how have the AR parts lead times been for you? It has taken forever for some companies to ship me their supposedly in stock receivers.

I’ve had the easiest time finding bird shot. Way easier than 9mm Luger and 223. Not sure if everyone is ok using bird for HD but you can get flats of the stuff for reasonable pre covid prices
I've not bought any lowers for a long time, but the uppers shipped fine. Most of the other parts shipped pretty fast.

It seems like shipping has been reasonable. I already had a lot of parts. Most of the stuff I buy now are small parts, couple of receiver extensions, bolt cam pins, ejectors, ejector springs, ejector retaining pins, firing pins, firing pin retaining pins, gas rings, extractors, extractor springs and pins, some ambi safeties, castle nuts, receiver end plates/w QD, extra detents, LPKs, extra complete bolts, Geissele trigger springs and pins, Etc.

I just went from butt-stock to muzzle and bought replacement parts for just about everything for multiple rifles. Even gas tubes. About the only thing I haven't bought spares for are the gas blocks and I should probably buy those so I can build complete if I need to.

Bought some replacement tools too.

Bird shot's not good for defense, but you could buy some BB's and replace some of the bird shot. That might help up close.

I've seen the Demolition Ranch put melted wax into bird shot, makes a nasty slug.

Last edited by ScottsBad; 09-24-2020 at 3:38 PM..
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  #88  
Old 09-24-2020, 4:03 PM
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In case anyone is interested, here are the simple pump shotguns I have for home defense, the Browning now has a Nordic Components tube extension on it. I've got some A5s, but I keep them as hunting guns.

Browning BPS High Capacity (they only made these for a short time.)

Browning BPS High Cap.jpg

Ithaca "Police"

Ithaca Police.jpg

High Standard "Riot"

High Standard Riot 4.jpg

Last edited by ScottsBad; 09-24-2020 at 9:30 PM..
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  #89  
Old 09-24-2020, 5:11 PM
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Bought my Mossberg 500 pump over 25 years ago. Never had a single issue with it. Works every time.
While it is not the fanciest gun, there are all kinds of aftermarket parts available.
I replaced the front sight with a fiber optic, the safety with a oversized safety, and the stock with a ATI pistol grip stock.
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  #90  
Old 09-24-2020, 9:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucky Scott View Post
Bought my Mossberg 500 pump over 25 years ago. Never had a single issue with it. Works every time.
While it is not the fanciest gun, there are all kinds of aftermarket parts available.
I replaced the front sight with a fiber optic, the safety with a oversized safety, and the stock with a ATI pistol grip stock.
Don't need fancy shotgun, especially for HD.
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  #91  
Old 09-24-2020, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ScottsBad View Post
I've not bought any lowers for a long time, but the uppers shipped fine. Most of the other parts shipped pretty fast.

It seems like shipping has been reasonable. I already had a lot of parts. Most of the stuff I buy now are small parts, couple of receiver extensions, bolt cam pins, ejectors, ejector springs, ejector retaining pins, firing pins, firing pin retaining pins, gas rings, extractors, extractor springs and pins, some ambi safeties, castle nuts, receiver end plates/w QD, extra detents, LPKs, extra complete bolts, Geissele trigger springs and pins, Etc.

I just went from butt-stock to muzzle and bought replacement parts for just about everything for multiple rifles. Even gas tubes. About the only thing I haven't bought spares for are the gas blocks and I should probably buy those so I can build complete if I need to.

Bought some replacement tools too.

Bird shot's not good for defense, but you could buy some BB's and replace some of the bird shot. That might help up close.

I've seen the Demolition Ranch put melted wax into bird shot, makes a nasty slug.
It’s been a mixed bag for me. “Mil spec commodity” parts like lpk, gas tubes, etc shipped super fast. But some more niche parts like carbon fiber fiber handguarda and light weight receivers are taking forever.

Interesting tip on the wax. Thanks I’ll look that up.
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  #92  
Old 09-25-2020, 10:38 AM
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Bobby: This is your gun with Wood Furniture.



Needs a decent Recoil Pad, but that's all.Randy
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  #93  
Old 09-25-2020, 5:43 PM
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Here is a sleeper - browning A5 with speed loader
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  #94  
Old 09-25-2020, 6:18 PM
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Let's not forget that a cutdown A5 was the choice of famous Texas lawman Lone Wolf McQuade!





-- Michael
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  #95  
Old 09-25-2020, 7:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkrj View Post
When I looked at the Mossbergs, they felt / looked a bit rough around the edges. The Remington and Benelli felt better made. Are Mossbergs similar in quality to Remington?
They are indeed similar. The Mossberg 500, in the 7+1 configuration, is a good choice. So is the Mossberg 590. So is the Remington 870. Regarding the 870, Remington has sold well in excess of 10 million of them. I don't know how many Mossberg has sold, but I get the impression that it's a whole lot. My experience in this regard is with the Mossberg 500 and Remington 870, and I wouldn't turn either one down.

Note: the Mossberg 500's tubular magazine is not extendable the way that the 590, and Rem 870, are. That's why if you do go with the 500, I suggest the 7+1 version.

Another pretty good one is Hatsan's Escort shotgun. This is Hatsan's clone of the Remington 870. I've spent some quality time with one of these, too, and it works well, at a very reasonable price.

Now, for the "tactical" part. There are several things to consider. Two of them stick out in my mind as the "big ones".

1.) Barrel should be the shortest legal length, which I believe is 18". This is for manoeuverability.
2.) You, the owner, need to practice with it at the range. The inexpensive birdshot from Walmart is fine for this.
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  #96  
Old 09-25-2020, 11:27 PM
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Except it appears after my trip to Walmart in Ventura today that they have stopped selling ALL Ammunition and gun related support stuff.

Not only did they Stop they completely removed the entire group of Shelves on the aisle where the stuff was located!

So no more cheap ammo from Walmart. They didn't have any Gatorade either!

Randy
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  #97  
Old 09-26-2020, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by 559BearDown View Post
Mossberg 590A1
This. Though I have 500.

Remington is out of business and quality has suffered. Though if you get an older gun, it should be good.
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  #98  
Old 09-26-2020, 4:03 PM
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Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
Except it appears after my trip to Walmart in Ventura today that they have stopped selling ALL Ammunition and gun related support stuff.

Not only did they Stop they completely removed the entire group of Shelves on the aisle where the stuff was located!

So no more cheap ammo from Walmart. They didn't have any Gatorade either!

Randy
Damn. Do they at least still sell those 90packs of biodegradable clays for $8?
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  #99  
Old 09-26-2020, 5:20 PM
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Perfectly happy with the Beretta 1301
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  #100  
Old 09-28-2020, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by naz View Post
Damn. Do they at least still sell those 90packs of biodegradable clays for $8?
Yes they were there until they are gone. No more after that.

I have no reason to go there anymore. We still go to the Walmart Grocery Store but the Main Store has nothing else that we need.

It's a shame they cow towed to the left. I talked to 15 people who had gone in to check ammo and everyone was pissed. Not a good Marketing Strategy for overall sales, because people who come in to buy ammo also buy other stuff while they are there. If you don't go in the store you don't buy SQUAT!

Randy
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  #101  
Old 09-29-2020, 10:12 AM
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Yeah, that is unfortunate. Out here in VA, they still sell not just ammo, but also guns. The shelves are kinda bare right now, which I guess is to be expected during these difficult times.

You have a point about ammo, though. I used to go into Walmart to look for reasonably priced 9mm handgun ammo. They generally always had it. But when that stopped, that took away probably the major reason I had for going into a Walmart. The only other reason is motor oil, as they really do have the best prices locally to me. But they've gotten less business from me as a result. Their store is still packed full of people, though, so apparently we gun owners don't matter enough to their bottom line in some places (e. g. parts of California).

The point about practicing with birdshot at ranges of, say, 10 yards is still sound, though. Does Big 5 Sporting Goods carry shotgun ammo? If so, then maybe there's another pretty decent ammo source. Our version, Dick's Sporting Goods, does.
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  #102  
Old 09-29-2020, 12:53 PM
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They still are the biggest retailer on the planet and have some really smart people on their payroll. They definitely had more than 1 meeting to discuss dropping ammo sales form certain locations. Some might not like it but it's done and business is still booming.
The loss for them to go with it is probably comparable with successful LGS eliminating couple of flashlights and hats from their inventory..
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  #103  
Old 09-29-2020, 1:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Vytis View Post
They still are the biggest retailer on the planet and have some really smart people on their payroll. They definitely had more than 1 meeting to discuss dropping ammo sales form certain locations. Some might not like it but it's done and business is still booming.
The loss for them to go with it is probably comparable with successful LGS eliminating couple of flashlights and hats from their inventory..
but what is the gain?
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  #104  
Old 09-29-2020, 1:09 PM
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Imho it goes like this: "Look, we might be profiteering from mostly selling cheapo stuff that mas manufactured using practices resembling slave labor in certain parts of the world and we might be paying our staff miserably low wages (outside of our corporate office, that is). But look, we are done with ammo sales, so we are not crooks"
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  #105  
Old 09-29-2020, 1:26 PM
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Originally Posted by elSquid View Post
Let's not forget that a cutdown A5 was the choice of famous Texas lawman Lone Wolf McQuade!





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I'd really like to make one of these. That would require a stamp and another State unfortunately. But sooooo cool.
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  #106  
Old 09-29-2020, 5:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
If only it had had the Two piece Lifter and Speed Feed feature like this one.



The earlier A5's and Rem 11's, Savages, etc all had to be turned upside down and the bolt release held so the lifter was released, which allowed he lifter to be depressed so that you could load the gun.

In 1963 that all changed with the introduction of the "Two Piece Lifter," which made the gun think that if there was a round in the magazine and the bolt was open that it should immediately feed that round into the chamber and make ready to fire. So stuffing a round into an empty magazine resulted in a ready to fire weapon.

This made the A5 the fastest single loading shotgun there is, which translates to being able to keep the gun running in a fight. Mine is 7+1 and it just as easily could have been 9+1 as Briley makes many Mag Extensions for this gun.

Randy
Have to agree. Browning A5 models have the magazine lock out feature that the similar model Remington Model 11 and its clone Savage 720 shotgun never got, but that's a meh. On the other hand, the two piece carrier/lifter of the later old model A5 (also missing in the Model 11 and 720) is a great tactical advantage, allowing quick reloading without screwing around.

Wolf McQuade aside, the ultimate A5 tactical shotgun is arguably the FN Police Model item (not marked Browning anywhere) that was (likely smuggled in and) used in Rhodesia in the '60s. There are probably fewer than seven hundred of these currently running about, the Sophia Loren of the mid twentieth century tactical shotguns.

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  #107  
Old 09-29-2020, 7:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitesse et de la Masse View Post


I'd go with what Corporal Hicks uses...
Outstanding reference! I’ve thought that to myself numerous times.

Any idea what it was?
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  #108  
Old 09-30-2020, 9:30 AM
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I'm a huge fan of the Mossberg 500 pump. It's reliable and shoots great. Plus, the ability to outfit it with minishells makes it even more fun. But that's just me. I'm also a fan of the Remington 870. Speaking of... Wonder how the whole division of Remington's gonna end up?
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  #109  
Old 10-04-2020, 5:39 AM
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The Black Aces Tactical Bullpup Pump is a great Tactical Shotgun Option .They are compact and magazine fed and come in a variety of colors .




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