CCW Insurance comparison chart

[awiner]

Originally Posted by steelholder

Any opinions on having to pay back fees if you lose with ccw safe vs uscca

CCWSAFE states, “NO REIMBURSEMENT AND NO RECOUPMENT NO MATTER THE OUTCOME!”

[NorCalBusa]

Nice chart, good comparison. What's missing is "how do things go when you have a claim"? Are they attentive? Understand your issue? Explain things to you understandably? Respond promptly? Those kind of things are what matters- a lower rate is easy if they score poorly on performance.

[Maxa1]

^^ Those points and how often do these cases occur?

California is a castle doctrine with an implied stand your ground ability, i.e. no duty to retreat. How often do cops really determine that a homeowner shooting a burglar/home invader wasn't justified?

[antonio]

https://concealedcarrysociety.com/in...NWWX&fs=e&s=cl

[calnaguard]

With Firearms legal protection you get to attend the ASP online content for free

[CAGLS]

Originally Posted by Danodog

This code still works. I just bought my Ultimate membership tonight.

LOSD10 code has expired. Anyone have another coupon code?


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[vipertom1970]

With CCW SAFE plan , is the best plan the best for my situation? wife & I are both retired, I am a CCW holder but wife is not a CCW holder.

I like the best plan not based on cost.

[CAGLS]

Originally Posted by vipertom1970

With CCW SAFE plan , is the best plan the best for my situation? wife & I are both retired, I am a CCW holder but wife is not a CCW holder.

I like the best plan not based on cost.

Same with me, my wife is adamantly anti gun so she will never be a ccw holder or even use one of my firearms in a defensive situation at home. I signed up for the Ultimate plan with CCW Safe which covers her using one of my firearms if she decided to or even with a defensive weapon of opportunity in a home defense situation. She gets the same legal defense and is covered under my policy.

https://youtu.be/iXu4vBc-EVk

[vipertom1970]

Originally Posted by CAGLS

Same with me, my wife is adamantly anti gun so she will never be a ccw holder or even use one of my firearms in a defensive situation at home. I signed up for the Ultimate plan with CCW Safe which covers her using one of my firearms if she decided to or even with a defensive weapon of opportunity in a home defense situation. She gets the same legal defense and is covered under my policy.

https://youtu.be/iXu4vBc-EVk

thank you for responding, did you do add-ons for Civil Liability for your wife ?

[1911-CV]

LOSD should work. Only valid on annual plans.

Originally Posted by CAGLS

LOSD10 code has expired. Anyone have another coupon code?


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[Bbonez]

Today I used code SSGT and got $25 off an ACLDN year membership, took the price down to $110 for the 1st year and renewals are $95 without a promo code.

[roc_my_tims]

Tag

[mustangsixtwoseven_five]

Interesting 3 pages. Anyone have any updates regarding CCW Safe vs USCCA?
Thanks in advance

[Chewy65]

Promises, promises. Having some protection is a good idea, but not so much if the promise is less than certain to be there when needed. This is one reason it is VERY important whether or not you are purchasing actual insurance. Why?

In California a company cannot sell insurance unless they are approved by the Deprtment of Insurance and one thing the department does it it requires that an insurer meeets certain financial standards aimed at guaranteeing that the company is financially able to pay claims that arise (At least this is the case with general an motor vehicle liability policies.) In case a particular insurer becomes insolvent, calims are paid to an extent by an entity that all insurers pay into.

But what if you merely pay a fee to become a member of a group and the group's obligations to the members are "insurance backed"? I don't know the answer, but I am uneasy with it. Anytime some smart guy thinks they can circumvent law, your spidy senses should be tingling, and the general rule is that California forbids insuring intentional acts.

[CSACANNONEER]

I happened on US LAw Shield's booth at SHOT this year. They immediately told me to google "USCCA Lawsuit". When I told them I use CCW Safe, they literally had nothing to say except trying to get me to convert. Now, I tell all my CCW students that when making a decision on self defense "insurance" to google "whatever company lawsuit" before finalizing their decision.

If you decide on CCW Safe, please use my affiliate member's link in my sig line.

[Chewy65]

Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER

I happened on US LAw Shield's booth at SHOT this year. They immediately told me to google "USCCA Lawsuit". When I told them I use CCW Safe, they literally had nothing to say except trying to get me to convert. Now, I tell all my CCW students that when making a decision on self defense "insurance" to google "whatever company lawsuit: before finalizing their decision.

If you decide on CCW Safe, please use my affiliate member's link in my sig line.

Very interesting post of yours. Googling got me to this video by Andrew Baranca. Only the first third is on point. I once new a bit of California insurance law, but almost all of that concerned CGL, Automotive, and Personal Liability Policies. Nothing like here, but back in the day, an insurer rarely, if ever, refused to defend an insured faced with a civil suit without first seeking a court judgment confirming that they did not owe a duty of defense to the insured. I am not saying that they could not refuse to provide a defense, but to do so was very risky to do so without first getting a declaratory judgment of no coverage.

Here, Baranca makes an excellent point regarding the outcome of the civil judgment of no coverage. The judgment was based on the guilty verdict first rendered in state criminal court. The Federal Court found, assumedly based on principles of res judicate and collateral estoppel, that the state court verdict precluded any other finding in civil court. That sounds good, but Baranca raises a question. Had USCCA not stopped paying its insured's attorney's fees and defense costs would she have been found not guilty?

[CAGLS]

Originally Posted by mustangsixtwoseven_five

Interesting 3 pages. Anyone have any updates regarding CCW Safe vs USCCA?
Thanks in advance

If you research ccw legal protection CCW SAFE is a no brainer. They pay up front with no litigation cost recovery, pay for bail, have a critical response team that flys out to the scene of the incident to gather evidence in your defense, covers expert witnesses. They successfully defended a member charged with murder with his case costing into several hundred thousand dollars all covered. He only paid his monthly dues. Your choice of attorney specializing in ccw legal defense in your area as well as an in house attorney that will fly out to your court hearings. First day I carried I made sure to get the Ultimate plan for $45 per month. Well worth the cost of your freedom.


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[riderr]

Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER

I happened on US LAw Shield's booth at SHOT this year. They immediately told me to google "USCCA Lawsuit". When I told them I use CCW Safe, they literally had nothing to say except trying to get me to convert. Now, I tell all my CCW students that when making a decision on self defense "insurance" to google "whatever company lawsuit" before finalizing their decision.

If you decide on CCW Safe, please use my affiliate member's link in my sig line.

To be brutally honest, CCW Safe wouldn't provide the coverage either
Giles shot her ex-husband. It's clearly excluded on CCW Safe T&C

https://ccwsafe.com/terms-conditions/
Restrictions, Limitations, Notices and Exclusions

DOMESTIC RELATIONSHIPS: CCW Safe will not provide the services for any domestic violence incident, criminal investigation, or prosecution arising from a use of force incident involving you and a current or former member of the household, including, but not limited to, a spouse, former spouse, adult or minor child, or involving those in a current or former dating relationship as defined in applicable state law.

[riderr]

Originally Posted by mustangsixtwoseven_five

Interesting 3 pages. Anyone have any updates regarding CCW Safe vs USCCA?
Thanks in advance

In short, USCCA has a better civil liability coverage and training materials, but they still will send you the bill, if you are found guilty, e.g. imperfect self-defense. Obviously, they won't cover the appeal.

[Chewy65]

Originally Posted by riderr

In short, USCCA has a better civil liability coverage and training materials, but they still will send you the bill, if you are found guilty, e.g. imperfect self-defense. Obviously, they won't cover the appeal.

Why won't the cover the appeal? Is that spelled out in the agreement? I don't know that a guilty judgment is final if an appeal is timely taken. Just asking, since I was not a criminal attorney.

[otteray]

I went with 'Right to Bear'; quite good coverage plan for $129/year. I contacted them for the agreement and it appears to cover all the bases at a reasonable cost. Extra $35 for bail bond or out of state coverage.

[JohnCCW]

I have CCW Safe Ultimate plan. I think it is well worth it.

[smogcity]

Originally Posted by riderr

To be brutally honest, CCW Safe wouldn't provide the coverage either
Giles shot her ex-husband. It's clearly excluded on CCW Safe T&C

https://ccwsafe.com/terms-conditions/
Restrictions, Limitations, Notices and Exclusions

DOMESTIC RELATIONSHIPS: CCW Safe will not provide the services for any domestic violence incident, criminal investigation, or prosecution arising from a use of force incident involving you and a current or former member of the household, including, but not limited to, a spouse, former spouse, adult or minor child, or involving those in a current or former dating relationship as defined in applicable state law.

I just listened to one of the latest CCWSafe podcasts and they described the recent changes they have made to their policies and the stated they removed the "domestic violence" exclusion referred to above. It it's a legal shoot regardless of familial relationship, it's a legal shoot that they will cover

[Vinnie Boombatz]

So is the census here that CCW Safe is the best way to go for CCW insurance?

I was about to go with USCCA and just didnt have that warm, fuzzy feeling. Plus, they are hounding the crap out of me with multiple emails a day which I’m not particularly a fan of (maybe I’m experiencing PTSD from the onslaught of Front Sight emails from Dr. Pizza begging for money for a new Bentley multiple times a day).

[Oneaudiopro]

Originally Posted by ACfixer

I agree CCW Safe and USCCA seem to be the best choices bases on that chart. If you have assets, then I think you have to nut up and get USCCA for the civil liability coverage.

I had an interesting chat with a customer of mine who is a State Farm agent, he said they offer CCW coverage... haven't got into detail yet what that actually means as I have AAA and not State Farm on my property.

State Farm does NOT offer ccw coverage. The only coverage they offer is for an accident, NOT for an intentional act, ie shooting someone. Hope that helps.

[awiner]

Originally Posted by Oneaudiopro

State Farm does NOT offer ccw coverage. The only coverage they offer is for an accident, NOT for an intentional act, ie shooting someone. Hope that helps.

My guess is what his agent was referring to is an umbrella policy which could benefit someone in a civil matter if damages but certainly not In a criminal matter.

[MudCamper]

Originally Posted by Vinnie Boombatz

So is the census here that CCW Safe is the best way to go for CCW insurance?

I was about to go with USCCA and just didnt have that warm, fuzzy feeling. Plus, they are hounding the crap out of me with multiple emails a day which I’m not particularly a fan of (maybe I’m experiencing PTSD from the onslaught of Front Sight emails from Dr. Pizza begging for money for a new Bentley multiple times a day).

There is no consensus. Go with whichever one you feel most comfortable with.

I too have grown to despise USCCA. I hate their marketing. It's everywhere, and it's annoying.

[pablomarquez]

Originally Posted by riderr

In short, USCCA has a better civil liability coverage and training materials, but they still will send you the bill, if you are found guilty, e.g. imperfect self-defense. Obviously, they won't cover the appeal.

This is because it is against the law to insure an illegal act, you were found guilty of and illegal act.
Besides, I do not think that has ever happened.

[MrBones]

You're quite right in that companies won't or can't insure illegal acts but I believe the subtlety here is USCCA will want to recoup already expended legal cost if a guilty verdict is returned. CCW Safe, for example says they will not demand return of legal expenses if guilty.
I just cancelled my USCCA membership that renewed in February and went with CCW Safe for this reason.

[Vinnie Boombatz]

Pick up my CCW in a couple days and pretty sure I will go with CCW Safe.

Does anyone have any information or opinions of the Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network (ACLDN)?

[32spoke]

Originally Posted by Vinnie Boombatz

Pick up my CCW in a couple days and pretty sure I will go with CCW Safe.

I have my pickup next week, after reviewing the options, CCW safe is the way to go for me. I own two businesses with inventory/assets.. it makes the most sense, and I hope I never need to use their service.
I contacted CCW safe and asked a question after I cut and pasted a portion of their small print. They clarified what it meant and explained it so I could understand.. in this case, they offer coverage but not when at work and the general liability insurance covers ?work? except my general liability insurer doesn?t offer any CCW coverage for an owner.. so I asked how do I get coverage. They were prompt and kind. They explained that I was reading their policy for LEO.. so the CCW safe policy for those in law enforcement, only provides coverage when off duty.

[DolphinFan]

There is no such product in the insurance industry for CCW insurance.
CCWSafe is not insurance.
A homeowner umbrella liability policy MAY reimburse you for your defense IF you are not found guilty of a crime.

[riderr]

Originally Posted by pablomarquez

This is because it is against the law to insure an illegal act, you were found guilty of and illegal act.
Besides, I do not think that has ever happened.

If you T-boned another car and found guilty, you committed an illegal act (infraction or misdemeanor). Yet, the insurance will cover your civil liability.
If you go rob a bank, use your car as a getaway, get in a high-speed chase with the cops, refuse to stop and T-bone another car at the intersection, you will most likely will not be covered by your car insurance.

[32spoke]

Originally Posted by DolphinFan

There is no such product in the insurance industry for CCW insurance.
CCWSafe is not insurance.
A homeowner umbrella liability policy MAY reimburse you for your defense IF you are not found guilty of a crime.

Correct, CCW safe offers up to $2mil in coverage for litigation services.

[Vinnie Boombatz]

Any opinions od the Armed Citizens Legal Defense network (ACLDN)?

[Mute]

Originally Posted by Vinnie Boombatz

Any opinions od the Armed Citizens Legal Defense network (ACLDN)?

They've been around a very long time and have a solid reputation. Also, the legal team they use are very well versed in gun related criminal charges. They're coverage, should criminal and civil action be taken seem to be good, though I think CCW Safe still seem to be the best overall. I would choose ACLDN before USCCA.

[ugimports]

Originally Posted by Vinnie Boombatz

Any opinions od the Armed Citizens Legal Defense network (ACLDN)?

pros:
They have no limit on what they'll cover (I read that somewhere in the past, but couldn't find link on their website)
You choose your lawyer.
They will also fight civil law suits (not settlements)
Their advisory board has:
John Farnam, Massad Ayoob, Tom Givens, Emanuel Kapelsohn, Dennis Tueller, Karl Rehn and Marie D'Amico
As much as you like or dislike any of those folks they are available to your case if using an 'in-network' attorney. I'm assuming for out of network attorneys they could be as well, so not sure why they make that statement.

Con:

This benefit is subject to a review of the facts of the case as known at the time and a determination it was a legitimate act of self defense.

I think the Con is common among all the providers, but ACLDN is very up front about it. For example:

Granting bail assistance is subject to the same requirement as awarding Legal Defense Funds. In other words, there must be sufficient evidence to make a reasonable argument that the use of force incident was self defense. Just as we would not agree to fund the legal defense of someone who actually committed a murder, we would also not assist that person in gaining his or her freedom from jail. We will need to be convinced that your use of force was a self-defense incident.

I'm not sure if the other plans do this pre-funding or post-funding and then expect you to pay back.

[Vinnie Boombatz]

Originally Posted by Mute

They've been around a very long time and have a solid reputation. Also, the legal team they use are very well versed in gun related criminal charges. They're coverage, should criminal and civil action be taken seem to be good, though I think CCW Safe still seem to be the best overall. I would choose ACLDN before USCCA.

Originally Posted by ugimports

pros:
They have no limit on what they'll cover (I read that somewhere in the past, but couldn't find link on their website)
You choose your lawyer.
They will also fight civil law suits (not settlements)
Their advisory board has:
John Farnam, Massad Ayoob, Tom Givens, Emanuel Kapelsohn, Dennis Tueller, Karl Rehn and Marie D'Amico
As much as you like or dislike any of those folks they are available to your case if using an 'in-network' attorney. I'm assuming for out of network attorneys they could be as well, so not sure why they make that statement.

Con:


I think the Con is common among all the providers, but ACLDN is very up front about it. For example:


I'm not sure if the other plans do this pre-funding or post-funding and then expect you to pay back.

Thank you both.

[GetMeCoffee]

This is somewhat old news, but ACLDN (Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network) was targeted by the Washington State Insurance Commissioner back in 2020 and is unable to accept new members in Washington. They are able to renew existing members. They are fighting the OIC: https://armedcitizensnetwork.org/joi...e-commissioner

I'm not aware of them having restrictions anywhere else

[MotoJB]

I appreciate the thread and everyone's input.

Anyone know of an updated discount code for CCW Safe?