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  #3161  
Old 11-07-2019, 8:16 PM
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OC Gun Owners? NO THANKS! They spread so much misinformation and pushing anti-gun agenda during freedom week.
My focus is on liberalizing CCWs in CA. I can't keep up with all the other BS Sacto pushes.

Since this is a CCW subforum and SD Co Gun Owners got Gore to liberalize issuance, they seem like a good group to me. It operates politically at the county level, not up in Sacto. My guess is the other anti crap from Sacto will have to be handled judicially in the federal courts. Those are two different battlefields....
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  #3162  
Old 11-07-2019, 9:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
My focus is on liberalizing CCWs in CA. I can't keep up with all the other BS Sacto pushes.

Since this is a CCW subforum and SD Co Gun Owners got Gore to liberalize issuance, they seem like a good group to me. It operates politically at the county level, not up in Sacto. My guess is the other anti crap from Sacto will have to be handled judicially in the federal courts. Those are two different battlefields....
Well pushing for CCW at the county level is useless because as soon as a new sheriff gets elected you're at their mercy all over again. It needs to be changed at the state level from may issue to shall issue.
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  #3163  
Old 11-07-2019, 9:34 PM
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It needs to be changed at the state level from may issue to shall issue.
Yeah... not gonna happen anytime soon.
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  #3164  
Old 11-07-2019, 9:44 PM
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Well pushing for CCW at the county level is useless because as soon as a new sheriff gets elected you're at their mercy all over again. It needs to be changed at the state level from may issue to shall issue.






IIRC (I've got the CA DOJ BoF stats stashed away somewhere...), between the late '70s and until ~2005, we averaged between 40 and 65,000 CA CCWs. We're now at ~120,000! ETA: link to current CCW stats: https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local...232198382.html

Not one CA county that has liberalized issuance ever gone back to restrictive. The only "exception" was OC when Hutchens took over. But that wasn't a change in policy as much as ferreting out corruption. After a couple of years, she liberalized issuance again and for awhile after our 3-judge panel win in Peruta actually accepted SD = GC. Then she backed off that (due more to a better understanding of the law than a change of heart), and required more than just "self defense"/"personal protection" and evidence of such.

Napa Co and SLO Co flip back and forth between yellow and light green but that's a reflection of the feedback we get and the crude reverse engineering we do to determine a sheriff's GC policy, rather than an actual change in that policy.

Among the changes to the next version of the map (due out before Jan 01), are Yolo going to light green, Sonoma to dark green and Napa back to yellow.

Sometime in the next 6 months there might be slight improvements in two other SFBA counties, but it would be premature to say more. (ETA: 1 county's change would be because of an improvement in their GC policy, the other county's change would be because of us reappraising their current GC policy.)

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Last edited by Paladin; 11-08-2019 at 7:12 PM..
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  #3165  
Old 11-07-2019, 9:45 PM
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Yeah... not gonna happen anytime soon.
Might be sooner than you think depending upon NYSRPA case. SCOTUS oral arguments are Dec 02.
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  #3166  
Old 11-07-2019, 9:48 PM
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Might be sooner than you think depending upon NYSRPA case. SCOTUS oral arguments are Dec 02.
True. But even then, SCOTUS may tread lightly and only deal with transport or locale. Who knows .
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  #3167  
Old 11-07-2019, 10:41 PM
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True. But even then, SCOTUS may tread lightly and only deal with transport or locale. Who knows .
Yep, and that's exactly why I still spend time and effort on pushing at the county level, doing what I can when I can and where I can, whether it's helping the general public by working with baggss in making the map as accurate as possible, or helping people applying (whether it be encouraging them or discouraging them according to their GC vis-a-vis their sheriff's GC policy), or helping those who are trying to get their sheriffs to liberalize issuance.

That first map shows the status of the counties after we won Heller. If we had stopped fighting then, there'd still be only 40 - 65,000 CCWs in CA and less than 1/2 our population could get one.

For those who don't know, San Diego Co Sheriff Gore liberalized his GC policy just over 2 years ago and in that time has increased the number of CCWs he's issued from 300 - 400 to 3,225 currently (https://www.sdsheriff.net/licensing/ccw.html). A 10x increase in 2 years and he's getting ready to switch to online apps to speed things up and to increase those numbers even more. Again, that was not because of a win in federal courts or a political win in Sacto. It was "boots on the ground" in San Diego Co!
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Last edited by Paladin; 11-08-2019 at 10:13 AM..
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  #3168  
Old 11-07-2019, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post


http://baggss.us/2009.png

http://www.baggss.us/CACCWCounties.png

IIRC (I've got the CA DOJ BoF stats stashed away somewhere...), between the late '70s and until ~2005, we averaged between 40 and 65,000 CA CCWs. We're now at ~120,000!

Not one CA county that has liberalized issuance ever gone back to restrictive. The only "exception" was OC when Hutchens took over. But that wasn't a change in policy as much as ferreting out corruption. After a couple of years, she liberalized issuance again and for awhile after our 3-judge panel win in Peruta actually accepted SD = GC. Then she backed off that (due more to a better understanding of the law than a change of heart), and required more than just "self defense"/"personal protection" and evidence of such.

Napa Co and SLO Co flip back and forth between yellow and light green but that's a reflection of the feedback we get and the crude reverse engineering we do to determine a sheriff's GC policy, rather than an actual change in that policy.

Among the changes to the next version of the map (due out before Jan 01), are Yolo going to light green, Sonoma to dark green and Napa back to yellow.

Sometime in the next 6 months there might be slight improvements in two other SFBA counties, but it would be premature to say more. (ETA: 1 county's change would be because of an improvement in their GC policy, the other county's change would be because of us reappraising their current GC policy.)

Paladin, hasn't OC gotten a touch more restrictive since Barnes took over? I've seen horror stories (and some in this thread) of people who had provided substantial GC statements for the original issuance, and who were then denied their renewals for using the same GC statements.
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  #3169  
Old 11-08-2019, 1:10 PM
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Paladin, hasn't OC gotten a touch more restrictive since Barnes took over? I've seen horror stories (and some in this thread) of people who had provided substantial GC statements for the original issuance, and who were then denied their renewals for using the same GC statements.
Posts for 2019 Jan 01 and following -- when the new sheriff took office -- start on p. 71 of this thread -- 9 pages of posts ago. If you could direct us to some of the posts you refer to, that would be much appreciated.

We, baggss and myself, depend on CGNers getting in touch with us re. the current status of issuance in their county. baggss even has his email address on the bottom right corner of the map so anyone who sees it and sees a mistake can contact him. If a county "goes south," and nobody tells us, we won't know about it.

This is another reminder of why joining county level organizations like Orange County Gun Owners PAC is so important -- no one cares about protecting your 2nd A gun rights in OC as much as you do (or ought to).
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Last edited by Paladin; 11-08-2019 at 1:12 PM..
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  #3170  
Old 11-11-2019, 5:56 PM
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Question about CCW firearms:

Seems like off-roster guns are ok. Modifications such as sights, stippling are ok. Slide cuts, milling for a red dot and anything trigger related is not ok.

What about modular platforms such as Sig P320 or Sig P365? Can you swap out different OEM grip modules, OEM slides, etc.? The firearm part is the Fire Control Unit (FCU) but otherwise the other parts are compatible, easily sourced from Sig, and are designed to be mixed and matched.

A looser Glock analogy would be swapping out grips and slides for the 43, 43X and 48.

Who makes the decision if this is a go or no go?

Thanks in advance.


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  #3171  
Old 11-20-2019, 3:21 PM
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Well, I screwed up, my permit expires 12/9. I just sent in my renewal. Lets see how this plays out.
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