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  #1  
Old 11-19-2023, 7:08 PM
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Default Guessing a fake marked Mauser 98K - BYF 42

Trying to see if I can pick out a fake marked Mauser 98K at auction

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1018647312

Supposedly an all-matching 1942 BYF example - but the buttplate is for those kreigsmodel late war Mausers. Looks reblued/buffed and renumbered too - but I am no expert.

What do you guys think? Since crap mausers are going for 800+, I guess the current price is not outrageous.

The auction seller - says he thinks it may be real, which makes me have no respect for him.
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  #2  
Old 11-19-2023, 11:54 PM
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Someone borrow the stamps from Mitchells???
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  #3  
Old 11-20-2023, 1:58 AM
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Probably a Mitchells that has been cleaned up. If it sells for the current bid, I don't think it's a terrible deal for a shooter.
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  #4  
Old 11-20-2023, 3:15 AM
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Sanded stock and super clear stamps on the stock. the Stamps were obviously done after the sanding. Even if those were original stamps they never remain that clear on a laminate stock. And yeah bluing does not look original at all.
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  #5  
Old 11-20-2023, 7:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Mrmauserjerry View Post
Sanded stock and super clear stamps on the stock. the Stamps were obviously done after the sanding. Even if those were original stamps they never remain that clear on a laminate stock. And yeah bluing does not look original at all.

As above. The wood has been sanded and tge markings redone (faked) the front sight hood is a replica. The one trigger guard screw appears to have the last two of the SN stamped into it. AFAIK K-98's of that time period never had SN's stamped into the action screws.

Faked, as many today are.
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Old 11-20-2023, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by SVT-40 View Post
As above. The wood has been sanded and tge markings redone (faked) the front sight hood is a replica. The one trigger guard screw appears to have the last two of the SN stamped into it. AFAIK K-98's of that time period never had SN's stamped into the action screws.



Faked, as many today are.
Agreed. The one screw has two other numbers and the front band they didn't even try real hard. Just stamped over what was there. The extractor has a different number. Bolt isn't even shown. Rifle is a mess. Have to love the last line that it's a nice one for the serious collector

Last edited by capt14k; 11-20-2023 at 10:21 AM..
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  #7  
Old 11-20-2023, 9:09 AM
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So, my question is - Considering Russian capture mix-masters are going for almost that much, what is it worth?
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  #8  
Old 11-20-2023, 1:55 PM
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So, my question is - Considering Russian capture mix-masters are going for almost that much, what is it worth?
Well, most collectors wouldn't touch it because it's been faked. So value would be extremely variable.

I have no idea about value.
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Old 11-20-2023, 1:52 PM
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The below two pic's show what unsanded laminated WWII German K98K stocks should look like. You can clearly see each layer of wood and it's individual grain structure. You can also see how in the stampings how the fine bits of the wood are exposed as well as the rough edges.

If you don't see the individual layers of laminate in the bottom and top of the stock, it's been sanded. There could be some smoothing of the layers due to handling, but overall the layers will be visible.


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  #10  
Old 11-20-2023, 2:34 PM
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Ouch!! Not even close to original.

I literally LOL'd at this line:

Quote:
My opinion is this is a survivor with no import marks.
Ahhhhahaha!! I've got to remember that one when I list some of mine
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  #11  
Old 11-20-2023, 3:16 PM
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For a collector to have a blatant fake in their collection, it is like a neon sign shouting "Idiot" - whenever anyone notices it.

I recall the big stink caused when several German WWII sniper rifles in the book - Backbone of the Wehrmacht - Sniper Variations - were called out as fakes. Very angry people - were aroused.

I have that blonde all matching sniper G43 that is in the first edition of Hitler's Garands - pretty sure it has been mucked with - but still collectible to me - but probably not to hardcore collectors - it is not in the 2nd edition of the book - I was told a prior owner who provided a number of examples in the first edition - would not contribute unless that sniper was put in the book.

Any example is worth whatever anyone will pay for it. Be sure that if it gets stolen or lost in a fire, the insurance company will lowball you.
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  #12  
Old 11-20-2023, 6:40 PM
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Look at the bolt face photo. Looks like some major primer leakage / cutting / erosion on the bolt face. That bolt had to have been shot a lot.
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  #13  
Old 11-20-2023, 7:14 PM
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In addition to the stock being sanded, refinished, and cartouches restamped - look at several areas of the wood that are detiorated or darkened in areas where it meets metal fittings.

That's a sure sign the original metal fiitings were corroded and darkened the wood in those areas, where now the metal and its finish in those areas look freshly made.

Lots of other signs and issues sending a clear message it's little better than a Mitchell's or historical tribute replica.

As for the seller, benfit of the doubt warrants they they may be naive or ignorant, which would be OK if they would admit that and simply say 'we don't know and are not claiming it's original, citing the obvious, and 'please look closely at photos'.

But to coyly imply it might be real because of loose intrepretation of association like the 'survivor' comment, seems to be a dishonest tatic alone to don it a GI bring-back, where that's just open ended '...well, it could be" garbage with no supporting evidence otherwise. Crap like that irks me. Just be honest about it.

Just unethical to play on the inexperience of dreamers with 'could be' insinuation.

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  #14  
Old 11-20-2023, 7:31 PM
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I'd pay $400 for it as a shooter with no collector value whatsoever.
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Old 11-20-2023, 7:45 PM
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I'd pay $400 for it as a shooter with no collector value whatsoever.
That would be a fair price as it's the equivalent of a mediocre/no provenance average sporter.

It's nice looking shooter, great for applying the imagination toward experiential fun of shooting a fine collectible in it's original configuration, without shooting a fine collectible that would be 10 times that price.

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If some level of government had that information, what would they do with it? How would having that info benefit public safety? How would it benefit law enforcement?
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  #16  
Old 11-20-2023, 7:52 PM
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That "M" on the stock, is the Navy marking for the Kriegsmarine - if real, a real boost to collector value.

Haven't seen the bids on that rifle rise since I posted this. I hope the high bidder has been notified it is a fraud.
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  #17  
Old 11-20-2023, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Rogerbutthead View Post
That "M" on the stock, is the Navy marking for the Kriegsmarine - if real, a real boost to collector value.

Haven't seen the bids on that rifle rise since I posted this. I hope the high bidder has been notified it is a fraud.
Yikes... currently at $800 - 5 days to go.

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If some level of government had that information, what would they do with it? How would having that info benefit public safety? How would it benefit law enforcement?
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  #18  
Old 11-21-2023, 6:33 AM
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The pitting on the bolt handle with bluing over top meh one way to tell
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  #19  
Old 11-21-2023, 3:42 PM
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The stamp set bubba used to fake some of the numbers is in a different font than the originals on the rest of the rifle. It's especially noticeable on the barrel where for some reason Bubba decided to restamp the SN.

Compare those numbers to the originals on the receiver.

Easy give away.

It appears the front band, bolt and stock also had their numbers faked.

Also look at the primer erosion on the bolt face. That's a LOT of erosion from a lot of shooting, but the bolt face is still blued. A dead giveaway that at least the bolt has been refinished.
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  #20  
Old 12-01-2023, 9:38 AM
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If the wear on the stamps isn’t uniform, and there is one stamp that looks super crisp (when all the others are worn) or even one stamp that looks worn (as all the others were restamped) it’s a fake.

The 2nd picture showing the stock stamps immediately sent me red flags. It’s faked at worst. At best it’s been bubbad by restamping the original markings.

Most of the time it’s not collectors buying these. It’s people who like to think of themselves as collectors. In reality they just buy the story and assume the story teller is being honest and they are getting a deal.
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  #21  
Old 12-01-2023, 9:54 AM
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SOLD!!

For $2,025

Wow

ETA: There's even an over stamp on the first digit on the barrel band, haha!!

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Last edited by joefrank64k; 12-01-2023 at 11:20 AM..
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  #22  
Old 12-04-2023, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by joefrank64k View Post
SOLD!!

For $2,025

Wow

ETA: There's even an over stamp on the first digit on the barrel band, haha!!

I?m sure the seller will tell the buyer or the buyer will tell people, ?towards the end of the war, the Germans were reusing perfectly good parts from damaged rifles to build new rifles so the stamp is correct?


However I think this seals the deal, it’s a faked rifle.
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