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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here.

View Poll Results: What are your feelings about Front Sight?
Great Training for Beginners Only. 88 8.33%
Great Training Beginner and Advanced. 696 65.85%
The Quality of Training is Going Down Hill. 24 2.27%
I paid too much for my Membership! 47 4.45%
They will go out of business this year! 31 2.93%
Don't want anything to do with them! 171 16.18%
Voters: 1057. You may not vote on this poll

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  #10721  
Old 04-28-2019, 8:59 PM
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Anyone selling Front Sight PRESIDENT Lifetime Memberships?

PM me.

I swear I exchanged a couple of PMs and emails with someone here about this 18 months ago, but I can't find anything in my PMs or personal email.

Thanks
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  #10722  
Old 04-28-2019, 9:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post
Teriyaki sandwich, anyone? How about Mabo-Tofu? Okinawan Taco Rice? Osaka-style pancake "Okonomiyaki"...? Japanese lunches are way healthier than the Western counterparts...
I'm in! I lived in Osaka for 2 years. I would add some Katsudon, Karage Obento, Curry Rice and some Gyoza to the menu. Good stuff
Maybe some Ramen or Udon for the cold days.
  #10723  
Old 04-28-2019, 9:40 PM
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Maybe do something like:
Sig Sauer Spagetti
Mossberg Meatloaf
FN French Fries
Remington Ravioli
M&P Mac & Cheese
Benelli BBQ
Ruger Roast Chicken
Springfield Salad
Beretta Burger
Browning Backed Beans
Glock Grilled Cheese
  #10724  
Old 04-29-2019, 6:11 AM
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Don't forget CzhlebÃ*čky75


and Guláš SP-01



.
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  #10725  
Old 04-29-2019, 6:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cali-Glock View Post
Anyone selling Front Sight PRESIDENT Lifetime Memberships?

PM me.

I swear I exchanged a couple of PMs and emails with someone here about this 18 months ago, but I can't find anything in my PMs or personal email.

Thanks
That could have been LCU1670. He has or had one available.


.
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  #10726  
Old 04-29-2019, 6:53 AM
NorthBay Shooter NorthBay Shooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damon1272 View Post
OV
The one thing that sped me up considerably is speeding up my off hand to my mid section.
Just concentrate on a smooth draw for the first two days. After a few hundred draws you can and will be able to speed up considerably.
one of the keys to a fast draw is to make sure you are indexed the same every time. Your arms should be starting from the same place. See if you can find some index point on your arm where it is touching the butt of the gun or belt. Same for your support arm. Also, rather than having your support hand flat and slapping your body, try to slightly cup your hand so it naturally fits into the grip as the hands come together. Also, have your support hand hit higher on your body so when the hands come together you don't have to raise them that much. Finally, you should be looking at a specific point on the target so when the gun comes up and you start to see your sights they will already be in alignment. As soon as the sights meet your eyes you can press the shot. These are all little things and only worth about a 10th of a second each, but they add up.
  #10727  
Old 04-29-2019, 6:54 AM
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Selling President's, must have missed the email from Iggy advising of them. Can someone give me more details?
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  #10728  
Old 04-29-2019, 7:07 PM
TooFewPews TooFewPews is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post

I will not go into further discourse on FS and the legitimacy of their lessons. IMHO as a nobody - I see the significance of finger on the trigger as part of the drill, then, making the intellectual decision to make the shot or not.


That said, I would think that the Range Master did say that if you have any comment/feedback on FS' lessons you could communicate it to their admin that, they, if upon further study could incorporate into their curriculum.

To reiterate, their range/school, their rules. The moment you step out of FS, you can go ahead with using your way. I know, I do, too, myself...

Thinking/recalling about it... Yeah, even if they did emphasize a lot of the finger on the trigger in the drills and during practice, they were really never that picky in the tests.

_
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi54 View Post
sorry just now getting caught up on the recent conversations.

Malfunctions: correct, Front Sight teaches that you finish 'on target, on trigger', that doesn't necessarily mean you take all the slack out (although experienced shooters will automatically do that as soon as they're on trigger)
If the Instructors docked you for that, it wasn't at the behest of the RM as the Instructors are assigned students to grade and seldom do they get directions from the RM. IF anything, the RM's are usually more lenient, especially when it comes to being late during a 4 day. They'll give you the benefit of the doubt if it's close.
Sorry you got docked for it, it sucks to miss out on a certain score due to malfunctions but the worst I saw was guy who shot 38 down on the Combat Master test and then missed a malfunction!
no combat master for him.
The next couple times he took the test he wasn't even close to the required score of 40. It's a mental game at that level.

Don't let it keep you down, you obviously can shoot so next time I'd suggest taking a skill builder and I'm sure you'll do well.
sorry for the late replies. i appreciate the feedback from you guys. i was traveling a bunch after FS and just landed in HI (home) last night. i'll post a pic of my 4DDHG skills test target below.


our Instructors/RMs for the 4DDHG class were:

A. Dury (all 4 days)
G. Brooks (all 4 days)
B. Crisafulli (1st and 2nd day only)
P. McNulty (1st and 2nd day only)
N. Tillotson (sp?) (3rd and 4th day only)
J. Jackson (3rd and 4th day only)


my dropped shots on the designated headshot were all my fault. in the previous 3 days i was pretty consistently hitting the ocular cavity (maybe 80-90% landing within the box), but, for some reason, i was pulling it low on the test. i was easily within the time and i didn't feel rushed at all on my draw.

throughout the class i was pretty consistently within the time limit for the type III malfunctions--usually hovering around 4.5-5 seconds without pushing it too hard. this was the thing i probably practiced the most before the trip using the Dry Practice iPhone app and setting the par time to around 5 seconds or less. J. Jackson was the person grading me for the skills test and she seemed like she was really by-the-book. in the end, i know it isn't her fault and i am really the only one to blame.


Last edited by TooFewPews; 04-29-2019 at 7:12 PM..
  #10729  
Old 04-29-2019, 7:50 PM
dscoduc dscoduc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
sorry for the late replies. i appreciate the feedback from you guys. i was traveling a bunch after FS and just landed in HI (home) last night. i'll post a pic of my 4DDHG skills test target below.


our Instructors/RMs for the 4DDHG class were:

A. Dury (all 4 days)
G. Brooks (all 4 days)
B. Crisafulli (1st and 2nd day only)
P. McNulty (1st and 2nd day only)
N. Tillotson (sp?) (3rd and 4th day only)
J. Jackson (3rd and 4th day only)


my dropped shots on the designated headshot were all my fault. in the previous 3 days i was pretty consistently hitting the ocular cavity (maybe 80-90% landing within the box), but, for some reason, i was pulling it low on the test. i was easily within the time and i didn't feel rushed at all on my draw.

throughout the class i was pretty consistently within the time limit for the type III malfunctions--usually hovering around 4.5-5 seconds without pushing it too hard. this was the thing i probably practiced the most before the trip using the Dry Practice iPhone app and setting the par time to around 5 seconds or less. J. Jackson was the person grading me for the skills test and she seemed like she was really by-the-book. in the end, i know it isn't her fault and i am really the only one to blame.

From the picture I would suggest you were not looking hard enough at your front sight...
  #10730  
Old 04-29-2019, 8:04 PM
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Front Sight my first day...

You may recall there was some discussion as to whether or not my CZ Shadow 2 would pass inspection.

The inspector removed it from my holster did a press check to make sure no round in the chamber said nice gun and put it back in my holster and that was it.

We probably didn't get as much shooting in as most first day classes due to rain thunderstorms and lightning. Every time they heard thunder they made us go inside we did that three or four times. And it was cold, we are supposed to have better weather tomorrow hopefully.

As everyone has mentioned the instructors are awesome actually everyone there is pretty awesome.

Looking forward to tomorrow...
  #10731  
Old 04-29-2019, 9:01 PM
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rodralig rodralig is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldveteran View Post
You may recall there was some discussion as to whether or not my CZ Shadow 2 would pass inspection.

The inspector removed it from my holster did a press check to make sure no round in the chamber said nice gun and put it back in my holster and that was it.
Sweet!!!

Beanz2 - you can now bring your S2!?!


Quote:
We probably didn't get as much shooting in as most first day classes due to rain thunderstorms and lightning.
You won't get too much shooting anyway day #1. Here was my round count (Glock 19 Gen 3 stock): 55, 163, 267 and 228.


Quote:
As everyone has mentioned the instructors are awesome actually everyone there is pretty awesome.
They are!!!

_
  #10732  
Old 04-29-2019, 9:03 PM
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First day is always slow. They will ramp up tomorrow to get back on schedule. I have yet to meet staff that was not top notch.
  #10733  
Old 04-29-2019, 9:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
...but, for some reason, i was pulling it low on the test.
It happens... Even top shooters like Larry Vickers showed signs of "El Snatcho" by their second day of shooting, ie., trigger control is a very perishable skill. Especially under stress, fatigue, repetition, etc.

Just come back again in the Skill Builder, lots more shooting in the desert!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by dscoduc View Post
From the picture I would suggest you were not looking hard enough at your front sight...
Actually, there could be several others reasons (aside from only focussing on the front sight). As the "Great One" (Rob Leatham) once said, "... aiming is meaningless" (until you get good trigger control).
(*) Warning: It was a "clickbait" by Funker Tactical, just to drive the point.



And also reiterated by instructors like Larry Vickers and JJ Racaza in their classes...


Cheers,


_
  #10734  
Old 04-29-2019, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldveteran View Post
Front Sight my first day...

You may recall there was some discussion as to whether or not my CZ Shadow 2 would pass inspection.

The inspector removed it from my holster did a press check to make sure no round in the chamber said nice gun and put it back in my holster and that was it.

...
You lucked out. I’d say most will pass it, but sometimes you get a blowhard who pulls out a trigger scale. Then you had to take it to the gunsmith who’s just as hard nosed and tells you your gun is unsafe, go rent one of our Glocks

Once I was in the armorer’s shop and in walked a guy with an AR that an inspector just failed also for a light trigger. He said “Hey, you guys last time adjusted it” and “the adjustment must have slipped”. The armorer took in to the back and in less than 10 seconds brought it back and charged the guy $10 for “adjustments”. Really? What is adjustable in an AR trigger? I’m pretty good at swapping AR triggers, but I don’t think I can put a different spring in less than 10 seconds in a fully assembled AR.

They also failed my wife’s SP-01 Shadow (of course it had a light trigger, it’s Cajunized LOL). I was in a rifle class so she let the instructor took it to the armorer, who said the trigger can’t be made heavier and he had already wrote down her serial number so she can’t ever be found in a FS class with that gun. Really? Well, do they think we only have one gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post
Sweet!!!

Beanz2 - you can now bring your S2!?!

_
I have been taking it. They get to inspect my box stock bedside gun, that’s all


.
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Last edited by beanz2; 04-29-2019 at 11:41 PM..
  #10735  
Old 04-30-2019, 3:28 AM
TooFewPews TooFewPews is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dscoduc View Post
From the picture I would suggest you were not looking hard enough at your front sight...
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post
It happens... Even top shooters like Larry Vickers showed signs of "El Snatcho" by their second day of shooting, ie., trigger control is a very perishable skill. Especially under stress, fatigue, repetition, etc.

Just come back again in the Skill Builder, lots more shooting in the desert!!!




Actually, there could be several others reasons (aside from only focussing on the front sight). As the "Great One" (Rob Leatham) once said, "... aiming is meaningless" (until you get good trigger control).
(*) Warning: It was a "clickbait" by Funker Tactical, just to drive the point.

And also reiterated by instructors like Larry Vickers and JJ Racaza in their classes...


Cheers,


_
Actually, I was using a Sig P320 RX (w/ Romeo 1) so I wasn’t focusing on the front sight at all. The problem that I was running into was the vertical parallax error in the red dot sight at the varying distances. I had sighted my red dot in at 7 meters before the class, but I started to notice a shift in POI depending on position of the red dot within the window during presentation. For the most part, I kept my red dot centered in the window for most of the class. As I got more fatigued, I noticed that the red dot started to creep further down in the window until it was almost lollipopping my front sight, hence the low POI on most of my shots. I think the root cause is my tendency to present the pistol at front-rear sight alignment plane rather than on the red dot plane. At least I know what happens when I push myself past my physical limits.

I’m really considering getting a private membership so I take the skills test without having to go through all of the class days again.
  #10736  
Old 04-30-2019, 4:56 AM
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To get over that, I put a suppressor front sight on, and practice quickly putting the red dot on the FS, lollipop, seems to hold well at all distances.
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  #10737  
Old 04-30-2019, 5:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
That could have been LCU1670. He has or had one available.


.

I do have 12 BUT I am saving them for the timeshare final payments. When the timeshares are done, you can trade them in for final payments. That make them worth $1590.00 each. So they are probably way to expensive for someone to purchase from me, unless the want to pay me $1590.00.

I have a few private training certificates left, these are one time use only. 1+1 is $200, and 1+4 is $300 each.

It's harder to find FS stuff now as a lot of FS accounts were traded-changed into CO-OP points. Wife and I did it, but I put some items aside in each of our accounts before the trade in case someone here needed certificates or COMMANDER memberships. Also put some gun rentals, hotel, and 2-4 training certificates aside, and donated a bunch to my local police department.
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  #10738  
Old 04-30-2019, 6:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
Actually, I was using a Sig P320 RX (w/ Romeo 1) so I wasn’t focusing on the front sight at all. The problem that I was running into was the vertical parallax error in the red dot sight at the varying distances. I had sighted my red dot in at 7 meters before the class, but I started to notice a shift in POI depending on position of the red dot within the window during presentation. For the most part, I kept my red dot centered in the window for most of the class. As I got more fatigued, I noticed that the red dot started to creep further down in the window until it was almost lollipopping my front sight, hence the low POI on most of my shots. I think the root cause is my tendency to present the pistol at front-rear sight alignment plane rather than on the red dot plane. At least I know what happens when I push myself past my physical limits.



I’m really considering getting a private membership so I take the skills test without having to go through all of the class days again.
That is interesting - I wondered if it really mattered where the dot was in the window. It appears to make a difference.

I tried to use a RMR configuration but couldn't deal with the dot moving - unlike Iron Sights, the red dot always has a little chatter; at least for me it did...
  #10739  
Old 04-30-2019, 6:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
To get over that, I put a suppressor front sight on, and practice quickly putting the red dot on the FS, lollipop, seems to hold well at all distances.
That's interesting. With my setup I found the surpresor sights were slightly high and lining up the red dot on the tip of the fro t post caused my shots to be high as well...
  #10740  
Old 04-30-2019, 6:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
I do have 12 BUT I am saving them for the timeshare final payments.
Is available President memberships list on your assets page at MyFS? Looking for any information.
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  #10741  
Old 04-30-2019, 7:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Divehobo View Post
Is available President memberships list on your assets page at MyFS? Looking for any information.
Yes they are.
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  #10742  
Old 04-30-2019, 7:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dscoduc View Post
That's interesting. With my setup I found the surpresor sights were slightly high and lining up the red dot on the tip of the fro t post caused my shots to be high as well...
I have a Burris fastfire 2, and was able to adjust the dot on the sight to correct possition.
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  #10743  
Old 04-30-2019, 7:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamAllen View Post
I'm in! I lived in Osaka for 2 years. I would add some Katsudon, Karage Obento, Curry Rice and some Gyoza to the menu. Good stuff
Maybe some Ramen or Udon for the cold days.
Oh yeah!!! The typical home-made "sarariman" lunch! *Yum*




Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamAllen View Post
Maybe do something like:
Quote:
Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
Don't forget CzhlebÃ*čky75

and Guláš SP-01
Eh, CZ fanboism showing?

That said, we're having a menu rolling...


Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFewPews View Post
I’m really considering getting a private membership so I take the skills test without having to go through all of the class days again.
Why not also drop in a few $$$ to get a better optic? The Romeo, though coming from Sig, is not one of better optics out there...

There are reasons why RMR and DPP are priced as such... I was able to get a DPP 2.5MOA last month for $325 all inclusive.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
To get over that, I put a suppressor front sight on, and practice quickly putting the red dot on the FS, lollipop, seems to hold well at all distances.
I only recently got in to Carry Optics with the Q5 Match. Once I mounted the DPP, iron sights for co-witness are useless (or nonexistent). Unless, of course, I drop more $$$ or so for the rear sight accessory AND a ridiculously TALL front sight.

I zero at 25-yards, and it is quite POA=POI at most distances throughout using 115GR factory ammo. The bigger lens of the DPP provides a wider field of view.

Almost ZERO transition issues from iron sights (and coming from a Glock platform).


Quote:
Originally Posted by LCU1670 View Post
That make them worth $1590.00 each. So they are probably way to expensive for someone to purchase from me, unless the want to pay me $1590.00.
Dang! I should have gotten one from you. I purchased a President membership last January/February straight from Iggy at $1,995.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dscoduc View Post
I tried to use a RMR configuration but couldn't deal with the dot moving - unlike Iron Sights, the red dot always has a little chatter; at least for me it did...
Even my DPP, too, "dances" a bit. But after a few strings of fire, I got used to it... I find I am faster and more accurate with optics now...


_
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  #10744  
Old 04-30-2019, 9:31 AM
dscoduc dscoduc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post

Even my DPP, too, "dances" a bit. But after a few strings of fire, I got used to it... I find I am faster and more accurate with optics now...



_
I'm curious about your thoughts regarding training with a red dot equipped pistol and then having to rely on iron sights if the battery runs out, or the battery contact fails, or you are forced to use a backup pistol without a red dot...

I have nothing against red dots, just curious if those concerns have crossed your mind.
  #10745  
Old 04-30-2019, 10:09 AM
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Like any tool or device, things can and do break. I try to practice my skills on similar platforms both with and without optics.....and to be completely honest with you it's a lot of fun to try to learn and master different things.
  #10746  
Old 04-30-2019, 10:40 AM
TooFewPews TooFewPews is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post
Why not also drop in a few $$$ to get a better optic? The Romeo, though coming from Sig, is not one of better optics out there...

There are reasons why RMR and DPP are priced as such... I was able to get a DPP 2.5MOA last month for $325 all inclusive.


I only recently got in to Carry Optics with the Q5 Match. Once I mounted the DPP, iron sights for co-witness are useless (or nonexistent). Unless, of course, I drop more $$$ or so for the rear sight accessory AND a ridiculously TALL front sight.

I zero at 25-yards, and it is quite POA=POI at most distances throughout using 115GR factory ammo. The bigger lens of the DPP provides a wider field of view.

Almost ZERO transition issues from iron sights (and coming from a Glock platform).


Even my DPP, too, "dances" a bit. But after a few strings of fire, I got used to it... I find I am faster and more accurate with optics now...


_
i took the class with my best friend. I was hoping that she and i would DG. however, she needed a little more assistance than i did so i let her use my VP9 tactical slide/barrel. her only pistol is a VP9 (which is a hand-me-down that i sold to her) so she's extremely comfortable with shooting and manipulating it. my VP9 slide was milled for a RMR/Holosun HS507c. although i probably would have done better with the VP9/Holosun, i figured that she should have it for the class and i just use the Sig.

except for the "procedural error" of not putting the finger on the trigger at the conclusion of the Type I, II, and III (the Instructor/RM docked points from both of us for that same "procedural error"), we ended up with similar scores for the shooting portion. i think she was just 1 or 2 shots down from me (-3 or -6) on the shooting portion of the test, but she was pretty consistently and timely landing all shots within the OC and TC during days 1, 2, and 3. it's been 5 days since we left FS and she is still complaining about her hands being sore and swollen from shooting in both relays. i know that, if she and i were shooting the test fresh, then we would probably DG.

i agree that the Romeo 1 is kind of garbage, but it was one of the few pistols available from the factory with a red dot at the time i bought it.

we usually zero our pistol red dots at 25 yards (non-cowitness zero), but we switched to a 7 meter zero based on the typical FS shooting distances.

both the VP9 tactical and my Sig P320 RX came from the factory with suppressor height night sights.

Last edited by TooFewPews; 04-30-2019 at 11:15 AM..
  #10747  
Old 04-30-2019, 11:10 AM
dscoduc dscoduc is offline
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Originally Posted by mtenenhaus View Post
Like any tool or device, things can and do break. I try to practice my skills on similar platforms both with and without optics.....and to be completely honest with you it's a lot of fun to try to learn and master different things.
Awesome, thanks. For sure it is fun learning different things. I wish the red dot would have worked out for me but unfortunately I'm sticking with iron sights...
  #10748  
Old 04-30-2019, 11:55 AM
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rodralig rodralig is offline
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Originally Posted by dscoduc View Post
I'm curious about your thoughts regarding training with a red dot equipped pistol and then having to rely on iron sights if the battery runs out, or the battery contact fails, or you are forced to use a backup pistol without a red dot...
Yes, those thoughts have indeed crossed my mind and was actually worried at first. But then, as the past weeks have shown - this will not be a problem.

I have always trained in iron sights, and only transitioned to Carry Optics a few weeks back. And this was with a pistol with ergonomics, etc. that I am completely unfamiliar with (Walther VS Glock). My initial concern was, like everyone said, finding the dot.

However, and fortunately for me, there wasn't much of a transition. I never had any problem finding the dot. When I presented the pistol, the dot was just right there...! As in I don't need to align my sights, it's already aligned and all I need to do is verify that alignment.

Hhhhmmm... How could I explain this... All I could say is that maybe my training with iron sights was a huge factor to me quickly adjusting to carry optics, such, this becomes something I need not worry about. There isn't anything really different, at least for me, between the two.

Such, even if I have a carry optic pistol - my training routine will still be with iron sights.


I actually started a separate thread of me first getting the Q5, then, everyone else suggesting that I should get into carry optics. So, when I got the DPP and having zeroed it at 25-yards, I immediately (as in no dry practice, no getting used to the new gear, etc.) took it to a match with surprising results:

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...9&postcount=38

Cheers,

_

Last edited by rodralig; 05-01-2019 at 7:08 AM..
  #10749  
Old 05-01-2019, 4:07 PM
mej16489 mej16489 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodralig View Post
I have always trained in iron sights, and only transitioned to Carry Optics a few weeks back. And this was with a pistol with ergonomics, etc. that I am completely unfamiliar with (Walther VS Glock). My initial concern was, like everyone said, finding the dot.

However, and fortunately for me, there wasn't much of a transition. I never had any problem finding the dot. When I presented the pistol, the dot was just right there...! As in I don't need to align my sights, it's already aligned and all I need to do is verify that alignment.

Hhhhmmm... How could I explain this... All I could say is that maybe my training with iron sights was a huge factor to me quickly adjusting to carry optics, such, this becomes something I need not worry about. There isn't anything really different, at least for me, between the two.
I've been saying this for many years - anyone who has trouble finding the dot isn't doesn't have a proper presentation in the first place (even for irons)

I saw some complaints in the last few pages about things like 'modified weaver', trigger trapping and low ready. Please understand that these sorts of thing are invaluable for getting a new shooter up to speed quickly and successfully; but most importantly safely. All of these things go out the window beyond the basic courses.

Similarly, none of them matter in the basic courses for experienced shooters within some respectful guidelines. For the most part they are simply the starting point for later classes.

I dry practice the HCM test about a dozen times a week - I reflexively go into a Sul-style after action drill without thinking about it. That's the only thing I can think of that is prohibited in the basic courses.
  #10750  
Old 05-02-2019, 8:35 PM
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Took 4DDHG test in the blowing rain on Monday.
Boy is the "pro shop" an embarrassment.
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  #10751  
Old 05-02-2019, 9:01 PM
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I'm headed there in three weeks for the Handgun Skillbuilder. As mentioned in the previous post, I've heard the Pro Shop is hurtin' for certain.

I'll be staying at the Saddle West Hotel. Can't beat their powdered egg and SOS breakfast. LOL. For those who haven't been, the Maverick gas station on the right as you leave town has a pretty decent cup of coffee in the morning.

I'll be ramping up my dry practice the next day or two.


If anybody else is going, give me a shout.
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  #10752  
Old 05-02-2019, 9:06 PM
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Originally Posted by VolvoWrench View Post
Took 4DDHG test in the blowing rain on Monday.
Boy is the "pro shop" an embarrassment.
If you don't mind, I would be curious what exactly you saw in there. I have not been in a while, but one of the complaints that I made when I talked to staff about converting credits over to the Patriot points or whatever they are called was the lack of what's available in the pro-shop and how it was that I would be able to spend $1 million credits if I had no plans of buying ownership.

Just curious as to what was available to purchase.
  #10753  
Old 05-02-2019, 9:25 PM
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Targets and the odd holsters.
  #10754  
Old 05-02-2019, 9:39 PM
TooFewPews TooFewPews is offline
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I scanned the Thoracic Cavity into a PDF in case any of you wanted to hang something up on your wall or print it and take it to the range for life fire practice.

make sure that you set your printer to 100% scale. there will be some overlap for the TC, but that was intentional due to the print margins of a lot of printers. use the numbers at the top and bottom to line up the left and right sides.



To print the full TC on one piece of paper, make sure that you are using an 11x17" tabloid size paper.

TC - for printing on Tabloid (11x17”) paper
https://drive.google.com/file/d/18QH...ew?usp=sharing



For those of you that are printing on normal 8.5x11" paper, here is the two-piece TC for printing on the standard 8.5x11" paper.

TC - Left Side
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nLo...ew?usp=sharing

TC - Right Side
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qCU...ew?usp=sharing



unless you really want me to, i do not have plans to scan a headbox since it is a standard rectangle.

i hope you guys find this helpful.

EDIT: I figured that it would be easier if i just uploaded it to Google Drive. use the links to download it from there.

Last edited by TooFewPews; 05-02-2019 at 9:58 PM..
  #10755  
Old 05-02-2019, 9:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beanz2 View Post
You lucked out. I’d say most will pass it, but sometimes you get a blowhard who pulls out a trigger scale.
Maybe so but if so I will take it... This is from their website and a stock Shadow 2's DA trigger is way in excess of their requirements. This is from their website as posted earlier... I took a copy with me just in case I got some flack...

https://www.frontsight.com/firearms-...g/handguns.asp
  #10756  
Old 05-03-2019, 12:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Cali-Glock View Post
Anyone selling Front Sight PRESIDENT Lifetime Memberships?

PM me.

I swear I exchanged a couple of PMs and emails with someone here about this 18 months ago, but I can't find anything in my PMs or personal email.

Thanks
Not sure if you got what you need but the President membership is still being offered according to this active link. https://www.frontsight.com/customprivatetraining/
  #10757  
Old 05-03-2019, 4:36 AM
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I am have been a Front Sight Member since like 2009 with various levels of Membership.

I can't remember all of them but Guardian with Honors, Ambassador, Commander, Heritage and who know what others.

It's interesting on the Patronage Points deal - I did the Doubling Conversion First then I did the 10x Conversion.

So now I have a zillion points and what will that get me - I am not sure when we get a piece of the property and what the total point score will be with 220,000 Members.

I have like 5 of the Villas waiting to be built. So hopefully within the next 18 months or sooner they will be done.

Just want to know what level everyone is and how many points they were offered and/or converted.
  #10758  
Old 05-03-2019, 8:38 AM
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I know what I'm about to say isn't going to be popular, as many here also have zillions of patron points and "assets"... I don't think you're going to get back what you think you will. There are a few historical data points to suggest this. The progression of the utility of credits for example. The member base is now completely saturated with them. A micro-example is the decision to strip the Pro Shop down to where now you can't purchase anything of real value. That was deliberate. No promises broken there, you're still able to use credits at the shop, they just don't stock anything useful you can use them on. When demand (credits) is too high, reduce supply (goods to purchase). If that decision wasn't made, the Pro Shop would be bleeding real dollars VERY quick.

I see no credible way a resort/villas/hotel/whatever can be built while still honestly honoring the zillions of patron points to be used on them. The resort would be filled to capacity with point users and operating at a loss for many years. Unless, the next slight of hand is implemented.

I know we don't like to talk about these things as new meat feeds the machine. Just my opinion. Maybe I'm wrong.
  #10759  
Old 05-03-2019, 9:01 AM
SG29736 SG29736 is online now
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In the example of members having massive amounts of credits/ziggy bucks or whatever you call them, when you had an existing pro shop with merchandise. Then you entice members to increase their credits and after the fact strip the pro shop of desirable merchandise, you can look at it as "not a promise broken" if you choose. It's just a continual con job being supported willfully supported by many here.
  #10760  
Old 05-03-2019, 9:20 AM
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AAShooter AAShooter is offline
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Originally Posted by SG29736 View Post
In the example of members having massive amounts of credits/ziggy bucks or whatever you call them, when you had an existing pro shop with merchandise. Then you entice members to increase their credits and after the fact strip the pro shop of desirable merchandise, you can look at it as "not a promise broken" if you choose. It's just a continual con job being supported willfully supported by many here.
Certainly one way to look at it. I never looked for any return on my investment other than firearms training. ANYTHING else I view as an unexpected dividend. This included the resort, pro shop, ammo discounts, etc., etc., etc..

This helps keep me sane about this adventure.
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